When to use Spoons for Salmon

[jdm130]

Im fairly new fishing LO on my own. I made two trips up in Aug./Sept. and did fairly well considering Ive never fished it. Of course I had help from you guys giving me tips and advice. And one guy inparticular who really helped me out alot making our trips successful.. Anyway, When I was up I used only flashers/flies and flasher meat rigs. Im planning on fishing alot more as time allows this summer and fall. I have a ton of spoons that I have purchased over the years for trolling here in NJ, including some bigger spoons for salmon. When do I try using them?

My boat is 18' and I only run 2 down riggers but run 4 rods. Here are my questions:

Do you use flashers with spoons?

How far off the ball do you run spoons?

Is it best to use them in combination with flies (if running 4 lines, do I use 2 spoons and 2 F/F) or just stick with whats working?

What are good colors?

And is there a particular time of the year that they are better then F/F?

Sorry I know its alot of questions, Just trying to learn as much as I can for the upcoming season..

Thanks as always to you guys for the wealth of info on this site

[jdm130]

Sorry for all the questions again, But I also have a bunch of J plugs that Ive never used. Pretty much the same questions on using them as well. Like I said, the only thing I tried in my two trips up there was flashers fly combos. Havent tried plugs or spoon. I had good success with the combos I used and if my buddy didnt get sick we probably would have done even better but I would like to know how to use other tools in my spread to see whats working best at that time.

Thanks again, Jeff

[Richard]

Do you use flashers with spoons? yes

How far off the ball do you run spoons? 15 to 30 feet

Is it best to use them in combination with flies (if running 4 lines, do I use 2 spoons and 2 F/F) or just stick with whats working? yes run them together but as always stick with what is working for you at the time.

What are good colors? I like greens. Glow frog is one of my best spoons.

And is there a particular time of the year that they are better then F/F? Not so much a time of year but more of a depth thing. Run mostly spoons above 50 to 60 feet and flashers below that depth. But of course not always.

As for j-plugs I understand that they are mostly used late August. I only have a few myself.

Good luck on your next year on the water.

[raider44]

In the early morning hours, 5:30-7:00am, I like running all spoons of downriggers, and I like running them with short leads from the ball. Try 6-12 feet early in the morning, if time goes by with no hits, begin to stretch them out a little further as the morning goes on.

As for colors, numerous patterns involving green and glow are popular. http://www.attheoak.com/spoons.html this link will give you a good idea and has pictures of most spoons too.

[hawkeye625]

I've only fished Ontario for a couple of years but this works well for us. 4 rods 2 riggers w/spoons and cheaters 2 dipsys w/flasher fly 90% of the time. If spoons are hot we'll change out one of the flasher w/fly on dipsy to spoon on dipsy. Did well on spoons all year, but flashers took their share too. We always leave at least 1 flasher down to attract fish. Cheated riggers also give you another bait per rod.

Do you use flashers with spoons? Yes

How far off the ball do you run spoons?5-30ft

Is it best to use them in combination with flies (if running 4 lines, do I use 2 spoons and 2 F/F) or just stick with whats working? yes

What are good colors? greens/glow silver/black

And is there a particular time of the year that they are better then F/F? Spring/early summer for us

Do a search on favorite spoons for options as there are many.

Good luck,

Jeff

[tangleweed1]

That's a great question I always run at least one clean spoon in my program and always run cheaters by clean I mean by it self on a dipsy or a trash line (copper or core) as far as color the sky is the limit don't beat your self up over it one day green&silver the next day black&purple have a good selection and keep switching up till you find out what they want that's the fun of fishing lakeO ever changing conditions that determine color speed & depth

Good luck and enjoy the learning process its very rewarding

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[jdm130]

Thanks as always for the wealth of information. Im looking real forward to the upcoming season.Last year was a lot to take in and somehow we managed to boat a few. Im hoping this year we can pick up a few more that are not by chance Thanks as always!

[Big Dave]

You can run a fixed cheater with a spoon above the flasher and fly..

[skipper19]

Jeff, great to see you back! Your questions are good and have been answered in all the cases offered. I would only add that the water color is a big factor in choosing a spoon program. I know that most of your fishing is on the east end and the water there stays very clear through the late spring and early summer. I like some smaller spoons in clear water, cheated mup style. Meaning a small spoon off the ball say 15 ft back and a larger spoon in matching color above it 8 ft back and fixed 5 to 6 ft above the smaller Target spoon. It acts like an attractor and gives you a second chance for the clear water shy looker to see the Target spoon as a stragler and smaler victim to grab.

Stained green water is where salmon tend to be less shy of close inspecton, and the flasher fly combo run in the mix will offer some "homing" qualities to the spread. Flash and sound are long distance attractors when water is off color.o

Like everyone mentioned don't beat yourself to death over color of spoons. Good action is key. Speed control is everthing. You can try different colors and see what works better but the action of the spoons are really the trigger for aggression.

