Shade

WOW.....Thanks Bill Howie

We set up in 50' and worked to 70' a few times. Screen was dark and to much traffic. We then worked our way to 197' out east of the barn and found 48 degree water 50 down. We boated and released 4 of 4 Steelies all around the 10# weight and all on wires between 140 and 160 back. We had on skippy on a rigger 35 down. Very slow day but we had to leave at 11:30 anyway. Hope the week end brings better bite. Have a safe holiday ya"all and good fishing. We had DW white with green dot/ATM LBB, DW Delmation/ ATM AGG got all 4 hits. Howie

My team agrees with Maverick and Kevin in keeping the event to one day and Rob with having a Grand Slam event on Friday. We are leaning more to Mavs and Kevin idea of mixed bag but whatever way it will still be a good time. Couple things we are throwing in is instead of giving Uncle Sam a bigger cut that there be a larger number of team payouts and maybe some gift certificates ,and we aint talkin about gear, but maybe entree fees to the the next WHI, maybe one or two Pro/Ams entries of your choice or even accomadations. Just cut back on the feds share. Just our $.02. We are looking forward to next years event. Howie - Hannah Christine

Congrats Paul, give us the scoop Shade

Good report Tim, Ya don't wanna be droppin fish next Friday or Saturday bud. I was out Saturday in about the same water and could only hit Steelies. We only stayed out 3 hours and we went 5 for 7 and all caught on 55 rigger with slider on a DW SS Green Dolphin. Not one King or hit on wires. See ya Friday. Howie

Fishing Report Your Name / Boat Name:Hannah Christine ============== TRIP OVERVIEW ============== Date(s):7/2 Time on Water:4.5 hrs. Weather/Temp: 75 Wind Speed/Direction: Waves: Surface Temp: 62 Location: Olcott LAT/LONG (GPS Cords): =============== FISHING RESULTS =============== Total Hits: 19 Total Boated: 10 Species Breakdown:Kings Hot Lure: Delmation SD/Sweet Pea Fly, DWSS Green Gator Spoons Trolling Speed:2.6 - 3.0 Down Speed: 2.2 - 2.5 Boat Depth: 175' - 320' Lure Depth: 55', 65', 75' Riggers, Wires were back 180',210' & 240' ==================== SUMMARY & FURTHER DETAILS We got a late start, 0730 and went NW. Lot of boats were NE between Microwave and Stacks in 200+ water. We hooked up at 120 and at 175 fow are 180' wire fired and went 420' in no time. Boated an 18# King. From there it was every 10 - 15 minutes either a wire or rigger fired but nothing better then 18#. We never took one Bow or Coho. around 10:30 it slowed down so we went out deeper and nothing on the screen we decided to come back on a SE troll and just west of the water tower from 225' down to 175fow are rods lit up. We came in at noon with some nice fish for the grill and released what we could that could live another day. Pics are on my nephews phone will post later. Shade ====================

On Saturday June 25th Bob Cinelli pulled up along side my boys truck and lashed out at me about a comment I posted on this site. He cought me off guard and drove off. On Saturday July1st after we had fished I approached Bob on his boat and things got out of hand. Threats were exchanged, colorfull language was used...it was ugly and childish to say the least. I want to puplicly apologize to Bob and his crew along with 5 More minutes and his crew. My comments were made out of assumptions and coincidences not proof in regards to the no comm agreement. I will not apologize for my support to eliminate communications during the pro/am event. I still believe it is not right for a Pro team to assist a Am team in any way from the 5:30 start until 1PM finish on either day, same goes for Pro and AM teams for getting assistance from non participating boats any time during the event. I intend to send Bob and 5 more minutes a personal email and/or PM with my appologies. They can read it or disguard it if they so choose. One thing came out of this loud discussion was it sure changed my outlook to the Pro/Am event and some of its participants. HAVE A SAFE AND HAPPY HOLIDAY Shade PS: sorry I had to tant this great site with this fullishness but this is where it started and this is where it ends.

