Niagara Pro-Am--Quick report

[Capt Vince Pierleoni]

There will be much on this in the coming days, but I wanted to offer a short report. The dual format is a winner, big time. The "trophy box" or "short box" was won in heavy seas by the smallest boat in the tournament. There were rec anglers who placed in both formats. Congrats to White Mule and Wet Net for winning the 2 different formats.

There is definitely some tweaking needed, regarding rules and decision making, but don't expect any until this season is over. The County driven Pro-Ams have only recently embraced utilizing a committee, so no changes in rules or policies this season.

Being shackled by the policy of "small craft advisory"=no go, created grumbling and a long, long, day of watching a fishable lake with a field of "pacing tigers" raring to go. This also led to a one day shootout when it was never the intent. It was rougher on Sunday,( but certainly fishable) but no advisory so it went off.

The dual direction blow did what most of us knew it would, scattered fish and created a tough bite. The teams that were smart enough to scale back expectations were the ones that capitalized. It was a tourny of bunts and stolen bases, not home runs. There was a tremendous contrast in weights between last years Niagara event or even the WHI a couple weeks ago. A 5lb avg was decent. This is what makes the game so great.

Our execution and production when on fish was good, my decision making was not. Looking forward to Orleans. Good luck to all!

[Paul Czarnecki]

Great synopsis Vince. I too, liked the new format and strongly disliked the new "policy" of a small craft advisory equals no tournament. Having NOAA determine whether or not a tournament goes off is poor judgement on the part of the Directors especially since very few, if any, of us rely on NOAA's determination for ANYTHING!

I would like to offer an alternative policy that I feel is much more reliable and "real time". Instead of using a "blanket system" like the small craft advisory the Tournaments should consider setting parameters for "no go's" in wind velocity and wave heights. The 3 or 4 weather buoys on the lake provide real time info as to what is actually happening out there and it is updated constantly. The Committees could use the info from the weather buoy closest to the port hosting the tournament to determine whether or not the water was fishable.

I would MUCH rather trust the information coming "real time" from a weather buoy than the opinion of an overeducated, self indulgent, overpaid goverment employee sitting in a room with no windows over 200 miles away from where I'm fishing!

[Mortigan]

They've been wrong more often than right this season - pretty bad odds.

[Silver Fox]

How many teams were there?

[ Post made via Android ]

[Yankee Troller]

How many teams were there?

[ Post made via Android ]

53

[Gill-T]

I would think between the real-time buoy data and sending a scout boat out to determine safety would cover it. In the case of a south blow, most of the inshore areas are fishable even with heavy winds. Perhaps, in a case such as this weekend, you could establish a GPS line that you cannot cross into deeper water to level the field between the different sized vessels? We already have two lines we cannot cross into Canadian waters.....what is one more line?

[Erskin]

When will they post the results?

[Silver Fox]

How many teams were there?

[ Post made via Android ]

53

In the word of "Opee & Anthony"..............oooof!

[ Post made via Android ]

[Finders Keepers]

I would MUCH rather trust the information coming "real time" from a weather buoy than the opinion of an overeducated, self indulgent, overpaid goverment employee sitting in a room with no windows over 200 miles away from where I'm fishing!

While I agree that the forecast for Sat was blown (no punn intended ), I also have two degrees in meteorology and can tell you the forecasters are not overeducated, self-indulgent, nor overpaid, and according to the model forecasts there should have been a small craft advisory in place. Now, what I think they should have done differently is what was already stated: check the buoy data and adjust, especially when there was a decreasing trend in the wind/waves all day as recorded by the both the west end and offshore Rochester buoys. I would also suggest for the tournament that during an offshore wind, we either use a latitude line or depth to stay within that the observers could monitor. It really is a shame we couldn't get out on Sat...

[Iceman]

Just more reasons to stay as far away from the Pro AM thing as possible. From not posting results, to keeping the entry fee if the contest is cancelled, to being clueless with respect to weather & wave conditions with the new cop out NOAA call off for the SCW!

Too funny!