Check your spoons next to the boat, try different conections to your leader. Swivels, rings, snaps will change action sometimes and make the difference between a knockoff, or a solid hit. Looking forward to your success posts! Oh and now you can use three rods per person, now you can tripple your troubles....hahaha

Mark

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[Big Dave]

Skipper makes a good point not all spoons will run together. They all have sweet spots. Thin spoons can be run slowly , heavier spoons like an NK can't run right at sutton speeds. Use the smallest snaps that you can. That sure changes the way a spoon works. A small stinger sure can't dance with a snap the size of a rigger snap hooked to its nose. Try to match the hatch , if all the bait is small, the smaller spoons may work better than a mag size will.

[jdm130]

Great information guys Thanks! Mark as always a wealth of information. Lots to take in.... Dont know if you remeber but over the summer you were telling me about something called down and out. I didnt try it last year because both times I was up the water was rough and the wind was howling. I found it best to run only 2 rods One on each rigger. Being my boat is only 18' it was tough to stay straight while setting up using only my kicker. But I would like to try that down and out on a nicer day.

I believe you told me to set my first line on the ball, lower it down to 30', then (with a second line) use a small dipsy and put out about 100', then clip that to my rigger cable and lower ball to desired depth. What clip do you use thats strong enough so the dipsy line doesnt pull out when trolling but will release with a fish on? I have some cannon stacker clips, will those hold the line from snapping out while trolling the small dipsy? If not those then what clips would you recommend for down and outs?

Thanks!

[skipper19]

Jeff I use the Scotty stackers with the 48 inch leader or the 30 inch (makes hooking the rod line easier if you have longer leader ones) if you have shorter booms and set the clip to the tight position. They are adjustable by the little tab at the back of the clip, just pull it to make tighter or push it forward towards the clip end to lessen the pinch. The small adjustable dipsey is the choice towed on a mono 30 lb line and set it on a 2.5 or 3 to plane out away from the cable to the side. Be careful not to lower the ball fast, just go slow down to your depth on the ball. If you go down too fast it will cause the dipsey to flip over and tangle itself. A nice easy drop kinda like you pay out line for a rod dipsey.

When bringing the ball back up just be sure to stop the cable before the stacker if you are using electric downriggers. Manual riggers you will have no problem with but it is easy to forget the ball coming up when sidetracked on a multitask. I have lost a couple stackers that way so now I take the time to place a stop bead before the stacker hits the end pulley.

Yes you are correct ball down 30 dipsey out 90 to 100 clip it to the cable and send the ball down to your selected depth. the dipsey will then be near the same depth as the ball but trailing back and out to the side about 20 to 30 feet. Very deadly on fish coming to the middle of the set who might be a little cable shy and then peel away and see the dipsey offering as a second chance bite. Calm waters are always a best time for multi line sets! Good luck with it. It's a little time consuming and a challenge to set up until you get used to it, but is rewarding a lot of times.

Mark

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Scotty Stacker Release... 48 inch leader

[jdm130]

Awesome Mark!!!! That is great I didnt know they made those stackers with long leads. The oes I have are similar except they have like 3" leads. No doubt that will make is so much easier to use. Man I can not wait to get back up. I had spine surgery 2 weeks ago so Im home from work and have cabin fever so bad. So I am trying to take in as much as I can with this time. Im taking notes and started a journal last season once we started hooking up. So I will keep track this season of time, conditions, lures, etc. The first time up we managed to get my son a decent laker and had a few drops, the second time I couldnt bring my son and of course we boated a few kings and a nice coho. Thats typical, all I wanted was for my son to catch his first king. This season he's gonna get one This is all great info. Its hard to believe there are still people out there that will help strangers. I hope someday to have enough experience that I can help a newbi too. Thanks again man. Over the summer when time allows we should hook up one day. Always cool to put faces to the name.

[skipper19]

There are a lot of good guys on here with lots of good info. If you ever get out this way between Rochester and Niagara Falls, drop me a note and we will go hook some kings out here on the western end. Remember, it starts early over here if you happen to be needing some cabin fever relief. I'll be glad to get together with ya! Take care of that back, I hope it works for you. My friend Butch who fishes with me all the time had surgery a year and a half ago on his spine. He is getting better but it was tough for him when on the boat in rough water. Keep well, and you will be back at it in no time. I have fever for the lake already, and its only a short 15 minute ride to the launch at The Oak. Can't wait for the spring brown troll. I'm thinkin about how it might be right now! The weather is warm this winter and there is hardly any ice to hinder the thought of trying it. I think if the ice flow from the Niagara is minimal then the kings will show up a month earlier.

Mark

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