19 strand trolling wire

[CBish]

Matt,

No need to fill the board with those that do run it successfully, you see it is not them that have a problem it is the ones that have wire unraveling on their spools that have a problem. I do know that you have worked hard to identify the cause of failure of your line and in the future you will instruct your dealers and customers on how to properly install the wire onto reels. After all, how many of us used to just put wire on reels and then go fishing with it only to have the wire cut into itself and jam the spool. Only then did we learn that it is necessary to leave the line out behind the boat with a weight on it and respool it to insure that the line was wound tight enough.

I must confess that I returned my spool prior to installing it so I am not one of the guys with a problem. In fact, I have no wire issues at all because I have found that 50# Power pro is equally efficacious and more versatile than wire for my style of trolling.

I am finding more and more clients just do not want to land fish on the heavy lines -- dipsys and copper and while they may have their place in tourney and derby fishing; successful charter captains will need to adapt stratgies that continue to catch fish and keep clients happy and coming back. What good does it do you if you catch several more fish but your clients did not enjoy the experience?

Good luck, I now dump you out of the net to catch you another day!!!

CC

[Matthew]

Hi Carl,

When we first made the wire we did not realize how different from 7 strand 19 strand would be. We knew it was smoother and more flexible and less likely to kink but we did not know there would be a whole new learning curve on how to spool the wire. As you mentioned "in the future you will instruct your dealers and customers on how to properly install the wire onto reels." There has never been a more precise statement. In the future we will be putting instructions on how to spool the wire and we will be letting our dealers know. For anyone that has broken strands this has been the critical point.

I will attempt to explain what happens with wire in the spooling process as my final comment.

When wire comes off a larger spool and onto a smaller spool, stress builds up in the line, if fingers are used to apply tension to get the wire to spool tighter onto the reel then the stress increases in relationship to the finger pressure applied as the fingers tension is forcing the strands upward into the line. If enough finger tension is applied, as the stress builds in the line, a stand could pop loose from the group of stranded wire and eventually this strand will become a broken strand. If the line is used without relieving the build up stress then many other issues will occur such as, line digging into itself, twists happening in the line when setting lines, broken strands etc. It is important to note that 99% of the cause of broken strands occurs due to pent up stress in the line from the initial spooling process. The other 1% would be due to either exerting too much force on the line beyond the lines breaking strength or using equipment that causes excess friction on the line.

The solution.

When spooling from the larger spool onto a smaller spool have someone keep slight tension on the larger spool. Guiding the wire with one finger is a good idea to get a even spool but do not use two fingers as our natural reaction is to squeeze the wire. When spooling is complete then add a ball bearing snap swivel to the end and attach a weight on the end of the snap as Carl mentioned. This will remove all stress from the wire. You are now ready to fish.

[BlueEye]

Matt -

Great explanation! Thank you for sharing your insight and expertise in this area. I am sure this info will be extremely beneficial to many LOU members who use wire on a daily fishing basis.

Thank you -

Chad

[salmonhunter4]

I had done all of the above. New diawa 57 reels new diamond roller rods person holding spools for tenison. second time let line out behind boat and reeled back in. the same thing happened. BROKEN STRANDS. So I have tried all the above. I still have the same recomendations. DO NOT USE IT.

[stinger]

Matt,.........thanks for explaining what is causing the problems with the 19 strand wire. Most of the guys (& me) will understand the cause & effect of the spooling process. I was ready to just leave this new(er) style wire to guys like you and continue to use the 40# 7 strand wire from McMaster-Carr that has been good to me. I remember the first year I started using stranded wire and all the problems I had with kinks & break-offs. It was only after a few of the guys here explained how to treat wire did most of the issues go away.

When it's time for me to respool with new wire I'll surely consider the 19 strand wire now that I understand what to do and how to avoid the main issues (kinda like women, they each have their own little piss-offs that you need to understand ). In the meantime I'll also be watching this topic for further input from the guys to see if these issues disappear with experience.

Again thanks for explaining.

[Schools Out]

I am going to have to side with matt on this one. I work as the 1st Mate about Captain George's boat "Good Times" and we have been running the same wire for over a year (100's and 100's of hours, and many, many fish) and still have the original knot on the swivel snap (no trim due to pig tail). I love the stuff.. its smooth, easier to work with, and doesnt kink.. also when a fish inevitably run into the %$^ing dipsy wire your line doesnt get tore to hell (I do replace it) but it lessens the chance of a break off... I think its a good product, if you dont, dont use it, if you have an opinion voice yours.

[chinook]

Matthew- being in the manufacturing business for over 35 years I would like to think I know a thing or 2 about stress in material and machined induced stress. Having said that, before any of the local tackle shops out of the Oak had the 19 strand, I ordered 2 spools from Michigan Angler over this past winter- On my last trip, a couple weeks back, I noticed the same things that Capt. Carl touched on, and actually noticed that on the wire spool itself ( from Mich. Angler) coming off I noticed some frays before it even went on the reel-Bottom line is that one of the tackle shops out of the Oak inquired about this back to your Co., and from what I saw -I read your response to them ( this was app 6 weeks ago) is that the initial batch ( small dia. spools if memory serves me right) that went out had flaws in it. Could you please clarify this or explain? Going to give you the benefit of doubt here, but if there is a defective batch out circulating, what are you, the manufacturer going to do about this other than post on how to spool? I have to agree with SH 4, in that most who are probably trying this wire, know how to go about and respool- Thank you for your time and follow up- Duane

[Matthew]

Hi Duane,

As soon as we realized there was an issue with one of our batches of wire we sent emails to all of our retail stores and we put up a notice on our website. We told the stores to exchange the wire from this batch without question and below is a copy of our notice from our website.

