Free Sliders

[carpedium]

Alright.. I have got to about 2009 on the takle/techniques subforum so far - and just have a quick question to be sure that I understand this right.

Correct me if I am wrong:

Free slider/cheater - Is basically a snap swivel hooked directly to the mainline with no means of securing it from moving vertically. This is deployed by setting the mainline down on the rigger a certain distance and clipping the snap swivel on the mainline during the decent of the rigger ball.

Fixed cheater AKA Mup rig - The same snap swivel hooked to the mainline in the same fasion, except it is also clipped to a rubber band half hitched to the downrigger cable.

Questions:

It seems to me that a free slider would eventually make its way down to the downrigger ball without any way of stopping it. I take it this never happens?

A Fixed cheater hooked with a rubber band would seemingly decrease the amount of resistance needed for the fish to get a good hook set and stay on. What do people do to mitigate this?

Thanks,

Matt

[rshubuck]

To answer your first question. Your main line will arch with the current and boat speed so the free slider will not reach your downrigger ball untill you release your main line. If you leave a little slack in your main line the greater the arch in your main line.

Fixed sliders can be made several ways. 1 is the half hitched rubberband as you mentioned, 2 is have the lenght of the leader you want and tie a swivel on one end. Next, slide an off shore release or planerboard release without the showercurtain clip onto the leader. Tie another swivel to the other end of the leader and you have a cheater. This works really well. Just clip the swilvel to your main line and pinch the release in the desired location.

3rd which I currently use the most is the roemer.

Hope this helps.

[Mickey Finn]

Not sure if you totally got the free slider right. Let your bottom line all the way down to where you want to run it first and then clip on the free slider and carefully toss it in the water. It will slide to the back of the belly in the line which is about half way to the ball.

rshubuck, I like the idea with the offshore. I think I'll give that a try. How are you using the roemer? Are you attaching the fixed slider to it or just adding a second rod?

[ray koziatek]

dont use a roemer,for a slider ,unless you mean the liberator, the alberta clipper is a tad easier than the liberator....

[Big Dave]

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=19170&p=108812#p108812 There are pictures here. I use the offshore planner board release with a short piece of 50# than a bead swivel. clip a freeslider to the bead swivel to make it a fixable one.

[rshubuck]

I use the roemer liberators which is the third pic down in the above topic. I just attach a free slider setup onto the roemer to make it fixed. 1 rod thats it. What I like about them is you just slip your main line into the grove and turn this piece which locks it on your line. Then you pull the tab up which pinches your your main line to make it a fixed. When your reeling your line back in with a fish you can either take the cheater off or just keep reeling and when the roemer hits your eye let it will slide down to the fish. It just gives you the option.

Personally I could go either way between the offshore releases or Roemers. I'm not a fan of the rubber bands but they do work well.

Alberta Clipper sounds like your style all right

[ray koziatek]

Opps OK OK so at least i started it with a vowel......

http://www.fish307.com/legendaryproductsreleases.aspx

I cant help it if those canadians cant spell

[carpedium]

Great info, thanks everyone.

I really like the idea of the liberators, as they will automatically slide down when they hit the rod tip. Also, on the picture taken of the package - it looks like you can stack two of them on your line. Has anyone done more than one fixed cheater using rubber bands? How well does that work?

[jekyll]

I use they Elberta Clip-ers and they work great. I recommend using the white ones (Sinker Clip-er for snap wieghts) for fixed sliders. They are a bit strong than are the gray clips.

[Silver Fox]

Don't stack 2. You will have a mess. Also, according to some video footage, free sliders have been found working their way down very close to the ball. Give me a call and ill show you the Dreamweaver snap we use. It has a rubber coating on one end so it doesn't slide down. Drop your ball to a desired depth and snap it on.

[ Post made via Android ]

[rshubuck]

I don't recommend stacking them for one really good reason. If a stick or some weeds slide down your line it may release the Roemer. It will be a big mess!

[carpedium]

haha...

