Fishtails

A little birdie told me we ain't fishin out of a 27' Cherokee no more. Can't wait to fish out of the new ride !

These guys are very successful Watch the captian though, he has been known to fish in his underwear

Way to think outside the box

No problem Chad. I only took the parts that were directed strait at me and untrue personal There are going to be times in the future that I can't fish the Pro division for one reason or another. I just hope the committee changes the end time in the Open/Am so that I can fish it with my entire family....I would love to have my family fish a tournament with me one day. My son has fished many, but my wife and daughter have yet to share in this part of my life. It just needs to be a long enough day to make it worthwhile.

Chad, I don't really know how to respond to your post, so for the most part I wont because very little of it is even worthy of a response. I happen to disagree with you based on the opinions I have gathered and heard, but you are entitled to your opinion as well so I'll take the high road and leave it at that. However, there are some things you need some enlightenment on. I never under any circumstances, drunk or sober, have insinuated the open division was"my baby". I have never even spoken of the fact that I was at all involved with it's conception until now....and that was three years ago.! I merely pitched the idea in an effort to save the Am division back in 09, but I had little to do with the final product. Furthermore...I never "pushed for change". Did you read my post? Where did that come from???? I also didn't "promptly part" the Am division once the open division was developed. I fished the Am all 4 events in 09 & 10 and once in 11. That is 9 events in the Am to only 2 in the Pro, so what exactly are you talking about ?? Why would they....that was never the intent? The intent was to develop an easier less structured division to entice new teams to give the Pro Am a try, and then hope some of the open teams would move up to the "more prestigious" Am division. It was all an attempt to build the overall participation. I don't like loosing the Am division any more than you or the next guy. I've been an Am regular for awhile now. I still remember you fishing your first Pro Am Chad...it was in Oswego...remember? I didn't know you, but I recall you missed the deadline so I offered to front the entry and get the money in for you because we were in the Oswego area. A few years later and it seems you got it all figured out and have all the answers. I guess I just choose to accept and embrace the change instead of crying about it like a few have. It sucks to lose the Am division, but it would suck more if the Open division would go away too, leaving NO options for the little guy. That's why I started this thread....just to point out that it's a very good option, and no one needs to feel as it there is no place for them in the Pro Am.

Jason, I admire your passion for the Pro Am series....it runs very deep with many of us, but probably to no one more than Vince. If I remember correctly, Vince has fished the Pro Am since it's conception. Change can be hard to accept when we have such a deep passion for something. I totally understand your points, and they are very well made. For many of the reasons you stated, I fought to keep the Am division alive 3 years ago when the idea of dismantling it first arose. I listened to to committee's reasoning, and I understood (and still do understand) their situation. I have stated before that even though I fished the Pro division 2 of 3 last year (I missed Sodus ) , I consider myself an Am. When I fish the Pro, I fish with my buddy Matt on Team Oh Baby, who was also an Am. We are weekend warriors who live 4 plus hours from the lake and get very little fishing time yearly except for the tournaments. It's daunting to go up against the likes of Capt. Vince and his Thrillseeker crew, and the many incredibly experienced teams in the Pro division. The Am division was my safe harbor. I felt comfortable there, and so did a whole group of teams that I enjoyed fishing against 4 times a year. The Am division had a stay of execution and a chance to prove it was worth keeping, but instead of seeing growth, the Am division continued to loose participants. I believe a large part of that was the economy, and in all fairness I believe the Pro division saw a drop in participation over the same timeline as well. With projected record high gas prices this year, I am all but certain their would have been further decline in the Am participation in 2012. As hard as it is for you, myself, and a group of 20 or so "regulars", I think the committee made the right choice in moving on and putting the Am division to rest. I have followed the "Am only tournament" thread, but I have not gotten involved. What I don't get is what's being considered is basically a similar event as the Am division of the Pro Am, and all these guys are saying "I'm in ...you can count on me", yet we had this exact structure for years and where were all these people then? Like Paul said, most of it is just talk ! IMO, many are undervaluing the option of the Open division, which I think the committee should now call the Am division if they want it to take off. My big bone of contention is the same as I have heard from other guys...The ending time. In the past, it was too short of a fishing day. While it's true, you can start at any time, I feel it's unsafe as most of these boats are small craft without radar. It's also not "family friendly", as I considered it once but my wife and daughter said no to my early start proposal. Give the open division a longer day and it's a good division for the Am guys....a really good division. For those that want the observer....go Pro. A lot of the Am teams should go pro anyway, but I think a few just like beating up on the rest One way or another Jason, I hope to meet you on the tourney trail this season.

