next year already :)

[steelfire]

Wow this board has been dead. What do you guys think about next years salmon class. I have heard both it will be good and it will suck. Some have said there were lots of 2 year old caught so it will be good next season....any thoughts??? I just re booked our summer vacation house in Fairhaven for two weeks end of July, so thats what got me thinking about salmon!!

[ray koziatek]

their ant gonna be any so sit down!

[steelfire]

so sit down??????

[on the lam]

"Salmon CLASS"

[steelfire]

"Salmon CLASS"

Oh I see now, "sit down" for a salmon class. Ahh I see. LOL

[on the lam]

I'm sorry to admit I understand his warped sense of humor

[Capt Vince Pierleoni]

Guys are probably taking exception to the comment; "this board has been dead." Actually, I've been surprised at how much activity there has been, with holidays upon us and lots of hunting going on. There is quite alot of Salmon buzz starting, and it will only intensify.

The topic you have brought up is one often discussed on this forum, and in person. Even the closest observors of this fishery, and DEC fishery managers can only speculate. So many factors come into play such as, stocking practices, predators present when stocking takes place(although holding pen projects have certainly helped), food present for fingerlings, angling pressure on "skippers"(1st year Salmon), baitfish migrations, baitfish densities(too much bait makes Kings extra hard to "foil"), water clarity, temp inversions, ect,ect,ect. It's a two part equation, will the population be up, and will conditions be favorable so I can realize that upswell. Most of us feel that we may not be totally out of the woods on the older classes, but they should be big again. Everywhere we went around the lake last year the Alewives were ample. In addition, we are currently experiencing an explosion of smelt, they put lots of weight on Kings. As for Kings in the 5-16lb class, there should be a strong representation to tear up your set. Good Luck.

[steelfire]

Thank you Capt Vince Pierleoni,

I meant this reports section had been dead. I have been in the other forums and see there goin strong. I was hopeing somebody like you would reply with meaningful information. I caught a lot of the 5 to 15lbers both off of Fairhaven and Oswego this summer and was curious what it meant for next years class. Thanks again for the info!

[LongLine]

Baitfish seem to be up. Smelt numbers increase definitely surprised a lot of people this year. Heck of a lot of little salmon caught this year everywhere on the lake. Fishing pressure was down but catches were up.

So the question is should a new salmon rod & reel be on your Christmas list?

HEL[ YES...It's gonna be a great year! (But be prepared to go deep)

Tom B.

(LongLine)

[steelfire]

Baitfish seem to be up. Smelt numbers increase definitely surprised a lot of people this year. Heck of a lot of little salmon caught this year everywhere on the lake. Fishing pressure was down but catches were up.

So the question is should a new salmon rod & reel be on your Christmas list?

HEL[ YES...It's gonna be a great year! (But be prepared to go deep)

Tom B.

(LongLine)

Thats what I was thinking too. Plus I'm looking forward to tangling with somemore big atlantics. Are biggest was a 17lber this year, hoping for a 20lber for next year!!

[rdebadts]

Based on the number of "skippers" and shorts I caught this year (sometimes more than a dozen per day, all released if possible) there should at the very least be alot of those 8-15 lb fish hanging around next year.

Capt vince brings up an important issue with "angling pressure on the skippers".... Has anyone found a method to avoid hooking those little buggers, or minimizing the pressure? They are as aggressive as anything I catch anywhere- hell, they'll even hit mag spoons and dodgers. I try to dehook them without even touching them, but it is not always possible.

At the Oak a few days this year I literally couldnt get away from them, no matter where I went

[Tim Bromund]

Like you, there were time last year out ogf Olcott where we literally just couldn't troll out of them. One thing I think you can do is use a release that clearly transmits to the rod that there is a skipper on so you aren't dragging them for long periods of time. That is one of the big reasons that I like the Scotty Power grip releases over the blacks style release (besides the fact that I just do not like the blacks and really don't understand their popularity, but that's a separate issue).

Like you said they are super aggressive and hit everything in the spread, all you can do is reef em in a quick as possible and just take em to the side of the boat grab the hook with your pliers and twist em off without bringing them in the boat.

Tim

[steelfire]

I too use the scotty Releases. They are especially helpful if you hook up with small steelhead or browns. You know thy are there. Now is next years class of salmon from the big fall drought of 4 years ago??

[Tim Bromund]

I too use the scotty Releases. They are especially helpful if you hook up with small steelhead or browns. You know thy are there. Now is next years class of salmon from the big fall drought of 4 years ago??

YES, This year is the year that the bulk of the kings from the 2008 reduced stocking will be maturing. IMO, it still remains to be seen what the survival of that year class looks like, since there have been past events that resulted in reduced stocking but fine fishing that suggest that there may not be a concrete correlation between overall stocking numbers and year class strength, it all boils down to the level of survival of the fish that were stocked.

Tim

[Capt Vince Pierleoni]

Great topic. Sometimes the only thing you can do is leave the area entirely. Sometimes you can pattern them, as to where they are on the feed in relation to the thermocline, and stay away from them depth-wise. This is not always the case, and sometimes you have to move to prevent damaging many. If you do rip a gill or get profuse bleeding from the tongue, take that fish rather than throw it back dead just to kill another bigger fish, it's the right thing to do.

The advice given earlier about getting them in quick, and flipping them off without handling them if possible is correct. Guys must be taking better precautions in recent years, as we regularly catch large kings with healed up slightly altered jaws. Even with non "tattle tale" releases like Blacks, a trained eye can read the rods and cables for a "hitchhiker", and release most of them unscathed. Thanks guys for bringing this up.

