catch and release fishing on lake O

[bandrus1]

I was having a discussion with a buddy about releasing fish on lake O. He doesnt think many of the released fish survive after being caught. With the long fight, and then the netting and the release he thinks most die due to being caught.... anybody have any insight on this?

[BAZOOKAJOE]

High mortality rate in the summer. Pull them up out of the cold deep into bath water...they are done.

[Has Been]

Imagin That.

[LongLine]

Depends on how you release them. Release them into your cooler and no they won't survive. If not "gut" hooked and not horsed around in the boat then great majority do survive. The Lake Ontario Annual report said that close to 45% of the fish caught were released, yet I have never seen more than a couple dead salmon per year floating out there (spring & summer)

Tom B.

(LongLine)

[bandrus1]

the argument was kind based around the net damaging the fish then the handling of the fish and it making them suitable... not dying instantly but making them vulnerable to infection

[spoonfed-1]

the argument was kind based around the net damaging the fish then the handling of the fish and it making them suitable... not dying instantly but making them vulnerable to infection

You will catch fish all the time with scars from eels all over them.

Some die most don't.

These fish are not as delicate as some would have you believe.

Proper release techniques have been discussed at length on this board.

Do a search and you will get all kinds of information on this topic.

Glen

[Tim Bromund]

I think the toughest fish to successfully release are mid summer offshore steelhead. Other than that if you have the capability to revive them, most fish will survive. Browns in particular seem really hearty and easy to release even in warm mid summer water.

Tim

[holy mackerel]

Browns are the toughest, steel head are not as Tim said. Dead salmon sink. Thats why you don't see them. At least that what i have I have learned in the last 33 years on the lake.

[ray koziatek]

I think(know) Tim,Glen ,And longline are alittle more on the correct side ,,

Tim is kinda a fish nerd who does pretty good catching 1 or 2 fish a year..

Glen drives all the way from Mass. to win all the derbys he gets into and probly has released a few in his time..

Longline is a factual nerd,dont argue with him he will dig up more facts on any givin subject related to the big pond and whats in it than anyone on this or any site..

And me well Ive got a few thousand hours driving around circles,,,and never use a net unless im derby fishing or want to keep a fish and other than steelheads everything swims away asap......steelies like to lay their and play dead so you will turn your boat sharp feelin bad for killing and leavin a fish ,,after you tangle yer spread or pull it all in to turn back they take off just as you put the net in the water to scoop them up....everytime....so if ya ant gonna eat it and dont play it to death with 10lb or smaller line it should be ok....

Go to the salmon river some fall and you will see hundreds of salmon cought and released in almost 35 years on the river i ant never seen "die" from the fight,or litter the bottom ,unless it spends too much time in front of the camera.....

But hey me justa plummer...

[bandrus1]

well it wasnt so much the playing we were discussing it is the net, boat floor yadda yadda we were talking about doing damage...... i have to say on my 19 footer with an outboard it is almost 100% imposable to not use a net

[spoonfed-1]

well it wasnt so much the playing we were discussing it is the net, boat floor yadda yadda we were talking about doing damage...... i have to say on my 19 footer with an outboard it is almost 100% imposable to not use a net

If you got to use a net you got to use a net.

Lots of HARD CORE c&r fly fishermen use nets all the time.

In this case it's what happens after you net the fish will determine the chances for a successful release.

Plop the fish on the floor of the boat and let him beat himself half to death probably aint a good thing.

What do you think Ray.

Glen

[kingslamon22]

im a "hardcore" C&R fisher and camera time kills the fish. if you keep it in the net in the water untill the camera is ready, dont hang the fish from there gills, get the picture then quickly torpedo the fish under the surface layer of water they usually just take right off twards bottom like nothing happened. keep em out of water for 3-5 mins after a hard fight and it will be a floater...dont do like some common sense lacking individuals do and stick your hand up through the gill to hold the fish and after the 13 bloody pictures, flop the fish back into the drink pretending you did the right thing.

[jonboat]

If it's a legal fish and I'm under my limit, I just release them into my cooler, then later on, onto my grill or my smoker. Never have to worry about mortality rates. Fish that are not legal, go back so fast they hardly have to miss a breath.

[Chasin Tail]

As stated earlier, if you put it in you cooler the rate of survival is zero!

I've released many fish over the years, throughout the year. In the Spring fish seem to take off as if they get shot out of a cannon.

During the warmer months of summer it takes them a little longer but they seem to swim away fine. I think they take more time due to the lack of oxygen in the warmer water. They just take their time getting back to the cooler water and rest.

