Ivan

We have a Lund but it has the wider gunwales. I haven't used our sport track except for cup holders, etc because I was concerned about the durability/strength and there weren't many mounting options for the sport track back in 07 when we bought our boat. We mounted track to the top of the gunwales and backed them with 1/4" aluminum plates under the gunwale. Very solid, but I can see/understand by the way your gunwales are, that probably won't be an option for you. I saw a Lund Pro-V that had a nice downrigger mount on the sport track. His base attached to the inside sport track and over the gunwale to the sport track on the outside of the boat (where you would put your snaps for a trailer cover without having to drill into the boat). That looked like a nice set up, but I'm not sure if your model Lund has the sport track inside and outside the boat, and your gunwales are way more narrow than a Pro-V. I think your full trolling bar idea, all the way across the beam of you boat may help. You may also call this guy and discuss your dilemma. Best Lund sport track mounting options I've seen. He might be able to come up with a custom solution for you. http://www.ciscofishingsystemsltd.com/

"You fish them your way, your terms, with a conservation mind" I'm already doing that...you just don't respect my terms Just because you are older than me (and I'm not that young...I'm 41) doesn't mean you have more experience with these fish than me or know more. I'm not claiming to know more than you either. You just have a narrow mind. Lad As far as my progression to trophy fish, you have no clue about me. Don't need to look forward to it...already doing it. I fish the Georgian Bay and St Lawrence almost every fall and would fish them more if they were closer or I had more time. It's not all about numbers for me, and there's no better place to get your ass handed to you looking for a single trophy fish. I had you pegged correctly at first. You think if it isn't caught casting or row trolling, it doesn't count...just like the guys in Northern Wisconsin. Hey when I get old and don't care if I catch any muskies, maybe you and I can be friends. no thanks Oh wait....How does that muskie with no eyes eat Mr Heron? The baitfish must just feel sorry for her blind ass and jump in her mouth out of pitty. That ought to lock this thread down!

Good stuff Heron. Nothing wrong with a friendly debate if it can be kept that way. Hey...we've both apparently made some assumptions about each other that are wrong. I can admit when I'm wrong. Since you pointed out where my assumptions were wrong, let me point out a couple things you are wrong about. First, that other thread on conservation you started...I was defending your original request. Somebody else (Raven I think) got on there and debated your ideas, which you specifically requested people not to do. I said I would not debate that stuff in that thread because that's what you originally requested. You were wrong to say I replied in an argumentative fashion. That is quite a reach, and an incorrect conclusion. I can see now why you requested people not to debate. Second, to say that a muskies lateral line has very little to do with their feeding and a blind muskies would die, is wrong. The date of that very scientific study I posted does not change the findings (i didn't even look when it was done anyway). Also, that first link I posted was to a very healthy, fat muskie that had no eyes. That fish did not have ANY trouble feeding...that's obvious from its girth. It's certainly using it's lateral line to feed since it has no eyes. As far as your shot at me about the amount of muskies I catch at the end of your second to last post...I'm not sure what you are getting at there. I used those figures to illustrate a point of what a small percentage of fish I see that have blind eyes. It was not used in a bragging manor. If you can't comprehend that a boat can catch and release that many muskies in a season, you are short sighted. I have no reason to lie about what I catch and there are plenty of guys that can vouch for me. There are plenty of guys that have caught more than us. It's all dependent on your knowledge, skill, techniques, time on the water, and some luck. If you are an MI member, look me and my dad up in the lunge log sometime. Keep in mind I have friends besides me and my Dad that catch muskies out of our boat too. Finally, if your preference to is use old style techniques and you don't care to actually catch fish, then that's fine. It doesn't make my preferences wrong. I like just being on the water too. However, I prefer to have the best equipment I can afford. I also prefer to use techniques and technology to my advantage to catch as many and as big of muskies as I can. That doesn't make either of us wrong...that just makes us very different. By the way....I hope you are not calling me fat and lazy too.

Probably won't find a more scientific based study than this on the topic: http://jeb.biologists.org/content/204/6/1207.full.pdf+html

Everybody has their opinions I guess. Mine were based off lots of personal observation. I guess if you are afraid to hurt fish, then don't fish for them. I'm confident the tactics I use, along with my release methods are sound and work, by far, the vast majority of the time. Have I ever had a muskie die on me?....yes. Have the vast majority of the muskies I've caught released well and swam off strong to be caught again? yes Heron...no offense intended...I don't know you, but sounds like you would fit in with the Northern Wisconsin guys well, where motor trolling is illegal. Here's some interesting reads on the original topic of sight feeding: http://muskie.outdoorsfirst.com/board/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=46235&DisplayType=nested&setCookie=1 http://www.in-fisherman.com/2011/07/14/pike-and-muskie-footprints-and-fingerprints/

Great job Brent...especially for your first year on your own. Congrats on putting your friends on some fish. Panfisher: I may have made those blind eyes sound more common than they are. I might get a couple fish per year in my boat that have a single blind eye out of a couple hundred plus muskies, so it might be 1%. Never seen one with both eyes blinded, that I can remember. Not sure how much muskies rely on sight to feed. The ones with one blind eye don't seem to have any problems. Larry's fish was not having any trouble feeding. It may depend some on the body of water and what the water clarity is typically like. We get plenty of muskies each spring in some OH lakes we fish. Some of these lakes can have close to zero visibility, muddy water in the spring. I would say their lateral line plays a bigger role than sight for feeding. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United mobile app

We've found it pretty hard to catch a decent fish at Chautauqua that doesn't have some type of healed over red spot sores or something. Might just be the picture, but looks like the bigger one has a blind eye also. Did you notice if it was blind in one eye Larry? That's not that uncommon either.