Happy Birthday Buddy!!

Cool man...we gotta hang out one night and lie about where the fish are and what was working that day I plan on being there most of the week, so I'll find ya. I still gotta make reservations.

Where were you fishing Scott....I don't recall 6 footers on day one of Oswego ?? Hey..stop your belly aching and team up with Jan and fish it out of his tank. You're fishing the WHI....and that's a lot more $$ for entry fee than the pro am. I bet most all teams sign the no comm agreement this year, so I doubt open communication will be an issue. You staying at 4 mile this year? I still owe you

Where did Coal Bluffers posts go ? C'mon mods ....he was entertaining We finally get us a real honest to goodness down home redneck and ya kick him out...he just needed a little polishing . Oh well....it was fun for what....one day? We never have fun anymore

Hey Cornelis. you observed for Spoonfed last year if I recall correctly? I think you have the makings of a team worthy of a reality tv series here...all ya need is Spoonfed, Coal Buffler, Has Been and yourself. How awesome would that be ? I think most of us would pay to watch that .

All fish are cold blooded....Lower water temperatures slow fish body movements and decrease their food intake. They eat, just not nearly as often as they do when their body warms up in the summer. I have noticed in the early spring, when the water is still colder, we have a lot more kings that will follow lures for longer periods without striking. They aren't hungry, but they are still interested. By changing up speeds or using a G2 jigger (http://www.cut2spec.com) we can create impulsive strikes. When a baitfish swims along at one speed, a king may follow it for awhile even though it may not be hungry, just because it's a predator and passing up a free easy meal isn't natural to them. This happens more than you realize, especially in the spring. I find you can get these fish to strike more often by forcing them to make a decision. If that baitfish (our lure) changes speeds, thus imitating that it's either trying to escape, or it's injured. I've found that a following king will often times strike impulsively. I don't think they can help themselves.

I don't really know for a fact....but I'd start by looking at your question a little differently. The question is...where do the alewives spend the winter? Where there is food, the Chinooks won't be too far away. As far as I know, Alewives winter in the deeper water, then migrate in to shallow water in the spring. My guess is at least to a degree, your Chinook cycle will sorta mirror that of the Alewives. On another not....remember that they are cold blooded, so their need to feed is pretty modest in the winter when compared to the summer.

My last update....Finally I found a few days to get working on the top again and finally finished it up. Lord...I don't know how many hours it took to complete and I'm pretty sure I would never do a project like this again Anyhow...I'm pleased with how it came out. Five more weeks and she'll finally be fishing again

There is video of the Rochester Meeting on The LOC site....very interesting to watch. http://loc.org/

I Like It Personally, I am looking forward to this year of tournament fishing like none other . We are very blessed Thanks to all involved!!