In the fall the the fish are in "warmer" temps from the beginning of the fight until thy are netted and they take off like they do in the Spring!

In Winter the fish are cold water from start till finish and and we have no trouble releasing them.

The biggest key is to play the fish quickly and not over exhaust them. Even during cold weather months fish that are overplayed have to be revived for longer.

As for the netting question, I have seen plenty of salmon with the marks from past run ins with a net. In fact just this Spring I am seeing the same browns coming to net days after the were already caught. I also see many fish with signs on their mouths being caught previously. Some are just wounded others are missing half their jaws.

So IMHO I believe our fish are a lot more resilient than many will give them credit for. I've been amazed by some of the thing I've seen these fish do to spawn, so no net or hook is going to stop them!

[Has Been]

Hey Ray, I still think that long handled hook remover you need for circle hooks down in FLA would work if you modified it for a treble. Reach down over the side , hook the shank, push pull, see ya later. Don't even take them out of the water .Maybe I'll attempt to make one.

Question. Is it really true that dead salmon sink? Is there any factual evidence of that? I think someone asked a question like that some time ago on here, can't remember who it was.

[spoonfed-1]

I've seen seagulls feeding on dead salmon on the surface a few times before.

I've accidently dropped a couple dead ones in the lake getting ready to fillet them.

Circled and netted them back up.

They floated.

Was out with Chris (Traveling man) one day and we both wanted meat so we kept our three salmon a piece.

Water was like glass.

He was handing them to me and I was cutting.

When we got done there was 6 equally spaced carcusses over about 1/4 mi or so, all in a nice neat line with a slight turn that the boat took.

All six were floating

Dropped a dead Brown in one day taking a picture before filleting and that one sunk.

Certainly not any hard core evidence, just what I've seen over the years.

Glen

[holy mackerel]

Question. Is it really true that dead salmon sink? Is there any factual evidence of that? I think someone asked a question like that some time ago on here, can't remember who it was.

We have alot of divers out of our port. There is a shipwreck out front. They have told me of seeing dead salmon lying on the bottom. I am sure it depends on the amount of air the fish contains when it expires. I have seen floating dead salmon and have also watched them sink like a rock.

[LongLine]

Well the weather $uck$ so I might as well give it a shot…(and besides I know Ray is just dying to hear this)

1. We owe our fisheries today to the fact that dead fish float. Back in the ‘60’s, many millions of alewives floated up on shore and stunk up the beaches hence we knew something had to be done about them.

2. Every “fishkill†that you read about in the news is/was discovered by vast numbers of dead floating fish.

3. Back when they rotenoned the river to kill Asian Carp, they found no AC but required many boaters to remove the dead fish that floated up.

4. Sharks, rays & gobies will sink because they don’t have swim bladders.

5. Currents and down-wellings can keep dead fish down until they rot.

Why Do Dead Fish Float?

By: Life's Little Mysteries Staff

Date: 15 March 2010 Time: 02:53 PM ET

From the moment you leave the pet store with the little fish in its water-filled bag, you dread the inevitable moment when your sobbing child will clutch you and whimper, "Nemo is floating on top of the water!" We'll leave the cosmic explanations to you, but we can help explain the physical phenomenon.

Fish are slightly more dense than the water in which they swim. They are almost neutrally buoyant, meaning the forces acting against the fish to make it sink are about equal to the forces inside the fish causing it to float. It also means fish don't have to work too hard to keep from floating or sinking.

Pressure increases with water depth. Most species of fish counteract fluctuations by using an internal pouch called a swim bladder (also called the gas bladder or air bladder). Water enters a fish's mouth and passes through gills, where oxygen is extracted and carried by hemoglobin through the bloodstream. Hemoglobin releases some of that oxygen into the swim bladder.

The amount of oxygen in the bladder determines the fish's buoyancy. If Nemo begins to dip, oxygen is absorbed into the bladder. If he floats too much, gas diffuses into the blood and out the gills. Mark Boriek, a biologist with the New Jersey Department of Fish and Wildlife explains that the process "isn't a conscious effort on the part of the fish, but rather a chemical response to the pressure surrounding the fish."

Oxygen remains in the bladder after a fish dies. Additional gases are released during decomposition. "The fish is like a closed container," says Boriek. "As the fish decomposes, gases fill the body cavity." The belly becomes a guts-filled balloon and the fish floats to the surface. Most of a fish's mass is bone and muscle on its dorsal side, so as the belly balloon rises, fish tend to flip upside down.