[Paul Czarnecki]

Just more reasons to stay as far away from the Pro AM thing as possible. From not posting results, to keeping the entry fee if the contest is cancelled, to being clueless with respect to weather & wave conditions with the new cop out NOAA call off for the SCW!

Too funny!

Glad you choose not to particpate Iceman. With your attitude you would just be another PITA for the Directors to deal with and they already have enough of them.

[stoutner]

Paul, I agree with you about the attitude...nobody needs that especially since they were dealing with some trying circumstances. I saved all my comments until today.

The issue is the complete lack of foresight from a committee that is supposed to have vast experience with this tournament. Although I can't really say that because it is apparently a top secret on who actually runs the tournament or who sits on the committee. I guess the good ole boys network that is established knows but I don't since it is not published anywhere that I can find. The committee is trying to increase participation yet keeps all of the details about the event under wraps. Who holds the money? Who sits on the committee? Where is that rule written about the small craft advisory? This is not rocket science yet it amazes me that it was mass confusion when the small craft advisory was in effect. It's not like it is unusual to have a small craft advisory on Lake O. Why was it such chaos Saturday morning? It was totally uncalled for if the rules were clear before the event started. Why now are guys on L.O.U. coming up with way better ideas to determine whether to fish or not based on data bouys and real time info? Additionally, the directors brought it on themselves. If there was in fact some top secret rule about the small craft advisory then why did they announce at 5 am that they were going to physically go out in a boat and check the conditions at 6 am? I assume they did so and found that conditions were fine. Yet, at 7am they reverted back to the "small craft advisory" statement. That whole situation could not have been handled worse.

Bottom line is this. If that is going to be the rule, clearly state it and stick by it. If a small craft advisory is in effect at 5am on the day of the event then event is called off til 2pm. At 2pm if still in effect it is called of for the day....period. The participants should then be allowed to go fishing for fun or side bets or a Big Fish Event at 5:01 am as long as they were back in port by 2pm. At least this way you wouldn't have hundreds of guys sitting around with nothing to do all pissed off because of some poor decision made by the top secret good ole boys tournament directors.

[Iceman]

The confusion & ineptness continues, LOL!!!!!!! Is the last Pro AM????

[ray koziatek]

Ice when i used to drink I would post like you still do ..I hope (and many others) when your sober you will look at your post and see how foolish and destructive you sound.. Im shure their is more than one of us willing to help..My PM is open for ya kiddo..

[TOP SECRET]

I'm very glad I wasnt asked to volunteer my time for the committee. Everyone needs to understand everyone is doing their best to make the tournament better, although we may not all agree with the changes, myself included. I actually thought the small craft advisory was a great idea, unfortunately on the west end it can sometimes still be fishable during one, sodus and oswego, very rarely during a small craft advisory. Maybe having a small test craft, like a 19ft head out is a good idea, just make the person anonymous so he doesnt feel the pressure of 30 guys in big boats staring him down. Curious to hear from some of the first time proam guys with smaller boats.... If it was a non tournament day and you had your wife and teen child on board would you have fished?

Nick

[ Post made via Android ]

[hawkeye625]

Having a smaller boat I can appreciate the call to cancel. What would you guys be posting if they gave the go ahead and the lake picked up to what it was suppose to? What if a small boat went out because he put up the money to compete and something tragic happened?

I'd rather read about a bunch of guys being P.O'd about sitting at the dock than reading someone's obituary! Can't say I agree with everything that goes on with the pro-am, but I do think they made the right call for everyone's safety.

[Mortigan]

I served two years on the board of directors for a small local organization that at the time had about a thousand members. I'll never do it again. It's thankless, time-consuming, not any fun and when you're done, somebody's still whining about something. I don't personally know any of the people involved with the Pro-Am's but I can tell you this how it works - 'cuz people are basically the same.

You've got a large group of people with a similar interest - fishing Lake Ontario for trout & salmon (how many - say 3000?). There's a much smaller subset that enjoy competing against each other while fishing (200 - 300?). Out of that group, you've got a few that are willing to put up or shut up - they volunteer their time to organize a competition. How many - 20 bodies? They're just people - they've got opinions, they've got egos, they've got issues. There isn't a master plan - they're just doing the best they can with what they've got.

