Deer Cams--- IR VS Flash

[Capt Vince Pierleoni]

OK, it's approx 8 weeks til people start splashing, there is little safe ice, and many of the tribs are a muddy mess. Lets talk deer cams!

I never played with Deer cams until late last Summer. It didn't take me long to realize there is a science to it. I started with IR cameras, because I thought they were the latest and the greatest. I soon learned that the deer aren't crazy about them. Not sure if it was the red lights or some sound they are detecting. I saw the beautiful pics Rebel and Chromeslayer were getting with flash cams despite the bright flash. I started experimenting with a Cuddeback this post season. Not only does it take pics that are fantastic, the deer show little concern despite the repeated flashing.

What have you guys that have used these for years seen? I think they could be great tools for pre-season scouting, but I'd think twice before using the IR's around mature bucks. What observations have you guys made?

[T_barb]

Capt Vince,

I am interested to the responses you get to this questions.

It is almost like polling poeple to see what brand pickup or snowmobile they like..

I will give you my opinion/perspective, which have been formed over the past 6 years. I have used a number of different cameras, some IR and some flash. I would classify myself as a fairly "heavy user"...

I have used Bushnell, Cuddeback (including a new Attack this year), Stealth Cam and others..

Over the past 3 years, I would say by far my favorite cameras have been the Scoutguard 550s. They are not as popular as some of the other brands, but I have had 2 of them for the past 3 years and they perform great. They don't seem to bother the deer, the trigger is pretty quick, they are small and the battery life is incredible. http://scoutguard550.com/store.html

They do not perform flawlessly. I have yet to come across a camera that does. They have their pluses and minuses, but they are the most consistent cameras that I have used over the past 3 years (camera and video mode both).

I have never tried a high end camera like a Reconyx (I have never spent more than $230 for a camera), so there are probably better cameras out there than what I have used. There are 2 reasons for that.. First is the price ($450 to $500) and second, I would rather have 2 $225 cameras than $1 $450, so I could cover more ground.

Like I sad, I am curious to read the other responses because I am always looking for proven products that I can add to my arsenal....

[Paul Czarnecki]

I've run cameras for 8 years Vince. I've found that does, fawns and yearling bucks have no problem with a flash going off in their eyes---especially over bait. However, I'm convinced that mature bucks DO NOT like the flash---rarely do I get multiple pics of the same mature deer.

My buddy in Ohio, who is COVERED with mature deer has had similar results and has since switched over to all IR cameras.

[Chromeslayer]

Tbarb... any issues with the Attack? just picked one up to add to my cudde collection... as far as white flash and IR.. personally iv never used IR cam and the deer dont seem to mind the whiteflash so i prolly wont change and iv got plenty of pics of mature deer over and over again... i think one thing that kills your cameras is checking them to often

[lineman49]

I have one of each & I think the Ir bothers the deer more than the flash. they seem to shy away from the Ir. They stand back & stare at the cam.

[Capt Vince Pierleoni]

Figures, Paul. My findings have been just the opposite. I do have multiple pics of wary "shed" bucks with flash. I never got a 2nd pic with the IR cams. They looked alarmed, and I never saw them a 2nd time. I can vouch for Chromeslayers pics with flash. Multiple pics of same nocturnal bucks. It could be that not all IRs are created equal. Mine are Primos Truth cams. I see where they now have "Black out" and completely silent features on their newest models, so I would imagine its been an issue for others with their products.

I recently had conversation with Phil at Indian Mtn, who owns a parcel in the southern tier. He felt you could condition the deer, even the mature deer to the cams by having many of them out year around. Thats just not an option for most of us do to theft issues.

[Mortigan]

Used a pair of $100 flash Moultrie's for years and never had an issue with deer not coming back. The one black bear I caught in front of my climber was obviously less than thrilled - he's never shown on that trail again but did start crapping IN our one permanent stand. Not thrilled about sharing it with him - Too bad it's not a bear WMU...

[T_barb]

Chromeslayer,

I have only had the Cuddeback Attack for about 4 months, so I am still forming my opinion on it.

The biggest issue I have had with it so far is that it does not seem to trigger as much as I would expect (when it is in "regular' mode, not the Attack mode). I say that because I have put it on some of my "bread & butter" trails and have got fewer pictures than I have historically got with other cameras. During the fall, when it was wet, there would be all sorts of fresh tracks going in both directions and I would only have a few new pictures. I know there is more movement than what the camera was telling me.

One of the features that I like on the Scoutguards is that you can set the sensitivity (L/M/H).. So depending on the conditions in a specific area, I will adjust the sensitivity and that has worked really well for me. I don't see where there is a similar adjustment on the Cuddeback.

The picture and video quality on the Cuddeback is fatastic (..probably the best of any camera that I have had).. It is nice to be able to take a picture and really zoom in on a deer without the picture distorting to much.

I am interested to get your opinion and best pratices with it as you use it more. The issues I am having may very well be operator error... It certianly would not be the first time!!

[Chromeslayer]

the thing with cuddebacks is there narrow detection zone compared to other cams... could be why your getting fewer pics... so proper setup is alil more important with them... only complaint on the 8 captures i have is the slow recovery time between pics.. you can miss a aweful lot in 30sec! my attack should be here this week hopefully i can get it out this weekend to see how it performs

make sure your software is up to date in your attack as well... can download it off the cuddeback site

[Legacy]

I added 2 IR this year and the jury is still out for me.

[T_barb]

Chromeslayer..

Help me with the set-up. I am assuming what you mean is that instead of setting up perpendicular to the trail, you want to set up for quartering movement? Do I have that right?

[Mortigan]

Correct. If perpendicular, you get shots like the following - on a three-shot burst, the first wakes up the camera but you miss your shot, the second, if you're lucky, is like this and the third also misses.

If you aim so the trail angles across your field of view, you might get shots like this. He came back through 45 minutes later in the opposite direction; that's the group the last shot was from.

[Legacy]

When ever I set my cameras up on a game trail I set them quartering the trail. It just extends the time the camera has to take 3 pics.

[Mortigan]

Exactly. I cropped the shots to post but the trail the buck is on runs corner to corner in the photos.

[Chromeslayer]

T_barb... yes i almost always position quartering the trail and always in a north or south direction if i can..and never right ontop of the trail either...getting to close you just get bodies and to far if you using a lower quality cam u just see eyes

[33canuck]

This can be quite a loaded question and there really is no definitive answer. I have been running camse for almosst as long as they are out. I really like the flash due to pic quality and 365 color, some bucks whether mature or not will not give a hoot about the flash others will make a one time appearance and that's it but I have found this to be the case with the IR's as well. The best approach is to avoid putting the cams in or around your primary hunting spots and stands within a month or so of hunting season to let things settle down. I typically move cams to perimeter locations which aren't as much of a concern if the deer start to avoid the location. I don't think either will drive deer off the farm but they will certainly change patterns and if you are foolish and can't stop checking them to frequently you will have very little chance of getting the deer (mature ones) you get on cam. That being said in terms of quality hte flash is best but if you are just looking to get an idea of what is running around the IR's are pretty good too I like to run both for different reasons. Battery life, trigger speed, and megapixels are the most important items when buying cams in my mind.

[lineman49]

Nice pics. & bucks chromeslayer & mortigan just where were those taken ? I would just like to see the tree you put the cams on , honest ! I know , tell when, tell how, but will not tell where ! lol