Vince, It is sad when you lose a friend and a pioneer of this great sport. My family and I send our condolences to you and your friend Bernies family. Howie

Do you have any pics? Shade

cigs, Thats a good point. So if there was no comm there would not be an advantage or disadvantage. I like every body who is favor of no comm just want to see the tournament be fished on your ability for 7 - 8 hours each day. Ya just can not comm during the fishing hours period. This goes out to all, all this talk about crying, name calling and sarcasm is not good for the tournament or the sport. If ya have an opinion then have your say without the bull. If ya think it is bull do not read the post. We all have a voice and it may fall on deaf ears but at least present it. I beleive that a no comm will help this event. The Wilson Invitaional would have drawn 100 + boats if they had the room to put them all in Wilson. A handfull of fishermen put some rules together, made a one division one day event, allowed culling, allowed fishing all over the lake, (except thte tribs) and no complaints, no crying no DQ's. The best part they are WELCOMING INPUT to make it better. The majority of the pro/am participants are asking to shut down communication and we are all cry babies and assholes. Shade

You only need 3 riggers and you should have one in the middle, right in the wash, one on the port and one starbourd. The key is to have starboard at 9 o'clock, center at 12 o'clock and port at 3 o'clock. You SD should run off center rigger with your probe. Also your cenetr rigger should be your deepest. When I had an 8' beam I ran my dipsys off an 11' and 12' rods so I could run my dipsy at any setting i wanted to. Just keep you dipsy above or below your riggers. I will ocassionally run a side rigger deep but you need to be careful on your turns. Shade

The spin doctor came with 2 swivals. These are the swivals you use, one from the RIGGER TO THE SD AND ONE FROM THE SD TO THE LURE. I usually run my SD 10 - 15' from the ball and my leader from the SD to the Fly is 22". The leader I use for the fly, is 40 lb. flurocarbine or use the leader that came with the fly. The release is your choice. Shade

In my opinion the only way we are going to get to the bottom of the comm discussion is to get some real honest feedback from all on why you are for or against communication. We need to do this with out pionting fingers or sarcasm. First and foremost everyone needs to understand the proposal. It says you can not communicat during the fishing hours in your division. If you want to call your buddies prior to the start you can do so. If you want to talk to your buddies after the fishing time is over you may do so. I keep hearing there is an advantage to the charters. Of course there is wether you communicate or not, this is there port. I would think that the open comm rule gives them a larger advantage. Who knows the people in their dock more than they do, hell I just moved and there are 3 boats that do not fish tournaments and I can get info from them if I asked. There were 76 teams in the WHI. A tournament that ran for the first time and to this day there has not been one complaint that has hit this site. WHY????? The best part it was one division, no AM division, and no comm. They came from East, West and North of the lake. Give your honest views on why or why not. We are all adults and we all want the goal, to see tournaments grow and be successful. Fishing is about having fun and making friends with fair competitiveness. Howie

Show off..... Howie

Paul, I take my hat off to you for at least posting an avenue to help in the no comm quest. As the ONLY committee member who not only signed the agreement but is joining the march to eliminate it. You are correct this could have been one of the few threads that had the potential of good discussion. I attended a seminar sponsored by LOTSA this past February and was excited over the 2 professionals who were the co speakers. What I did not know, until now, was one was against communications in the Pro/Am and the other was not. The one thing the instuctor, who was FOR comm, forgot to mention was before you worry about programs, down speed and trolling direction is to make sure you have a solid communication network. This was evident in the different outcomes between the Niagara and Orleans Pro/Am's. in the signing and not signing the no comm agreements. I like the idea of Vince becoming a member of the Pro/Am committee and I would also like to see Pete as well. My questions though are: 1)WHO ARE THE COMMITTEE MEMBERS ALONG WITH THEIR ROLLS IN EACH EVENT? 2)HOW DO YOU BECOME A MEMBER? I know from experience that volunteering is not a way, so what is? All I know it is time for a change. If any of you raining members have any self respect or compassion for this event either liston to what we participants are asking for or please step down and allow this event to grow. Howie

Rc, First of all read the fishing reports that are for Olcott and Wilson. I would go back to Olcott this week end instead of the bar. You want to set up in 200 fow and work up to maybe 350 fow. Look for good color or scum lines. Run your riggers from 30 to 60 feet to start and keep an eye on you fishfinder for good hooks. Run your wires back about 180 - 300 with Sds and Flies with dipsys set on 2.5 marker. Green flies, green spoons with blue or orange mix, black spoons with white ladder back to start. You need a speed and temp prob to locate 41 - 50 degree water at the ball and run you speed at the ball between 2.2 - 2.4 to start. Watch your trolling direction and speed at all times. You will have to try different speeds but be patient. If you wallet allows you may want to hook up with a charter and see how they set up. They will show you the basics but ya gotta ask questions. Go through this website because there is a lot of info on here right now. Good luck, Shade