Fellow LOU'ers A recent comment made on another thread has got me thinking that the there may be some misunderstandings on why the open division was implemented in the Pro Am in 2009 as a third division, and what it's design and intent is/was all about. I am no longer in contact with any Pro Am committee members, but in 2008 & 2009 I was. I was fishing the Am division full time and I received a phone call from the committee that there was serious talk within about drastically restructuring the Am division in an attempt to improve participation. In a nutshell, they wanted to remove the observer rule, drop to a 3 fish limit, and remove most of the rules. This proposed change never went public, as I was asked to keep it in confidence, but in 2009 I fought hard to keep the Am division intact. I am the one who proposed the Open division as an alternative. Here is a part of one of many 2009 emails from the committee: And thus the Am division was spared it's death and a new option to fish the Pro Ams was born. The problem is, that over the following 3 seasons, The Am division continued to shrink. Sure....just like in the new "Am tourney only pole" thread that Glen has going, lots of guys said they were fishing the Am or the open, but never did. What is happening this year with the Am division is not a new thought. The committee has been kicking this around for years as they watched the entries dwindle. The open division was not developed solely for the lessor experienced, as someone made reference to in another post. That was not the original intent at all. I should know...it was my idea. Rather, it was designed as a third alternative to get people involved that had not participated in a Pro Am before because of the small boat rule, or the observer rule, or couldn't commit to two days, etc. The hope was that guys would fish the "lessor structured" open division, and then move up to the Am division. Unfortunately, lots of guys said "I'm In....or "sign me up", (just like the am only post) only to never do it for one excuse or another. I can't tell you how many times I heard "I was waiting to see how many would fish it". Really guys? If the majority has that "follower" attitude...the turnout is certain to suck, and it did. The turnout sucked because everyone was waiting for everyone else to sign up. So they didn't fish it and than complained that they heard the turnout was poor so they would not be interested until it improves....no duh? The open division was developed for anyone who wanted to fish a less structured division, or just couldn't fish the other divisions for whatever reason. It cost less, had over 100% payout, there is no minimum boat length restrictions, no observer, and you can fish either one OR two days and you can cull. With only a three fish limit....a novice can beat the most experienced guy on the lake. It was everything that all the guys who didn't fish the Pro Am's said they wanted...but they didn't fish them anyway So this season, as the Pro Am moves to a new format and finally lays the Am division to rest....consider this open division if you can't do the pro division. Be part of the most prestigious tournament series on lake Ontario. Anyone can fish the open division....and anyone can win it!! Just figured I would get this out there. See some of you guys in Niagara

I think you're missing the point. Everyone always has an excuse why the don't fish this, or don't fish that. There are plenty of guys on this thread alone (Glen, Lou, etc) who have kicked my a$$ plenty of times. I fish every tournament on the lake....not because I am any good at it, but because I love the competition and hanging out with all the people who share my passion. Anyone who knows me knows I take kids fishing alot. My son (now 12) has fished tournaments with me since he was 7. If I had the chance, I would love to take him and a buddy of his and fish against the Ams in the open. I almost fished the open once last year with my son, wife and 7 yr old daughter. I just couldn't get the girls interested in getting up that early. Should a full blown "pro" team fish it....of course not. I didn't give all the details because I didn't think I had to.

Agreed...if, and only if, your designation of a "pro" is having a charter Captains Lic. How would you know who is fishing off what boat? Whatever works....go for it. Just pointing out the obvious. Thanks for the vote of confidence Howie, but I already have an overflowing plate. IMHO, I will stick with the Pro Am's, and the times I don't fish the Pro division, I will fish the Am/ open division. For me....that's where it's at See ya the week of the WHI Howie.

Good job Chris....I'm jealous!!!

Being a full time tournament fishermen, yet still an Am, I think I may be able to offer some helpful insight ? I definitely consider myself an Am. Even when I fish the pro division I fish it with another former Am team. So if you are talking about an Am tournament, what would differentiate a Pro from an Am? Not sure it would be a good idea to segregate and only target/ allow one group. First off, that would keep most potential sponsors from coming aboard. A tournament is a tournament.....keeping "pro's" out is unenforceable. For the most part, the guys that run a tournament don't fish it. That is the main thing that has kept me from getting involved in one so far....I wanna fish! There are exceptions, but it takes people to run it. From all the guys I have spoken with, running a tournament is a huge undertaking. I could go on and on but I don't want to seem like I am trying to be negative, just keeping it real. Emotion and resentment doesn't run a tournament.....a lot of thankless hard work does. At least as of this season, The Pro Am STILL has an Am division, and the committee and counties are doing all the work for us...it's the former open division. If turnout is poor, who knows if they will keep it intact and then there would be nothing designed specifically for the AM teams Just saying....maybe the Ams should get more involved and voice up why the committee is listening and voice up on how to make the Am/open division something they would want to be involved in ? Speaking for myself, I know that last year I fished 3 of 4 Pro Ams. 1 as an AM & 2 as a Pro. The one I missed was because I thought I would be out of town, but it turns out I wasn't. I seriously considered fishing the open division, but the early finish time kept me out. That was a major sticking point for me that I think needs to be addressed. Good to see the tournament compassion Can't wait for the season to get here!!

