Paul Czarnecki

Get that ridiculous snubber off of there. If you think you have to have one get a GOOD one from Dreamweaver.

for some strange reason I never thought about using only 1 motor lol I'm going to try that tonight. I've always set up a dipsy rod with copper line, going to use a white/green spin doctor with a blue and green fly and see how that works out too. Somehow I think that when you switch to trolling on only one motor most of your "problems" will magically disappear..

There is no way a 36 ft. Searay will not be able to get down to 2 - 2 1/2 mph. Are you trolling with both motors? If so you need to shut one off and only troll with one. If you are trolling with one and still can't get below 3.5 you need to tune your motors.

We oughta just declare war on em and send over a troop of Boy Scouts. If we can just keep them out of the Canadian strip clubs long enough it should be easy.

If you troll with your SubTroll speed between 2 and 2 1/4 you will do fine. If you're not catching fish at that speed your problem lies elsewhere. Good luck

Ray...I believe Bob Songin-- Reel Excitement is in third after Day 1. [ Post made via BlackBerry ]

This same incident occurred again today in Whitby. Matt Leclair was questioned for a length of time and,despite having all his paperwork in order, was slapped with a $1000 fine by the Canadian gov. The reason? He did not report to customs BEFORE docking in Canada. Three years ago I was reprimanded by Canadian customs for calling in before I had a dock number to give them. Now you have to pay their $1000 extortion money on the spot or they confiscate your boat. I hope the US gov sorts this mess out soon or I can see the end of American involvement on Canadian tournaments. [ Post made via BlackBerry ]

It was never really a "complaint" Matt. The whole idea has been around for years. It was toyed with several years ago for the Big Boys event in Olcott where a "Grid System" was proposed. It was just an idea brought up again that I thought would make good discussion here.....and it has and I appreciate everyone's input---at least from those that actually fish the events and want to see them continue and prosper.

LOLOL.......no problem Rod. I like your opinions and value our friendship greatly. Unfortunately, what "could" have been a great discussion had to be hijacked, YET AGAIN, by a troll that came out from under his rock. His only intention is to destroy the ProAms so he hijacks every thread about them trying to use them for his own selfish agenda. Oswego must be very proud!

OK.....good responses so far guys but let me clear up a few things..... --First of all this is NOT a Committee Proposal, a Director's Proposal or anything of the sort. This was an IDEA that was presented to ME as a Competitor and it has nothing to do with any committee or Director. I simply threw this poll together after speaking with several competitors over the past week. In fact, I even hesitated for several days because I didn't want everyone to think I was pushing an agenda or had some ulterior motive. AGAIN.....this is an idea for discussion ONLY. --Secondly, the "parameters" or borders of each tournament could be set up as an "area of competition". The areas of competition would be set individually for each tournament according to the "county line" or in Oswego could be set to include any specific area. We already have to record GPS numbers so the system is already in place to enforce it. --Thirdly, this idea was formulated out of discussions about the No Comm agreement where almost everyone in favor of it said it would "level the playing field". IN MY OPINION, everyone having to compete in the same general area is an extension of the "level playing field" ideal. If you were in favor of the NO Comm Agreement because you didn't want to get beat by a "bigger or better network" how can you NOT be in favor of this idea? Why should a bigger (or smaller), faster boat or someone with a bigger wallet have an advantage? A level playing field should be a level playing field in ALL areas. I, personally, would feel MUCH better winning a tournament by beating everyone in ONE SPOT instead of just having a secret spot that gave me an advantage over everyone else. Again.....this poll was put up simply as a discussion point about an issue that has been on several minds for several years. It is NOT a "proposal" or an "agenda" that anyone is trying to push through---I am just looking for ideas and your feelings on the subject. Thanks, Paul

"Run time" is the 15 minutes for Ams and the 30 minutes for Pros that is allowed between when you leave your dock to when you can start fishing.

There has been a lot of discussion after the two West end ProAms about what changes people would like to see in the future tournaments. The success of the new "Gentlemen's Agreement" for No Communication has raised the following question......If the counties are going to host a ProAm should that tournament not be fished in the waters of that county? Much of the talk in recent years has been about "leveling the playing field" with regard to the communication issue. The recent events of Orleans, has no doubt, spawned this most recent cry to "level the playing field" by restricting or eliminating the advantage faster boats (and bigger wallets) have in their ability to run to another county to catch fish. We have seen it done for years and this is in NO WAY a criticism of those that have done it---as it has always been well within the rules to do so. That said, if we are "really" concerned about leveling the playing field, should we not all play on the SAME field?