I did something wrong this weekend as when I pulled lines in I found a full fledged 100-wrap bimini twist 10 feet long at the end with two spoons somewhere in the middle on a free slider. I'll give you a call this week Scott- didn't want to bother you given the preparation for the tourney's, etc. last week.

Is there anything that is supposed to go at the end of the mainline before the swivel to prevent one swivel from passing through the other?

[Mortigan]

Chowder mentioned that in one of the other slider threads - "I like to slip a bead on my main line b4 I tie on my snap swivel - that way when the slider gets down there it doesn't fetch up on the swivel and start to wrap."

[carpedium]

That works

[Mortigan]

I think you and I are doing the same reading, at about the same time, on this site (which is terrific, by the way). I think I'm fishing out of a smaller boat though which is going to restrict what we can do. What are you fishing out of?

[carpedium]

I fish out of a 17.5' open bow Deep V powered by a 70hp OB. There is not nearly enough room to fish properly out of for more than 3 people, but it is a great boat for what it is. Without any trolling bags or kicker, etc. I can get down to 1.9, and with a slight tap on the throttle, the next step is 2.5, then 3.0. I'm actually very impressed with the way it is trolling in spite of its size, etc. How about you?

[carpedium]

I fish out of a 17.5' open bow Deep V powered by a 70hp OB. There is not nearly enough room to fish properly out of for more than 3 people, but it is a great boat for what it is. Without any trolling bags or kicker, etc. I can get down to 1.9, and with a slight tap on the throttle, the next step is 2.5, then 3.0. I'm actually very impressed with the way it is trolling in spite of its size, etc. How about you?

[Mortigan]

Pretty similar, actually - it's an older 18 ft aluminum Starcraft (deep v) with a Merc Force 125 and a trolling plate. We can get down to 1.5 but running anywhere from 2.0 to 3.0 takes constant throttle adjustment - we're considering trolling bags. We had a hell of a time Sunday keeping any kind of constant trolling speed - we ran east (ish) with the waves and then NW into them - & turning was scary. With no VHF yet, we didn't want to head deeper.

[carpedium]

Our electronics showed a pretty consistant speed graph, we got all of our strikes at speeds of 3.0+ yesterday. I have never used a trolling plate, but I hear really good things about the bags.

We ended up heading in around 11 because one of the people we went out with was hurling a lot and it was getting rather rough.

[Silver Fox]

I've never put anything there and have never had a problem.

[joejv4]

Our electronics showed a pretty consistant speed graph, we got all of our strikes at speeds of 3.0+ yesterday. I have never used a trolling plate, but I hear really good things about the bags.

We ended up heading in around 11 because one of the people we went out with was hurling a lot and it was getting rather rough.

In addition to tweaking the throttle and/or putting a bag in the water, powertrim/tilt can be a wonderful thing for adjusting speed.

Me, I'm in a 19' skiff with a 90 merc on the back. At idle, I can adjust my speed from about 1.8 up to 3.0 just by tilting the motor up and down.

Bags work great, but make it challenging to stay on a straight track with these smaller boats - there's no stepping away from the wheel for a sec when you have a bag over the side. I friend has a big boat (30+ footer) and when he shuts down one engine to start trolling, he puts the bag on the same side as the running engine and it actually helps with tracking.

I generally only put a bag in when I've got a tail wind that won't let me whoa up enough.

[Mickey Finn]

Two smaller bags are better than one larger one. If you have one on each side, it makes steering much easier, especially on smaller boats.

[joejv4]

Two smaller bags are better than one larger one. If you have one on each side, it makes steering much easier, especially on smaller boats.

The old 5 gallon pail with holes drilled in it comes to mind

It's hard finding a good durable bag small enough to run 2 of them and still keep your RPM's on the motor down.

[Mickey Finn]

I had a guy make me a pair of small ones.

[Mortigan]

Nice one - I'll have to try changing the tilt to see what effect it has on our speed. I've noticed that it changes quite a bit when one of us moves from our seat to the stern as well.