If you don't like something - JOIN them.

[stoutner]

Having a smaller boat I can appreciate the call to cancel. What would you guys be posting if they gave the go ahead and the lake picked up to what it was suppose to? What if a small boat went out because he put up the money to compete and something tragic happened?

I'd rather read about a bunch of guys being P.O'd about sitting at the dock than reading someone's obituary! Can't say I agree with everything that goes on with the pro-am, but I do think they made the right call for everyone's safety.

Although I came off like I disagreed, I actually think it was a wise decision to not go during the small craft advisory. My point is that it should be clearly stated in the rules and posted prior to the beginning of the event for everyone to see. The decision to postpone it every two hours to wait and see what the coast guard said was a poor one. They should have just cancelled it until 2pm and made it a go if the advisory was lifted and a no go if it was not. That way, guys could have went home or went and did something else other than standing around the marina all day.

[Paul Czarnecki]

Having a smaller boat I can appreciate the call to cancel. What would you guys be posting if they gave the go ahead and the lake picked up to what it was suppose to? What if a small boat went out because he put up the money to compete and something tragic happened?

I'd rather read about a bunch of guys being P.O'd about sitting at the dock than reading someone's obituary! Can't say I agree with everything that goes on with the pro-am, but I do think they made the right call for everyone's safety.

Although I came off like I disagreed, I actually think it was a wise decision to not go during the small craft advisory. My point is that it should be clearly stated in the rules and posted prior to the beginning of the event for everyone to see. The decision to postpone it every two hours to wait and see what the coast guard said was a poor one. They should have just cancelled it until 2pm and made it a go if the advisory was lifted and a no go if it was not. That way, guys could have went home or went and did something else other than standing around the marina all day.

There's nothing wrong with second guessing I suppose but what if what you suggested was the policy and the lake had calmed down at 9 AM. Would you still want to wait until 2 or would you be one of the ones chirping for a Director hanging?

[stoutner]

Paul....I guess the 2pm thing would be my preference. By the way, the lake was calmed down at 9am.

Waiting around even for 4 hours with "no decision" just really gets to me. I hate airports and long lines at the DMV too

[Paul Czarnecki]

Paul....I guess the 2pm thing would be my preference. By the way, the lake was calmed down at 9am.

Waiting around even for 4 hours with "no decision" just really gets to me. I hate airports and long lines at the DMV too

That's my point Wayne. NO ONE likes waiting around. And I can guarantee no one wanted us to fish more than Bill Hilts. However, on the advise of the County Attorneys the "Small Craft Advisory Rule" was put in place and he was basically bound to it.

Given the amount of antacid and blood pressure medicine Bill has had to take over the past three days I'm quite sure that policy will be amended although I doubt it will be in the middle of the Series.

[Finders Keepers]

Just an FYI for everyone, the NWS is the agency that actually issues the small craft advisories. The problem we're going to face is that the wave/wind forecasts are only updated a couple times per day (if I recall right, I believe they updates the forecast at around 9:30 am, then not again until around 3, then not until 9:45ish that night). So if a small craft advisory is issued, I would suggest the directors contact the NWS in Buffalo to see when the new updates are going to happen, and make that the time(s) for the next decision. The other issue we're facing is the fact that the winds/waves are the hardest parameters to forecast for! So there will be days (seems like many days) that the forecast is going to be off - the meteorologists do not have a crystal ball, only very sophisticated computer models to try to piece together the forecast. We've all seen days on the big pond when there's a west wind around 15 knots and 3-5 footers while another day with west winds at 15 knots there's only a 2-ft chop. The difference is likely that one day there is a constant wind while the other is more variable, but one can't be that accurate in forecasting the winds all the time! It's the nature of the beast!

So, did it suck sitting at the dock? You betcha!! But like already stated, I'd rather be a little bummed that we didn't get out then see one of our fellow anglers get in serious trouble out there because the wind picked up.