[rdebadts]

As far as the Releases are concerned- I have had nothing but good experience with the black releases. If you crank them down tight (which you should anyways), you can immediately see a change in the rod or cable angle that indicates that you have a skipper hanging. I can count on one hand the number of fish that I have "dragged to death" a fish, no matter how small, in my trolling career. And thanks for the insight Vince; heres an example of a fish that now has 2 holes in his lips...

[A-TOM-MIK]

The typical pinch-pad style release has had a bad reputation for many years when selectively targeting Kings as a general rule, a black release is a popular choice for a reason, as with most majority votes there is usually a reason. It is obvious that some anglers have had luck with the scotty releases and through various posts around the forums there are more who also like the scotty's. IMO the black release is the current best answer in a release on the market today. My tourney experience is broad, I simply fish with some of the best on Lake Ontario, all of which use blacks 100% & pretty much all would not leave the dock without them especially if fishing a tourney where every bite is utmost crucial. Then again when targeting outside the adult Chinook class of fish I have witnessed at times top teams who have "scaled down" to use pinch pad style releases with long lead's for that ease of detecting smaller fish. I agree with Vince 100% that the trained eye can detect a skippy or smaller fish a high percentage of times on a black, I feel that would be comparable to a skill rating from an angler who uses scotty's. I remember also targeting adult Kings but being plagued with skippers through more than just 1 tournament in 2010, with experience there was never a question. BTW I pay full shot for all the black releases I use. For the greener angler who are a great breed I might add, you may be onto something Tim with the endorsement of a leadered pinch pad style release for an ultimate conservation of all species.

During my involvement on the lake in 2010 from the Salmon River to Dalhousie then to Darlington and quite a few ports inbetween, and even different time frames associated in a comparison of past years I feel there were "ample" 2 year olds, not over-whelming by any means but ample. The quality however of the same 2 year olds could possibly be the best in the history of the lake IMO. Without my knowledge of the same info from the time frame of the late 80's to about 2000 (when we took 40 lb Kings), and only experience of the eastern basin at that time, we could be in for another year of quality Kings never witnessed. I will never forget day 1 of the 2010 Whitby KOTL when over 30 teams had a 20+ lb. average with 5 Kings. Back to the 2 year olds: From tourney to tourney I made it a point to take a bit of time and question the biologists taking scales samples, weights etc., we had an enormous quality of fish in our 2 year olds, not quantity but quality, 2 year olds to over 20 lbs. and not just 1 or 2. There were 50,000 Adults from CA that had like clippings to our 1 and 2 year olds (these from 3 years ago at the time), so some of these "thought to be" 2 year olds were actually adults, but after testing there were still many 2 year olds in excess of 15 lbs. Two fish from the 2010 Oswego KOTL were 26 and 28 lbs. and were missing an adipose. I never found out what they were but I am sure the next series of State Of The Lake Meetings will tell the final tail. If I were anyone reading this post I would be there as this info could not be more pertinent to the interest of us all. Skippers were abundant no doubt, right into our river runs from my area as there were simply more than ever. Hopefully as many more that did not run the rivers will yield good things. If these fish grow like they did last year and we are taking them into the season at 15+ lbs. Woo freak'n Hoo !!!! Add the quality of the adults as well and my optimistic mind says 2011 isn't looking too bad.

Tom

[on the lam]

Who is gonna take responsibility for the rough treatment this guy got as a skippy? not me!

As an adult he did prefer A Tom Mik flys

[A-TOM-MIK]

You know what they say Pete

They have a better chance if let go then they do in the cooler

The proof is in the pudding

That one was missing a good percentage of it's face and fought another day

(:

Tom

[on the lam]

Good point Tom, I cant swear to the fish's weight, but it was give or take 30#. he was as healthy as any other. Except for a face only his mother could love

[A-TOM-MIK]

lmao

[Tim Bromund]

Tom, the 30+ lb king in the pic I submitted in your photo contest was adipose clipped. I figured there was no possible way that was a 2 yo, so I e-mailed the photo to Mike Wilkinson the Region 9 DEC Biologist who oversees our Olcott Pen Project and asked his opinion. He told me that a couple of the Pen Projects on the North Shore, specifically Wellington and Barcovan, have been adipose clipping their pen fish since 2006, so in Mike's opinion, it is likely that my fish was a 3 or 4 yo fish from one of those projects. Those bigger kings from the Oswego KOTL were very likely fish from one of those pen projects as well.

regarding the releases, I just hate that style release, and I'm hardly a greenie. I've used blacks on other peoples boats and hated them, I currently have a similar style release that I won in the raffle at the LOTSA Club Tournament installed inline on my probe rigger and can't even begin to tell you how much I regret putting that on that rigger. The first thing I will do before the start of the season will be to remove that and go back to (In my opinion anyways) the vastly superior Scotty Release. I can load the line in the Scotty Faster than the blacks, I can absolutely load the crap out of my rods and NEVER get a false release with the Scotty, yet can clearly see skips etc. I don't care if every so called expert on the lake is using them, I can't stand them. It's really just a personal preference thing IMO.

Tim

[Iceman]

Tim; sit down & relax, you are entitled to your opinion for sure (even if it is questionable), but you cannot argue with success, & Blacks releases are the ones to use if you want to maximize hookups, have you forgotten that this is a put & take fishery???

This is beginning to sound like the downspeed & temp foray earlier this year. Let it go!!!!!!!!

[A-TOM-MIK]

I realize your not a newbie Tim, wasn't my intention towards you at all !!!!

See you soon bud

Tom

(:

[Mike523]

What's the carp class looking like for the spring? :