Ladybluegill, before you comment read the agreement. There is nothing that says ya can not communicate before the event starting time or after first days event. All it says is ya can not communicate from your division starting times through finishing time. We are taling about 8 hours each day. The Niagara has the biggest draw then the other three and the non comm thread was started by a highly respected fishermen from the east end. The biggest numbers of teams who dropped out of the pro/am because of the comm rule change where from the east end. Shade

Well I see one team,after signing the no comm agreement, that could not cash in the Niagara Pro/Am who did not sign the agreement in the Orleans and cashed in big. Talk about selling your sole fo a buck. Ya did not bet another dinner, did you Pete? Shade

Slab, We talked about this during the weight in. The no comm rule only restricts comm during the assigned fishing times (5:30AM - 1PM) for the Am division and (6am - 2pm) for the Pro Division. There is no way of policing comm during non fishing hours. I am sure every team discussed what other teams did and where they fished in both divisions. Running a boat up you exhaust is unethical. Everyone drops a few fish from time to time. You yourself said who dropped a nice one first thing. That fish could of made a difference. My team had some spit a few hooks in their face as well and would have moved us up as well but we did our best and at least we can say we outfished 19 other teams. You guys finished 4th, well done. You should be happy on your accomplishments and look at what ya did and how to improve for next year.Keep your emotions at check and have fun. Everyone knows there are rules that need to changed to draw more competers but there will always be idiot out there that can not fish on his own skills and needs someone else to put them on fish. All you can do is pick your grid you intend to fish, decide on a program and live or dye with it. Thats what it's all about....oh and HAVE FUN. Howie

Happy Birthday Tim, wish we would have known over the week end bud. Have a great day. Waite.................hmmmm Had to go home Friday to celebrate nephews birthday Howie

GregDale, I do not know where not sighning the no comm agreement targeted anyones credability. I am sure that was not the intent by Capt. Pete or Capt. Vince. Your credability will be questioned if you sign it and then go out and break it. All of us who support thr agreement are saying you can not communicate from the start of your division fishing time until the end(5:30am - 1pm for Am Division and 6am-2pm for the Pro Division). If there are some who disagree with this consept then that is there right and we have to respect that. There where teams who did not sign it because they feel the rules are in place and some who say that no comm gives the home team the advantage. No where does it say you can not talk to your buddy prior to the start of the event or even after the fishing times are completed wether your at the bar, out to dinner or snapin a cap at the boat you can communicate all ya want. If there are questions or concerns either way on this topic then contact Pete or Vince by email, pm or in person and voice your opinion but like ya said without trashing frienships or getting abusive. Let them gather all the pros and cons and see what can be agreed upon, but something has to change. I am talking from first hand experience of what I SAW while an Observer a few tournaments back. It is wrong, in my opinion, for a Pro Team to tell an Am Team where the fish are, what to use, how deep to fish and speed to run, nor is it right to get info from teams who are not in the event and an Am team helping a pro team with info as well. The Pro/Am is becomming a tournament of WHO YA KNOW NOT WHAT YA KNOW. Lets debate this as gentlemen and not trash anyones reasoning or believes and see what can be done to bring this event where it has the potential to grow. Howie

Unsub, We do not enter tournaments because of the rules, we enter because of the competiveness. You do not have to believe in the rules, you just have obey them. Nobodies telling our fellow fishermen they have to sign the gentlemens agreement all they are saying is do you agree to no comm sign it. If you want or need to communicate with other fishermen to compete you are in your right to do so by the rule. Many of us believe a no comm rule will draw more teams which will allow teams to use there own skills to compete on an even playing field and allow this event to grow. Shade

Icefrog, We all need to support Petes and Vinces efforts. There are only one set of rules written for both pros and ams. The biggest problem with comm is in the pro division. There are Pro teams helping AM teams during the event. This is just the beginning in trying to get the agreement into a rule. We as AMs can sign the agreement during the meeting to show our support as well. Do not be supprised if some AM teams do not sign agreement. If for what I here ALL the pro teams are in agreement ALL com from pro teams stops. Lets see what happens in 3 days. This should be an interesting meeting. Shade

Is there a way we can get the names of teams that have entered the AM division? If so what about contact info for those who are not LOU members? My team is signing it regardless as well. Shade