perch/spot lock question

[Frogger]

Hey Guff, we’ve tried it, does it work? Yea, is it a pain in the butt to set up, monitor, fix , get the freakin thing caught in your motors…….yep. 

[Sk8man]

I don't keep any 13 inches plus so when I have done it I attached the balloon to a larger one hoping that it was part of a pack of good ones and they have a little more power to get away from the boat. Just take a length of mono with a size 2 hook on one end and  and hook it to the cartilage part of the mouth so it won't easily pull out. Tie up a relatively small balloon and then tie the other end of the line to it. You can usually release the fish afterward as it is often in good shape. They often try to get back to the school so that's your cue

Edited February 14 by Sk8man

[Frogger]

You could also try hooking behind the dorsal. And by all means make sure you pick him up when done………… Ive seen guys try to leave them out for the next day as a bouy marker. Bad mojo. 

[Gill-T]

Whenever I hear about ice fishermen losing their life walking on thin ice to go catch a 10” fish, I shake my head. The balloon trick adds a whole new level of Zany 🤪 to my view of perch fishermen as a group lol. Is there any support group available to help you guys??

[JJBat150]

53 minutes ago, Frogger said:

You could also try hooking behind the dorsal. And by all means make sure you pick him up when done………… Ive seen guys try to leave them out for the next day as a bouy marker. Bad mojo. 

 

It's 2024 - aren't you using implantable GPS chips?

[Sk8man]

1 hour ago, Gill-T said:

Whenever I hear about ice fishermen losing their life walking on thin ice to go catch a 10” fish, I shake my head. The balloon trick adds a whole new level of Zany 🤪 to my view of perch fishermen as a group lol. Is there any support group available to help you guys??

They gave up on us years ago when someone asked if we went to school with Fred Flintstone

[Lucky13]

1 hour ago, Gill-T said:

Whenever I hear about ice fishermen losing their life walking on thin ice to go catch a 10” fish, I shake my head. The balloon trick adds a whole new level of Zany 🤪 to my view of perch fishermen as a group lol. Is there any support group available to help you guys??

It's not just perch fishermen, the guys that would boat up to the pool at Goudy Station on the Susquehanna below Johnson City used to attach the balloon to a walleye, and follow it around.  I saw shore fishermen try it too, but it could be very frustrating when the balloon moved out of range.

[Gill-T]

 I am pretty sure they are using implanted devices but Dr Weidel may be taking notes for his Bloater Chub project. 

Edited February 14 by Gill-T

[Gill-T]

Just now, Gill-T said:

Sometimes it helps if you are unsure about something is to say it out loud.  “Today I am going to tie a balloon to a perch”.  😂 

 

[Lucky13]

4 hours ago, Gill-T said:

 I am pretty sure they are using implanted devices but Dr Weidel may be taking notes for his Bloater Chub project. 

It'd take a pretty long line to attach a balloon to a bloater!

[Pequod1]

I remember a story that Gambler told me about tying a ballon to a perch in a local bay.  If I’m not mistaken, the ballooned fish started taking off like crazy. Turns out a pike got it !

 

[bulletbob]

I like to fish as much as anyone, but really, tying a balloon to a perch, to track the school??.. I get it, heard of it being done, but does one REALLY need the fish that badly??.. I don't approach  my fishing like that.. If I can catch a half dozen perch, maybe the same amount of nice size sunnies, and few bonus bass [that I throw back], thats more than enough meat, decent enough action, and I consider it a worthwhile day... Maybe its just me, but I    don't need the fish that bad,,,, There's always another day.... bob

[Lucky13]

I did some of my icefishing in the Northeast cove of Irondequoit Bay over the years, and one thing that stood out for me, (and the observation was confirmed by a co-worker who also fished there but seldom when I was out), and that I also saw on Honeoye Lake at the north end, was that the perch and the sunfish liked different areas better.  If I was catching sunfish, I might get an occasional perch, and if I was catching good size perch, I was almost never catching sunfish.  In Honeoye I could attribute it to depth, but the NE Cove on I Bay is nearly uniform at about 3to 4 feet, and they would still usually be found in different parts of the cove, and at least two of the places were nearly constant.  But I'm with you, I noticed in other of your posts that you don't use electronics (lots of bux for a few perch), and you are not out to fill the freezer, maybe have a meal or two.  I carry enough stuff that I almost never use, don't need to confuse it all more with a bunch of balloons.

[Sk8man]

Looks as though some folks are taking this  discussion too seriously. I haven't done the balloon thing for more than 30 years. I only keep about 15 perch at most, and most of the time I give them either to friends I am fishing with or I fillet them for elderly folks that can't get out. My view that has been expressed to the DEC more than once is that the current limit of 50 (for the Finger Lakes) is absurd given the popularity of the species, which is also allowed for sale (which I don't support) and the current extreme fishing pressure on them in most places. In addition the advancement of stuff like Panoptics and the like has radically changed the equation as well as the fact that mild winters now allow more concentrated fishing for perch for much more of the season. More and more guys are winter fishing them (which I also do). I imagine my view on it isn't real popular and could generate some negative commentary but this is a forum for discussion so......