I suspect the Pro Am's are going to be better than ever once all this gets worked out. Hey...the added cost is tough for all us weekend warriors to deal with, and that is all Chad is saying. If you love the Pro Am series as much as many of us do, figure it out instead of complaining about it. The entry is higher, but with a lot more payouts. Chad is right...sponsors can be a big help. Just be prepared to work for them....whatever you get ain't free!! They want a return on their investment. Most sponsors will give you a discount on product, or if you are really lucky they will give you free product. It helps A LOT ! The money saved on product can go towards other things...like entry fees. But like Chad said....tackle companies are hard to get. Look at other sources. All they can do is say no....and they usually do The most obvious way to stay in these tournaments is for the AM's to combine teams. There are a lot of AM teams that by themselves can't afford the higher fee, but maybe one or two of the guys can. Join forces ! Last year my team joined up with Team Oh Baby and it worked out great! It takes some getting used to when you are used to running your own team and making your own decisions, but If you can learn to leave your ego at the dock it can work out well. For us, It went well enough that we are doing the same thing this year Hope to see some of you guys in Niagara

You may be able to get some big bucks for them this summer Dave. Thanks to Jon, I have nine of them... and he has a belly ache I tried to tell him he should take the cookies out of the box before eating them, but he said there was no time If I know Gary... The Fly Nazi and The Cookie Monster will be coming soon....

I was not able to get away from our booth at LOTSA, and missed the seminar, so I am just piecing this together but I am intrigued by the proposed changes. A lot of the Ams make some valid points though and having fished the Am up till last year I totally get how they feel. The new format makes for a real "thinking mans" event, and I really like that aspect, but the Am's feel like the rug is being pulled out from under their feet and trust me...they have just as much (if not more) passion about the Pro/Am series than the Pro's do. IMHO, $850 will be too much. The big money events already exist...It's been done already and we have 4 of them in place for 2012 between the Invitationals and Tightline shootouts....8 seams ridiculous. However...with the KOTL Big Jon shrinking each year (this year it will be down to two events in St Catherines), that sector is more wide open than it has been in years and I think the Pro Am abandoning it would be a big mistake! I think $650 is max!! I will fish one or two Pro Am's no matter what, and I hope to see a bunch of my former Am compadres as well, because I know a bunch of you will finish towards the top in each event....and it would be awesome to watch the former Am's take over the top 10...it could happen, you guys are great fishermen!

This whole thread is freggin hysterical Just call me the Fly Nazi....No Fly For You !!! Sorry Tom, you know how it is, you just had that mischievous grin and I figured you were up to something. I thought maybe you and ITO Ryan were in cahoots to undermine us and copy the Lily fly this season once it gets hot....knowing BW wasn't making anymore. Not long before you stopped by, Ryan snuck in from behind while my back was turned and grabbed a box & a fly....then tapped me on the shoulder and laughed at me and I heard him say I Got It as he headed off I thought about jumping him and wrestling the fly away but I got distracted when someone in a dark red shirt yelled out "He Got One !". I knew something was up and I had to stop the bleeding.... I had to think fast, so Jon eagerly came up with a plan. He would have to eat the rest of the cookies...all 9 remaining boxes!! I admit Tom...you stopped by just as he was shoving the last ones down. I was sooo proud of him, he had to choke down that last box cause he was out of soda Right about then you strolled by Tom....and Jon got to deliver the good....I mean bad news