Id want to know

[MyKey]

Okay, only posting this as I would want to know if its in my back yard. Friend of mine was driving across the top of the hill on Bevier st Bing this week. He saw, stopped and watched a big cat. He's not a hunter, BSer. He's a big dude but his comment was I was scared sitting in the car. I am looking forward to the deer season as much as everyone and wish all good luck and be safe, but will be watching my back as I'm not more than 10 miles from that spot and we've had plenty of other reports over the last few yrs. We know what DEC says but they are Govmt.

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[ray koziatek]

yes their are cougers in NY and some big bobcats too...if the wife packs yer lunch with a bag full of raw hamburg ...she knows it too

[seasquirrel]

I have had some pretty credible people give me the same report around Greene/ chenango forks area. I have never seen any indications of a big cat myself

[Paul Czarnecki]

Just PLEASE don't tell us the story about a friend's uncle's cousin who saw the DEC stocking them. That story is going around again......why does it always seem to involve an "uncle" and/or a "cousin"?

[on the lam]

I have had some pretty credible people give me the same report around Greene/ chenango forks area. I have never seen any indications of a big cat myself

After 18 road cokes guys in Greene have also seen Bigfoot and Jimmie Hoffa

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[RUNNIN REBEL]

Would you guy,s believe me, if I said I have one chasing down a fawn on 1 of my videos & we kept its paw tracks (frozen in ice) in my buddies freezer. Took the track imprint to a taxidermist & local veterinary. Vet confirmed mountain cat track approx. 100#'s.

[Paul Czarnecki]

Would you guy,s believe me, if I said I have one chasing down a fawn on 1 of my videos & we kept its paw tracks (frozen in ice) in my buddies freezer. Took the track imprint to a taxidermist & local veterinary. Vet confirmed mountain cat track approx. 100#'s.

I "might" believe it Jerry, IF I could see the video myself and I would LOVE to see the track imprint so that I could cast it.

Any chance you could post it here?

[RUNNIN REBEL]

Paul,

The video is good, BUT the TELL TALE TRUTH is confirming the location of the video being in N.Y. state.... The D.E.C. had ALOT of verification processes to the point YOU COULD not convince their forensic team. Heck all you would needed to do is watch video and go sit there and hunt SAME SPOT i had camera stuck to tree. Big cats were native to N.Y. before bounties put them to extinction here. The frozen tracks keep getting smaller & smaller even in the freezer. Got to the point that if it is such a big secret, why fight for this??? Me & hunt buddy decide best to NOT let/show/give D.E.C. directions & permission & all the info needed for FREE REIGN to our hunting properties. Who knows with this state, we would suddenly see tax audits or fines for old tires that just showed up on our properties. Not worth it with NO UPSIDE to proving this.

[Paul Czarnecki]

I would still LOVE to see the video Jerry. You don't have to "prove" anything to me---your word is good enough but I can explain the DEC's skepticism.

They don't "want" to be able to confirm the existence of mountain lions in the state. PA is the same way. Because cougars are federally protected under the CITES treaty (and a BUNCH of other regs) if a cougar were to be confirmed in a state where there weren't any that state would have to come up with a management plan for them. Management plans, for any animal or bird, require YEARS of research and studies involving tens of thousands of man hours and hundreds of thousands of dollars. As we all know, the welfare babies in NYC and their enabling geniuses in Albany have depleted NY's funds to the point where only the absolute necessities get money. Simply put, NY (and PA) cannot AFFORD to "find" even a single cougar! That said, in talking to F & G officials in both states I can tell you that in virtually every instance of a reported cougar where the "cougar" was not a dog, coyote, housecat or bobcat, the cat turned out to be an escaped or released pet that, in a lot of cases, had been defanged and declawed. However, wild cougars seem to be migrating eastward as the metro areas in their home ranges expand. I'm sure its possible we will eventually see some wild cougars making their homes in NY and PA but we simply don't have enough "country" to support a wild breeding population. Because of that fact the DEC and the PA Game Commission will continue to deny their existence.

In fact, it reminds me of a line from the best fishing movie of all time, JAWS---"You're going to continue ignoring this particular problem until it swims up and bites you on the ASS!"

Gotta get some fish painted so I can sit in a tree stand this afternoon. God, I LOVE my job!

[seasquirrel]

Pete, I think I saw Elvis Saturday night. My brother came over to my house to have some of those road cokes.

[Gill-T]

I don't know what to think. Is it possible there are mountain lions in NY.......sure. A neighboring property owner "swears" she saw a mountain lion cross the road next to her house during the summer months in back to back years. I have hunted the area for twenty-seven years and have NEVER even come across a footprint of a mountain lion, so I remain skeptical. Now, about twenty years ago I came across a dead coyote that died in a failed stream crossing which was LONG before coyotes were confirmed repopulating the southern tier and everyone thought I was nuts.......so who knows? A few years ago, we were driving out of the mountains of Virginia on route to the NC coast, I witnessed on the road dead what appeared to be a Mountain Lion. What was the line in Jurassic Park....."nature finds a way".