If the thread is carefully read it will be noted that the balloon thing was a reference to the past and was half in jest

 

Edited February 16 by Sk8man

[Gill-T]

I interpreted the ballon thing as a few people have tried it once or twice and realized it was silly and moved on.  No worries. 

[bulletbob]

Agree on the 50 fish limit.. I think a limit of 15 or 20 tops is more than generous enough... Commercial fishing for them????... infuriating to say the least....

[Lucky13]

I find it ironic that 45 years ago, when I was mainly a trout fisherman, DEC encouraged catch and release of trout by telling people to harvest and eat panfish, and now we're being told to let the big panfish go to spawn, keep only ones over 8" in the better sunfish lakes, and no more than 15 per day.  I've complained to DEC that the 3 with only 2 over 12" limit on brook trout is unrealistic on the Tug Hill, a person might only catch one or 2 over 12 inches in a season, but 5 hardly allows my wife and kids to get a taste if we want a meal.  There is currently a lot of controversy on the big pond about lack of staging fish in the fall, but the fleet is out filling boxes daily all through the spring.  Is the solution there to cut the limit to 2 silvers and one bonus LT per day, so there are still some 3 year olds and 2 year olds hanging around in the fall? And please don't say "stock more,"  put too many cows in a pasture, you end up with a pasture full of dead cows. Or should everything be catch and release except " trash fish," suckers, carp and drum, which are all edible and valued in some cultures?  And when you say " ban sale" please remember that under the drug laws, giving someone drugs is considered the same as sale.  A lot of the disadvantaged in the inner city rely on the local catch in the fish markets to get fresh fish, and for the portion of the African American community that migrated north, " Bream", or panfish are the fish of choice.  It's certainly a thorny problem, and as to beating a dead horse, I think you'll see a lot more discussion of it in the long run, not less.   
 

[bulletbob]

1 hour ago, Lucky13 said:

I find it ironic that 45 years ago, when I was mainly a trout fisherman, DEC encouraged catch and release of trout by telling people to harvest and eat panfish, and now we're being told to let the big panfish go to spawn, keep only ones over 8" in the better sunfish lakes, and no more than 15 per day.  I've complained to DEC that the 3 with only 2 over 12" limit on brook trout is unrealistic on the Tug Hill, a person might only catch one or 2 over 12 inches in a season, but 5 hardly allows my wife and kids to get a taste if we want a meal.  There is currently a lot of controversy on the big pond about lack of staging fish in the fall, but the fleet is out filling boxes daily all through the spring.  Is the solution there to cut the limit to 2 silvers and one bonus LT per day, so there are still some 3 year olds and 2 year olds hanging around in the fall? And please don't say "stock more,"  put too many cows in a pasture, you end up with a pasture full of dead cows. Or should everything be catch and release except " trash fish," suckers, carp and drum, which are all edible and valued in some cultures?  And when you say " ban sale" please remember that under the drug laws, giving someone drugs is considered the same as sale.  A lot of the disadvantaged in the inner city rely on the local catch in the fish markets to get fresh fish, and for the portion of the African American community that migrated north, " Bream", or panfish are the fish of choice.  It's certainly a thorny problem, and as to beating a dead horse, I think you'll see a lot more discussion of it in the long run, not less.   
 

 Good points.. However, remember, there are a  lot more people today than 25 years ago, and the  fresh water fisheries today are under intense pressure.. Boats, electronics, information access,  leisure time, all are light years ahead of just a few years ago... the fish are getting hit harder than ever with not many places they can retreat to.. I get it, people want to eat fish, however   wild yellow perch, crappies etc from inland lakes are NOT the answer.. They just can't be replaced as fast as they are caught and eaten.. If we can fish out the oceans, [and for many species we HAVE], we can fish out lakes and rivers,, very easily... aquaculture  is really the only way to feed the masses if they want fish, not commercial exploitation of very finite lakes.. They farm raise catfish, stripers, tilapia, shrimp, salmon, trout, geez, you would think plain old yellow perch would be a breeze... I don't have the answer to the dilemma, I'm not that bright, but commercial fishing for fresh water fish, is NOT the answer, unless its for something like the grass and bighead carb that are devastating the mid west and heading further east  each day... All I know is this- there are a LOT of guys that would go to a  small lake with only 50  big perch left, and go  and  catch all 50 If they had the ability to do so, and sleep like a baby  that night and never give it another thought.. We are dealing with human nature here,  and I believe what is written in God's Word-   "There is none that is righteous, no not one".

 I wish we could let honor, civility, and    respect for others dictate what we kill and eat, but thats not possible these days.  There are too many that care only for themselves, and will take all they can get no matter what its is, and that includes natural resources, including fish and game..