Notice

The March of 2009 batch of wire was manufactured with 3% of the batch having fraying issues. This wire is on the 2 ¾" diameter spools. We apologize for any inconvenience this may have caused our customers and will immediately replace those wire spools affected.

Customers who purchased their wire through a retailer, please see the retailer if you believe you have fraying issues. Customers who purchased online, please send us an email.

Side note: We do not recommend our wire on any of the Diawa reels.

[Broadhorizons]

Matthew,

Why wouldn't you recommend the wire for Daiwa reels? How is this different from Okuma, Penn, or Shimano reels? I don't have anything else but Daiwa and both of my 19 stand wires are on Accudepth Plus reels. I'm sure there are a lot of wire divers on Sealines or AD+'s. I'm just wondering if there's something I should watch out for.

Thanks,

[Matthew]

Matthew,

Why wouldn't you recommend the wire for Daiwa reels? How is this different from Okuma, Penn, or Shimano reels? I don't have anything else but Daiwa and both of my 19 stand wires are on Accudepth Plus reels. I'm sure there are a lot of wire divers on Sealines or AD+'s. I'm just wondering if there's something I should watch out for.

Thanks,

Watch for the wire overlapping or crossing over itself whereby the wire on the bottom of the overlap is coming off first. Typically this happens when the line comes off the reel too quickly and overlaps. This issue has been brought to our attention mostly with the Diawa reels and therefor we do not recommend them.

[momay4000]

Matthew,

I don't mean to jump in here, but I recently respooled all of my Diawa Sealine reels with your 19 strand wire. I have had my eye on this line for awhile now and waited until I purchased two new reels for re-spooling. Could you please clarify how a Diawa reel is different from any other level wind reel and why you don't have any recommendations with your retailers which mentions that Diawa reels are "not" recommended?

I haven't noticed any fraying - yet - and we have landed some mighty nice kings using your line and I'm concerned that it might cause a problem down the line.

Thanks,

- Chris

[Matthew]

Matthew,

I don't mean to jump in here, but I recently respooled all of my Diawa Sealine reels with your 19 strand wire. I have had my eye on this line for awhile now and waited until I purchased two new reels for re-spooling. Could you please clarify how a Diawa reel is different from any other level wind reel and why you don't have any recommendations with your retailers which mentions that Diawa reels are "not" recommended?

I haven't noticed any fraying - yet - and we have landed some mighty nice kings using your line and I'm concerned that it might cause a problem down the line.

Thanks,

- Chris

Hi Chris, the Diawa's that we don't recommend are the older style with the wire guides for levelwind. The problem is the gap is so wide with that style levelwind that the line may be able to lay over itself. The newer ones should not be an issue so you don't have any worries. Enjoy fighting those big kings!

[Stras88]

I have one roll on right now. I had to replace it once (company was good about it) because it was the old "wide-spool" version which birdnested and frayed. The new roll doesn't nest, but it has frayed in the last 6 feet (thankfully not deeper). I have cut that back and am now keen to see if the problem comes back. It is a better knot tying line and doesn't kink as much, but if the fraying continues, then I would pass. TBD I guess.

[B8buket]

I recieved my replacement spool (thanks Matthew)

I'm still running the original spool , even though its a couple

of hundred feet shy, no problems as of yet, but I'm a weekender

that mainly fishes the Finger Lakes.

I'm in the process of purchasing another wire setup. When it comes in

I'll spool up with the 19 strand.

Everyone deserves a second chance, because of the fact that Matthew and company have

alerted everyone of the issue and are in the process of fixing the the problem , while

standing behind their product and replacing 'bad spools' I think they should be commended.

In this day and age ,its hard to find too many companies that will go out of their way to

make their customers happy.

I say good job and hope everything works out

Thanks again

Vic

[FSNmachine]

Just saw this topic and might add I got my first spool early last season and did have it fray on me. This spool was the early batch and Mathew replaced it. I also know he has changed the manufacturing process. Since then I ran the new spool last season and enjoyed the experience. Some of you have said it is no difference than 50 LB power pro but there is. The feel and transmission of the pulls and shakes of a fish is much greater down the wire as opposed to 50lb braid. A friend of mine was not convinced till we took a couple of reels and roller rods out on his boat. His first reaction before he even caught a fish was that tripping a dipsy was like flipping a switch. You may have to take some extra care and handling to spool this stuff but to me the experience is worth it. Since I got my first spool replaced I have had no problem with fraying or kinking using for most of last season. I have used it on my boat on Lake Huron Erie and Ontario and my friend's boat as well as a Charter Captains boat on Lake Michigan. I will be looking at getting some more wire as well as some roller rods for this up coming season and looking forward to getting out there with it. I also got a roller tip from Mathew that I will be using this season.