From an ex-walleye guy....something else to think about...... Walleyes are among the easiest fish in the world to catch. King salmon are among the toughest----in the Great Lakes anyway. They are moody, greatly affected by wind and water movement and can be the pickest eaters in the lake. However, remembering there are no hard and fast rules for salmon fishing, and what I've just told you combined with a LOT of patience should get you going. The value of taking an on the water class with an experienced captain cannot be stated enough. Its a BIG learning curve with kings---taking as much of the curve away as you can will help your success a LOT. Good luck Paul

You're on the right track but learning to think out of the box right from the start will help you tremendously. Don't get so caught up in "perfect temp" or depth or anything. There is no such thing. Fish the fish---wherever they are.

On both the Leviathan and the Fish Hawk,the captains insisted that I witnessed the measuring of the fish caught and asked me to double check,so that seems to be a habit among at least a few of the participants. Cornelis I would like to "think" MOST of the good captains would do that and most "good" observers would be happy to do that as well. The problem lies with the drunken slob that got dragged out of the bar at 3 AM and stuck on a boat and is now passed out. I have actually had to wake a few up to record the catch. Better quality observers that think highly enough of themselves to not get fall down drunk every night is the answer to a LOT of tournament problems. If we chose our observers like we choose our teammates and the observers actually ACTED like the Tournament Officials they are the majority of tournament problems would never happen.

Mike pretty much explained it all Ricky but I will add that we have a LOT of smaller fish out there and they could be part of the problem. When I have trouble hooking fish on the Rockets the hits seem to be from smaller fish. I run ONLY single/treble tandem rigs from Siggs Rigs and have no problem getting a perfect roll with the Rockets. That said, I can't wait for later this summer when I have lots of kings laying on the bottom in 80 fow off the Oak. Rockets ROCK!

From what I could decipher from Ray's response I "think" it was a good one. The ProAm tournaments are a very small part of the annual take of salmon and trout from Lake Ontario. The Niagara (especially) and Orleans tournaments saw some pretty big catches so its understandable for people to feel the way you do. We saw the same response when a similar situation occurred in Niagara a few years ago. However, keep in mind, as Ray said, the tournament minimum size is 3 inches above the state's minimum and the tournament only involves 60 - 80 boats on a particular weekend. In the big picture it is nothing when compared to the entire take lakewide on a daily basis---its just that during a tournament you see it all in one spot.

LMFAO....Matt--when you "hook Rick up" with a set of those fancy chrome bracelets PLEASE take a picture for me.

What rule infraction are you referring to Ray? I didn't hear of anything and thought the Orleans event went off without a hitch? Please explain......by PM if you wish.

Just sign the agreement and you won't have to talk to him. That's how I got out of it!