Fish don't always float to the surface right away. They may sit on the bottom for a while until the gases build.

http://www.lifeslittlemysteries.com/74- ... float.html

also published on the “fish channelâ€

http://www.fishchannel.com/fishkidz/bey ... float.aspx

Tom B.

(LongLine)

[ray koziatek]

aww I was just gonna post that....Don't Mess with the nerds on this site,we might just look like yer everyday plummer or fisherman,butts wees gots common sence (rare comodity these days) boy if we could be king for a day we could fix the world.....OR TAKE THE DAY OFF CAUSE WERE THE KING AND GO FISHING BETTER GIVE US 2 DAYS(in case the fishing was good....

[holy mackerel]

You may want to buy some polarized glasses and look in the water sometime. I'm not gonna argue about it. I've seen plenty of dead fish lying on the bottom in streams , bays and the lake. I guess I didn't watch long enough to see if they floated.

[panfisher]

Trollin' hurts 'em. So do trebles. Can't do much about the trolling accept use heavier than acceptable gear to get 'em in quicker. U can always use single hooks though. and be genteeel with them when releasing, especially bigger, heavier fish. There's a lot to be said about the net and time out of the water as stated, too. With bigger and more stressed fish you often will have to take a long time holding them with a grip or holder over the side in the water as the boat moves along, waiting till the fish "tells you" he's revived and ready to swim off. You'll know this when U feel and see his head and body move on their own; their jaw will begin to pump water on their own. Your fishing mates will want to throw you in because ur taking so much time with said fish..."Geez! It's just a fish for cryin' out loud already!!" they'll say. But if you have ever been totally exerted and exhausted past whatever extant you're used to yourself, U begin to understand how long it can take to recover. Well, the same is true for the same reasons for the fish. Plus, it just seems (to me) that salmonids in general just are not as physically tough as, say, some bass or other "hard scaly" and "heavier boned" fish. I have sometimes taken maybe half an hour (that's right!) before I release from the grip by the boatside some usually larger trout or salmon. But it does feel good watching it, albeit slowly, but definitely, swim away right side up rather than floating belly up and wondering. Quite often another person is fumbling with some re-rigging or untangling some tackle nightmare, still recovering ourselves from the fight and excitement of the fish capture. I'm a softy with the critters, I'll admit...many others would not show that much patience. Than again, if the fish R going to the table....

[Has Been]

My Question was do dead Salmon ,and to clarify, Kings sink.

My experience is that I have seen many bouncing down the stream during the fall run.

Have also released many to give them a chance, especially majors ,watched them in flat clear water kind of slowly sink as we trolled away , knowing they were probably not going to make it ,and thinking afterward , I should have boxed them.

Read an artcle a few years back that kings move rapidly & frequntly up and down the water column ,and spend a lot of time 300-400' down. Maybe the depth change does not affect them as much as other fish, their body mass is denser & allows them to move up & down easier,thus the sinking. But it's pure speculation on my part.

[King Davy]

A very simple system of reviving fish that I used starting back in 1983...was to simply have a cooler filled with water....a second cooler with ice, and a simple stream thermometer. Especially in the Late June through Mid August time frame catching fish deep....we'd NOT let them bounce around on the floor of the boat....but if having to net the fish ...they went right into the water chamber. Tried to keep that water between 50 and 60 degrees ...not hard at all do do. Just add some ice as needed Never had a problem releasing any fish especially steelhead. They are much tougher then you think These are the same fish that get caught dozens of times between Oct. and the following May in rivers and streams. Fish would stablize in the chamber...usually with in 5 min, and back into the lake. No problem

There are also great fish grabbing gloves out there....we use them in the rivers and streams so we can control thhe fish without hurting them. No reason not to have that glove one whne removing any fish form a net so it doesn't slip out of your hands and bounce all over the deck. Never hold a fish up vertically, the position moves their vital organs around plus they have a greater chance to squim out of your grasp.

There truly isn't very many situations that responsible anglers can't sucessfully catch and release fish. These simple techniques work in the high 90 percent of the time.

[panfisher]

Very interesting. Keep the fish cool and oxygenated prior to release. And handle carefully. Now. To get everybody else on board....That's the toughest part.

[Raaven]

Every fish that goes in the box...is a dead fish. But not every fish released, lives either. If people were REALLY concerned about "tomorrows fish"...they wouldn't sit out there and catch/ release fish all day...then go back to the dock with an attitude that they did better for the fishery, than the guy who took his limit AND LEFT.

Our fishery is a Put and Take fishery....

Take your limit, and go home for the day, or catch your limit, release them, and call it a day. Don't sit out there and C&R 30-40-50 fish..release them all, and think you are doing any good for our fishery.

JMO.