[ray koziatek]

http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/load ... 11089.html

http://www.buckmanager.com/2009/05/21/m ... whitetail/

http://www.google.com/url?q=http://foru ... UulESKp9eA

[Paul Czarnecki]

Entertaining reads Ray. It amazes me how many mountian lions are seen crossing the road yet none EVER get hit by vehicles. They also must only cross roads in the summer and hibernate in the winter since no tracks are ever found in the snow. The people seeing them must be the ONLY people in this country without cell phones or cameras because no one has EVER taken a picture. It also amazes me how many "black mountain lions" or "panthers" are spotted---especially since there is no such thing as a "black mountain lion" .

Finally, it has always amazed me how easily people will buy into faked photos or embellished and "localized" stories accompanying legitimate photos---"the cougar on the porch from Hornell" which was actually taken in Colorado, the deer being dragged by the cat in front of the trail camera supposedly captured in Potter county, PA was actually taken in Texas and the snowy pic of the "three cougars sitting in the driveway in PA" was actually taken in Colorado---the CO plates can clearly be seen on the vehicles...LOL. I also continue to be amazed by the sheer number of people who zealously buy into these stories and perpetuate the rumors without questioning anything. People just "want" to believe I guess.

I would LOVE to see LEGITIMATE documentation of a WILD (not a released pet) mountain lion in NY or PA but I also LOVE to debunk all the myths and rumors going around about them...

[on the lam]

Well here ya go Paul "Mr skepticism".... I just happened to have a camera at lunch yesterday and guess what I saw. Hmmmm. So go ahead and say something now

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[Paul Czarnecki]

Hmmmmm......yet another fake! Everyone knows Ronald McDonald would never willingly sit next to a Bigfoot---he's still smiling! That pic has been photoshopped with Ronald McDonald added in place of the alien that was in the original. I KNOW because my best friend's uncle's cousin was in the military and took the actual picture! It was confiscated by the government when they raided his house in the black helicopters.

[on the lam]

[Stinky Finger]

I lived in Allegany county for a few years but I'll spare you the "me too" stories, there were quite a few.

Check this out if you are interested in NY mountain lions-

www.trackincats.com

-Dan.

[Traveling Circus]

I've been running coyote/fox with hounds for a few years now.... the group I run with mainly hunts the Mt. Morris area..... sometimes "a little" N/S/E or W of there.... We cover a fair amount of ground from the end of deer season to the end of March..... never seen a track or or heard a story.... there are "dog gangs" all over the state, and I'd guess that if there are cougars roaming around, somebody's hound would have put one in a tree...

[Stinky Finger]

I've been running coyote/fox with hounds for a few years now.... the group I run with mainly hunts the Mt. Morris area..... sometimes "a little" N/S/E or W of there.... We cover a fair amount of ground from the end of deer season to the end of March..... never seen a track or or heard a story.... there are "dog gangs" all over the state, and I'd guess that if there are cougars roaming around, somebody's hound would have put one in a tree...

One did just exactly that so I was told by a friend of mine who lives in Belfast, Art Kellog.

Art is no BSer either, I believe him. He claims he and his brother were coon hunting in Caneseraga in 1979 when their hounds treed a cougar. He says they gathered up the dogs and left, they wanted no part of it.

Another man I knew when I lived there was Frank O'Brian, if he is still alive he would be in his 90's now. Mr. O'Brian was the county historian and quite a wealth of knowledge about Allegany county. He told me about one of his neighbors, a farmer in Scio who entered his barn one day and surprised a mountain lion inside that ran out the back as he came in the front, "Bobcats don't have four foot tails" is what the farmer said about it, that was 1937.

My Dad is big in the family tree geneology stuff and I read a passage in a book he had on NY units of the Civil War when he was researching my Great Great Grandfather who was a Union Brigadier General from Franklinville. The unit was mustered into service at Belmont in Allegany county and marched to Salamance where it was to join with a larger group and march to Pittsburg where they were to board trains for Washington. The Cattaraugus county boys wanted no part of walking throught he wilderness of Pa and instead built rafts at Salamanca and rode south to Pittsburg on the Allegheny river "because of all the wildcats in the area". Apparently the region had quite a reputation for people disappearing and this was attributed to cougars. 1861 was quite a while ago but still, the area was known for these big cats.

I have a theory about these sightings and the rumors that these cats are being released, I don't think they are being released. It is claimed that the eastern mountain lion was completely extirpated from the southern tier of NY and northwest Pa by 1890, how could anyone know for sure? The cougar is a mighty slick animal and I'm guessing a few hung on and learned out of necessity to keep a very low profile. They do exist in Va and WVa so I don't think it is so far fetched to think a very few may still be out there.

Stranger things have happened.

-Dan.