 

 I have seen it time and time and time again in my 69 years.   bob

Edited February 17 by bulletbob

[T-Rok]

I like what nys dec did with the sunfish and crappie laws. I would be fine with doing the same for yellow perch. It would be nice to not have to fish through 100 perch to get 25 large perch. I have seen people keep literally 3-4 inch perch in quantities while ice fishing. I asked someone once what do you do with them? and they told me they get a "french fry" of meat from them so they are good enough. I hate cleaning perch as it is (but have to do to eat them lol), but nothing is worse than cleaning one and saying man, why did I keep this one. Lol. I hate cleaning small perch the most. Seems like a waste. But, that being said.. seems to be no shortage of perch anywhere. Only seems to get harder and harder finding bigger perch. Maybe start with a 25 perch limit. Then add a size limit in a few years if necessary. A boat or shanty with 3 or 4 people keeping 150-200 perch seems like overkill and probably leads to small perch populations. Luckily perch can breed when they are still small, so there are still plenty of perch. I would just rather have more large perch. 

[bulletbob]

 Think about something you just wrote.. Its correct and very much in line with what I said ..In ANY fishery, the first sign of too much pressure is not a lack of  numbers of fish typically.. Its a lack of BIG fish...  Same thing time and time again throughout my lifetime I have seen it... Harder each year to get keepers, because as soon as they reach legal size they are taken... Thats all due to pressure... The Crappie minimum size is now 10 inches.. problem is, in a LOT of lakes there are no or very very few 10 inch Crappies left.. I know 2 lakes not too far from me that are loaded with Crappies... You can catch 100 on a good day.. however, you won't find even one over 7 inches. Biggest one I have caught personally in the last 5 or more years has been  9 inches..  I know some here will poo poo  the idea, but in my opinion, panfish are over exploited in NY state these days.. Many of us really don't have a taste for greasy dark  Alwewife stuffed trout from lakes, and prefer eating white mild panfish..   Theres a reason guys will tell you exactly where they caught that 15 lb Brown, what speed, how deep, lure type and pattern, water temp and time of day.. Yet ask where they caught that mess of Perch, Crappies, or these days even big Bluegills, and you'll get blank stares and icy silence.. Times have changed.... bob

[Lucky13]

Its been illegal to sell Gamefish in NYS as long as I can remember.  But when I lived in Binghamton, where many people concentrate on the big brown trout of the Cannonsville and Pepacton Reservoirs, if you were willing to pay the price and had been vetted by the seller, it was possible to buy trout fillets anytime you wanted.  When I came back here, I encountered a number of folks who said the reason you needed a snowmobile for Oneida was so you could shuttle the first limit of walleyes back to the car, one guy even had a "secret compartment" under his seat for them, and a stash spot in his truck.  So the limit is only as good as the ethics of the "sportsmen" doing the harvesting, and the ability of an underfunded and overworked Law Enforcement Division of DEC  to maintain the order.  

30 or 40 years ago, the wisdom on small panfish was increase harvest, the reason they were all stunted was because there were too many for the food base, that pasture full of malnourished or dead cows.  Maybe that has changed, it would be good to see the research.  But back about 10 or so years ago, the tiny perch complaint was common on Irondequoit Bay, until Clayton Massare (Squid's Bait)  and a few other pioneers tried the "big fish big bait" theory and went deeper, upsized their jigs and minnows, and started hauling in lots of 14 and 15 inchers.  All the embayments are the nursery for the Lake, so there you are always going to have huge schools of dinks, you have to keep moving to get away from them.  Some of the more recent arrivals to the USA have different cultural approaches to fish.  The Burmese immigrants in the Niagara Falls area fish in the effluent stream from the wastewater treatment plant and keep the Emerald Shiners for eating, along with everything else they catch.  The Vietnamese that I have known around here use the little fish to make fish sauce.  And it seems pretty obvious that the growing problem with snakeheads is being caused by SE Asian immigrants who want the fish they like in their new home.   But I suspect the "Powers that Be" in NYS are going to accuse you of being a bigot or worse if you tell all these people they have to change to conform to your system, even though that is the totally logical thing to tell them if we are basing things on Science.  And remember, equity says everyone has the same number of fish in their bucket at the end of the day, even if it is a mostly empty bucket.

Don't know what the answer is, but I can see lots of questions. 

[thejigger]

What GillT said about moving the anchor. Many times when I have picked the anchor off of bottom, I would circle back to casting distance from the disturbed bottom and catch perch. Sometimes the swinging back and forth while on anchor will help you catch fish.

[Lucky13]

It's chumming the spot with the natural invertebrates like bloodworms scuds, and insect larvae that live in the shallow mud.  It likely won't work if you are on smooth rock, but gravel and silt bottoms that can be disturbed are going to have lots of (to a perch) tasty bits in them.

Edited February 18 by Lucky13

[Sk8man]

Dragging a jig along bottom will work too

[Pequod1]

I have an  update for this thread on spot lock/perch.  The past two weeks I have been perching on a very clear lake. Visibility down to around 22’ . I wondered if the Minn kota would have any effect on the perch clearly visible under my boat so I watched how they reacted to me turning the Minn kota on and off.  Nothing!  I was quite surprised. I did this as shallow as 15’ with no effect on the perch.  
This was not a one day incident. I experimented on 4 separate days even  in glass calm conditions with the same results.