We fished a friend's private tourney at Chautauqua the previous weekend, so we did not enter the Three Rivers Tourney...just wanted to fish without any restrictive rules or times. I think the tourney went well based on the somewhat limited participation. I think there were about 12 teams/boats in the tourney. It was a total points/total inches tourney. I think the first place team had 7 fish, but nothing very big. I think second place had a 46" and maybe a couple smaller fish. Third place had 5 fish, I believe. Had we entered and still caught what we did, Dad and I would have had first place, big fish, and the 50" pot. But, that's ok...never know if we would have caught what we did if we were actually in the tourney. We also ran our large boards off masts all weekend, which would have been against the rules for the Three Rivers tourney. I support the Three Rivers Chapter, but I'm just not into competitive fishing much anymore. I put enough pressure on myself to produce as it is and like to fish how and when I want to fish. I am still willing to help promote a fund raising tourney for next year if you need the help.

Thanks guys. Lots of great memories at Chautauqua. I'm glad Dad got it.

Dad and I have been fishing muskies at Chq pretty regularly on the weekends since 98. We've had quite a few nice 48 to 49.5" fish there, but never a 50". After all these years, Chautauqua finally gave up a dark 50.25" to Dad yesterday. Released well. What a day! Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United mobile app

Haha. Touche' Capt. Actually, I would be there regardless. Last weekend was the first chance I've had to get up there this year. Im always there from July to Nov. Chautauqua Lake is always "hot" in my opinion... Love that place. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United mobile app

Maybe Chautauqua Lake isn't so Hot. There can be lots of rumors and exaggerations in our sport. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United mobile app

I like some of the ideas posted and I'm not a fan of some of them. But, as the original poster requested, I will not debate. Specific to Chautauqua: I'd like to see something done about the blue/green algae problem that seems to be getting worse. I'm not educated on the subject and don't know if there are any solutions, but I don't remember it being anywhere near as bas as it's been the last few years. I'm fairly certain I've gotten sick the last two falls from fishing the lake in this crap. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United mobile app

I like Chautauqua and we do well there. I've also fished the St Lawrence some in the fall and have caught a couple nice ones there. I haven't ever fished anywhere else in NY for muskies. I really just wanted to show you guys the tiger. Thanks again.

Thanks again guys. I phones take great pics...I don't even use a digital camera anymore. My biggest piece of advice for anyone who wants to try St Clair is to have realistic expectations. I've seen lots of guys come and go up there over the years. They think 50"ers and numbers of muskies are just going to jump in the boat and it's easy. They soon find out it is not and give up. It can be especially frustrating if someone else is tearing them up and you aren't. I've been going alot of years, know the lake very well, have a program pretty dialed in, and fish long hours. It's big, potentially dangerous water, and furious, hectic work to run lines, locate and stay on fish. My buddy that fishes from the other boat in our cottage and I always joke when somebody asks what our program is...the program is WORK. But, if you have a capable boat and equipment, lots of pretty colored lures, some knowledge and perseverance, it can be some of the best muskie fishing around.

This is what a pure strain great lakes muskie looks like. This was a 52" I released on the same trip. One of theses pure strain muskies spawned in the lake with a northern pike to create the tiger we released. All naturally produced... Not stocked. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United mobile app

You are correct that tigers are sterile. A tiger cannot reproduce. That tiger we released cannot reproduce. However, a tiger is originally created by a northern pike cross breeding with a pure muskie. This is what happened naturally, in the lake, to create the fish we released. It was not a stocked fish. NY captures pike and muskies and cross breed them in a hatchery to create tigers. They then stock the manufactured fish in lakes. Those tigers cannot reproduce either. Two different processes... One natural and one artificially manufactured. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United mobile app

Big pike prefer cold water . I'd guess you might be fishing too shallow for them. I have only fished the area in November but we catch some bigger pike while targeting muskies over deep water. Maybe try trolling deep diving cranks or use riggers outside the bays, in the main river, that you are catching the small ones in. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United mobile app

Thats right. Actually, there are no muskies stocked in lsc . Totally self sustaining natural reproduction. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United mobile app

Thanks for all the compliments guys. It definitely was a special fish. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United mobile app

I stay and fish the canadian side of the lake for the most part. I fish it from one end to the other depending on where i locate fish. There are launches in any creek/river. Where i launch can depend on wind , threat of weather, and where we are getting fish. Belle river is in the middle of the canadian side. Its pretty big water. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United mobile app

I know you guys like tigers, so I figured I'd share a pic. We are on our way home from our yearly St Clair trip. My buddy, Ed, that fished with me and my Dad released this beautiful natural tiger this week. 45.5" This was my 15th year fishing LSC and only the second tiger we've ever got there, so they are pretty rare. Caught on a Wiley, of course. One of my favorite fish I've ever had in my boat. Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United mobile app