using alwives in Salmon River estuary

[huskyjerk]

Since the salmoniods have been eating alwives etc. out in the lake why wouldn't fishing inside with alewife imitations be a good thing, for instance, streamers or lures like the huskyjerk etc drifted or cast and retrieved to mimic the wives? Is it legal to attach such a lure to the end of the line in the same fashion you must for egg sac drifting? Also, do the salmon actually take the egg sac or does the line become trapped in their gaping mouths until the sac slides up to the jaw and the hook becomes impaled in the jaw? This has been a bone of contention for so long since I know that spawning fish do not eat.

Ok guys bat this around awhile please.

[Capt Vince Pierleoni]

Early in the "run", body baits take their share not only at river mouths but up river as well. This seems to wane to almost exclusively eggs and egg imitations later on.

Salmon may not "feed" to grow after they enter the tribs, but they do strike lures and gulp eggs right down their throats during periods of activity. Yes, there are new ingenius ways to "line" fish invented every year off piers and in tribs, but this should not ruin the image of guys who enjoy the challenge of fair fishing fall run Pacific Salmon.

[huskyjerk]

off piers and in tribs, but this should not ruin the image of guys who enjoy the challenge of fair fishing fall pacific run salmon

Captian, explain "the challenge of fair fishing" please.

also, am I correct in saying that the salmonoids follow the huge schools of herring all summer long all over the lake. And that all the lures with all the various names are in fact attempting to imitate the herring (alewife). AND then would it not be prudent to show them something at the mouths of the rivers they are heading into that resembles the food fish they have been following and eating for so long?

Thanks for responding

[Capt Vince Pierleoni]

"The challenge of fair fishing" is the "game" itself. It's what drives men and women mad, leading to loss of income and sometimes jobs and spouses. It also could possibly be the finest recreational sport on earth, providing a great way to spend time with family,friends, and business associates. I personally feel that it's no accident that it's so fun and rewarding. It's a gift to those who use it.

The "challenge" is everything. It's why it never gets old. It's why you are hero one day and a zero the next. There is not a number large enough to calculate all the possible scenarios in our fishery day to day, and there will never be a computer program or "app" that will be able to help you consistently. Even when you figure them out, you still have to land them.

The biggest difference between what most people consider "fair" fishing and foul is whether the fish takes the bait or the bait or hook takes the fish. Even more important than exact hook placement is did the quarry react to or accept a presentation, vs did it get impaled by a hook as it rest in a riffle or swam by a pier or breakwall.

Just as there are trollers and casters who hoodwink fish with their presentations, there are pier and trib anglers who have refined their presentations with lures or baits to consistantly draw bites from spawning run Salmon. They do not resort to harassing or lining unsuspecting Salmon and they have to deal with those that do. Yes, Salmon bite on the spawning run, especially in trib water deep enough to conceal them or in areas where they aren't being foul hooked.

Your idea of using herring imitations at rivermouths is a good one, as instinct does drive some of the strikes. Many times when encountering rivermouth Salmon however, the best producers are the most obnoxious fake looking lures you can find. Its an ongoing challenge as the Salmon arrive in "waves", and they are not all on the same schedule. It could be silver spoons one day, and hot red plugs the next.

Sounds like you want to experiment. Do so, as that is so much of the fun of "fair fishing" and getting 'em "to go".

[gokudl3]

I started my salmon and trout addiction by casting, and having the salmon absolutly slam the plug, spinner, cleo, etc. There is no mistake when a salmon hits a lure. Every so often you will unintentionaly snag one in the fin or back, just like every so often you snag carp while casting for them too. If you spend as much time as many of us do chasing the next big one, you will know they bite.

The "challange of fair fishing" is simply to get the fish to BITE your presentation, sometimes its simple and sometimes its impossible.

[Has Been]

The" Challange " and the Hero one day & zero the next was about as well put as can be Capt Vince . It IS the reason I fish.

The fishing equation is 3 parts to me.

Part 1 is the preparation mode . Some do this better than others.

Part 2 is the Execution & Adjustment of the the game plan to trigger a strike .This is where the rubber meets the road . Some guys & the best fisherman ( such as yourself) do this the best, and when they do:

Part 3 is the playing & landing the fish ,which is a reward for doing parts 1 & especially 2 right.

Your clients pay you( and they are smart to pick you) for parts 1 & 2 Capt Vince ,so they can have part 3.

If there were no "zero" days, the "hero " days wouldn't be as much fun,now would they.

[huskyjerk]

This is so interesting. Keep up the discussion. It's a great learning experience for me.

THANKS GUYS

[jonboat]

I look at it this way... I'm a salmon sitting in the river resting before making a charge further upstream. for some reason there is a cluster of eggs waving in front of my face, so I snap at it. I equate it to having someone dangling a potato chip in front of your face.

In the case of an alwife, that would be like having someone dangle a properly grilled steak in front of you face. I don't know about you, but even if I'm not hungry, not thinking about food at all, if there was suddenly a nice fat juicy NY strip stake, grilled to perfection, in front of my face, I'm taking a bite.

The fair fishing trick is to put the potato chip or steak in front of the fish so that they feel like snapping at it - and they do! I can usually tell if I've accidentally foul hooked a fish (and it happens) because there is absolutely no turning them. Most times however, I feel a "tug", not a "bump", and find that I have a nice hookup INSIDE their mouth, and when I'm fighting them, even though I may not be gaining line, I can at least turn them and get them running different directions. That tells me when I'm doing it right.

using alwife (herring) for bait in the estuary - lots of people do (usually cut bait rigs), and they catch fish.

[carpedium]

I started my salmon and trout addiction by casting, and having the salmon absolutly slam the plug, spinner, cleo, etc. There is no mistake when a salmon hits a lure. Every so often you will unintentionaly snag one in the fin or back, just like every so often you snag carp while casting for them too. If you spend as much time as many of us do chasing the next big one, you will know they bite.

The "challange of fair fishing" is simply to get the fish to BITE your presentation, sometimes its simple and sometimes its impossible.

100% Agree

I have caught plenty of salmon in the mouth on flies in the tributaries as late as november when there are hardly any left.