GREAT post Andy! However, continuing to beat Dave up over it accomplishes nothing as he is but one fourth of the voting body. There is nothing he, as an indvidual, can do---especially since he is just an employee of the County not the Tournament "owner". I have stayed out of these "rants" lately and for good reason. Like Andy and Glen, I just love to compete and don't care about the format. I might like some better than others but my love for competiton outweighs my "preference" for certain rules. Here is MY take on the Communication issue and what is "really" at stake here: --The County's that host ProAms do not want to have a rule that cannot be enforced with any degree of reliability. I'm sure we can all agree that if someone wanted to communicate in a No Comm tournament they very easily could. Using ME as an example so as not to point fingers....in the recent WHI I had exchanged observers with Lord of the Kings----Vito Datomo. We put all our cell phones in the provided bag and went fishing. However, did the observer on my boat know about the cell phone hidden in the cupboard downstairs? My observer was on Vito's boat. When Vito found a pod of kings just 1/2 mile north of me and starting poundng them what kept my observer from discreetly sending me a text? It could have been easily done so what kept me from doing it? Pride and respect from my fellow competitors and MY TEAM! The Rule, in a sense, policed itself.........with regards to me and my team anyway. That said, can we not agree that if someone WANTS to communicate they will---regardless of the "rule"? Please respond if you think otherwise. As I've shown, an observer could have done NOTHING to stop me from communicating if I chose to do so. NOW.......to the true "heart" of the matter---as I see it. If EVERYONE felt the way that Pete, Andy, Rod, Matt, myself and others feel the communication issue wouldn't exist. We could simply AGREE not to communicate and that would be sufficient----because pride and respect would enforce the rule better than an observer ever could. When this issue came up three years ago I proposed a Gentlemen's Agreement for No Communication at the Big Boys Event following the Niagara ProAm. In a field of 10 boats only Five would agree to it! WHY???? When Tom Allen first started his campaign of polls, surveys and internet postings about the communication issue I suggested the idea of a Gentlemen's Agreement to him. Since the counties wanted nothing to do with the rule why don't we take it upon ourselves to put in a SELF IMPOSED no communication rule? Tom's reply, after speaking with his "constituents" was that almost NO ONE supported the idea. WHY???? I'm sure we can all see, and agree, that pride and respect are the ONLY things that keep this rule enforcible----I believe Tom and others have even said this. If that is true WHY won't everyone agree to it? The answer is simple-----WE DON'T TRUST EACH OTHER!!! We lock our vehicles at the marina and put our rods and tackle away every night. Our tournament baits are kept downstairs out of sight of prying eyes. GPS locations of hotspots are kept secret. The issue isn't about communication or the lack thereof its about TRUST. I'm proposing again........that we ALL sign a GENTLEMEN'S AGREEMENT for No Communication at the upcoming Niagara ProAm. It can be started right here on LOU and continued at the Captain's meeting. Enforcement should be easy as any infractions will result in an immediate posting of the violator and the details on LOU. The County will have nothing to do with it and can do nothing about it. What do ya say? Do we have enough integrity and trust in each other to make this work? In closing allow me to express another opinion...... --the tournaments are run by County Employees for the fishermen that compete and for the local businesses that the fishermen support while competing. They bring a TREMENDOUS amount of money into each local community. "Boycotting" a particular tournament or tournament series by not fishing it or not sponsoring it hurts EVERYONE. It hurts the other competitors by lowering the prize payouts. It hurts the community by lost revenues. That hurt extends into the future as it makes it harder to get new sponsors when you have diminishing interest. The only person it does NOT hurt is the County Employee that is the Director. He gets paid regardless! With today's high speed internet and ultra fast techno everything we ALL live in a world of glass houses. The problem with throwing stones in today's world is that sooner or later you're gonna hit your own house! Think about it boys. Now let's get this Gentlemen's Agreement for No Communication going so we can all put this to rest and get on with some Tournament Fishing! See ya next week.

Im not sure what "spring tournament" you're referring to Scotty but the WHI had Observers and the Big Jon in April had observers on the top ten boats for Day 2. Both tournaments went off well with no incidents that I know of. However......without observers on Day 1 of the Big Jon would anyone "really" know if there was anything shady going on? Like I said I think Observers are a necessary evil given the amount of money at stake in these tournaments.

That is always an issue Gill.....for Pros and Ams. That is, in part, why the Open Division was created in the first place and is certainly an option for you. The Directors feel Observers lend credibility to the tournaments (and most of us agree) and with the Challenge Cup and a lot of money at stake Observers are a necessary evil , albeit, a pain in the butt sometimes. If you're having trouble locating an Observer check with that tournament's Director---all of the Directors keep lists of people wanting to be Observers.

You need to find "stable" water Tony. When winds change direction constantly the water tends to become very unstable with regards to temperature. When that happens generally the water offshore is the more stable water. When I found that group of kings off Wilson last Friday I did so by checking the satellite temp graphs for the lake. The graph showed a significant break about 6 miles offshore that had cold water on the INSIDE and warmer water on the outside. I decided to make the run on a scouting trip to see if that warmer water was "green" and not gin clear and to see if there were any cohos or steelies on it. We were rewarded with green water and KINGS. That water is changing rapidly though. Although the kings seemed to hang around there for several days ---the fishing was truly amazing on Sunday--they are probably starting to spread out now and go back to their more "normal" haunts like the Bar and the 100-200 ft. range between Olcott and Wilson. Good luck! Its looking like its gonna be a terrific weekend!

VERY well said Pete. You should put that in an email and send it where it needs to go. Powers that be are listening but sometimes they need help.....to actually hear it.