New regulation regarding Rainbows on Finger Lakes a problem

[Sk8man]

I fished Canandaigua yesterday with a buddy who is also a very experienced fisherman (gives seminars of fly fishing and flytying etc.) We went 12 for 14 with 10 rainbows 1 brown (barely legal one) and a laker a couple of pounds. We attempted to release all of the fish including a couple 4-5 pound rainbows. Most were from the downriggers, and caught within the first 40-50 fft. of the water column over 100 plus depths. The problem was that of the fish released we had to keep the first two that didn't make it and then we had additional beautiful rainbow trout that likewise didn't make it despite not handling the fish in any way (released by using needle nose pliers to grab the single hook and gently lowering them to the water). Here is what I think may be the problem: LACTIC ACID buildup build up in the fish from fighting so hard before being released. This is a known problem among the salmonid species such as chinook and cohos and rainbows are known to be relatively "fragile" in terms of release even from shallow water of streams and lakes, while the problem of "heartier" lake trout seems to come from mainly from coming up from the depths too rapidly. Over the past few weeks nearly all of my catch has been rainbows (most released except the belly-ups). Earlier this summer we were getting some very good rainbows on Seneca as well including one my buddy got over 10 pounds that was released (and went belly up). The purported "shortage" of rainbows in the Finger Lakes I believe is a MYTH and this new regulation is in my view "misguided" and wastful since you have to leave fish that don't make it. When you fish specifically for rainbows and avoid "deeper setups" and "general techniques" where you get unintended lakers it is apparent that the rainbows are there and in numbers. I know there will be other opinions here (and from other lakes not mentioned) and I welcome them.

Les

[bandrus1]

1. just because the fish is belly up doesnt mean he doesnt turn over and swim off eventually...

2.. If trolling hold the fish in the current for a few mins and after that torpedo them straight down

[Hookedup]

If you spent time on catharine creek prior to 1994 then look at it now you wont find close to even a quarter of the Bows. This time of year before the lakers start feeding after the spawn you will be targeting bows every thing else has spawning on its minded. Bring them in slow and let them go at the back of the boat and most will make it. Sean

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[Sk8man]

I perhaps should have mentioned that I've been fishing the Finger lakes for over 60 years and trolling for over 50 of them. I've released thousands of fish comprising many species over that time. I've talked with many fisheries biologists from DEC and SUNY Brockport experts as well and each has said that trout should be handled MINIMALLY and ideally NOT AT ALL and it is especially mportant staying away from the gill areas if they are handled in any way. For one thing when they are handled the scales rub off and make them vulnerable to disease. I have found over time and after releasing trout that I am more successful releasing them in the way I described and no matter HOW it is done there is some mortality which is my main previous point. Only allowing one rainbow to be kept does not allow any leeway in the catch and release strategy....it is more intended to keep folks from taking and keeping 5 rainbows and hanging on to them regardless of size (as long as legal) or with repect to spawning potential etc. Three rainbows would have been more practical (as in Landlocks) The Catherine's situatiion is complicated....it could also relate to the present stream chemistry, bottom condition from previous high water, and environmantal factors, perhaps even causing more spawning in other less well known and less densely inhabited streams such as the ones on the eastern shore of Seneca and maybe even the Keuka Outlet on the west. There are many streams on Seneca that people don't significantly fish for trout (or at all in some cases) such as the Castle Creek which even runs through downtown Geneva and has historically held some decent rainbow population but few holding areas to fish them from.

[bandrus1]

There are many streams on Seneca that people don't significantly fish for trout (or at all in some cases) such as the Castle Creek which even runs through downtown Geneva and has historically held some decent rainbow population but few holding areas to fish them from.

welp they do now

[flyrod2]

I was one that was pushing for size increase for Bows on Owasco which they did. However they missed the boat on the Inlet. Again like Catherine, the Inlet was THE place to fish in Spring for 5+lb rainbow and lots of them. That has vanished due to stocking too many Lakers, loss of bait fish and especially the introduction of another apex predator, "walleye" among other things. This Spring we caught a couple spawned out rainbow, but not enough to go crazy with hope. We see many young bows heading to the lake and they never return. It doesn't hurt to put some limits for a while. Thankfully guys like sk8man put effort into the release. Bad news someone is right behind taking far over limit at any size.

[lakebound88]

There will always be guys taking over their limits..

I know on my charters, I ask the clients if they do not mind releasing a bow. I ask them if they are okay with one bow per boat per trip and 10 out of 10 say let them all go! Which is awesome! We get our pictures and away they go.. Sure some get hooked badly and were forced to keep them, but I will not waste any fish no matter the species! This new rainbow regulation is great. The DEC stocked many bows in Catherine this past year. Will it help? Who knows time will heal, now were losing a strain of fish ang gaining another if it takes. I do know, this year was a great year for bows from may-end of august. I can not complain. I support the support of the rainbow regulations and I for sure am glad they made to decision to follow through. I fish the bows year round from stream to the lake and love C&R on these guys. I keep my share of Atlantics. Better off getting them in the lake because by the time they run the creek, they are snagged up, litterally.

[GAMBLER]

If you release them at the back of the boat and do not handle them, more will survive. Less time out of the water = less stress.

[quality time]

As Sean said slow and steady, and in the water release is best , if you need to bring the fish in the boat boga grip or Berkley lip gripper. They have worked great for us. netting a fiish removes protective slim and banging and flopping around the bottom of the boat is not good. And the obviouse would be change your target species when you are close to the limit. Dropping your lures deeper will put you in the laker zone and many of the fingers they want you harvest more lakers. They are great on the grill.

[Outdoorsman]

When you fish specifically for rainbows and avoid "deeper setups" and "general techniques" where you get unintended lakers it is apparent that the rainbows are there and in numbers. I know there will be other opinions here (and from other lakes not mentioned) and I welcome them.

One option would be to increase the strength of your tackle. Fight the fish faster and let it go sooner. I'm not sure what setup you use now, but maybe try to increase the strength of your leader or line and use fluorocarbon to minimize reductions in catch.

Another would be to target them for a while, catch some to take home, and then target something else.

[quality time]

We have worked hard to refine our catch and release rate and I can tell you faster is not better . A fish brought in to fast from depths as shallow as 30 ft. can have problems with the air bladder. We learned this soon after I got my latest boat. We had several "floaters" untill my wife went with us. She reeled slow and steady on fish as deep as 120' and they went back down like a rocket. Our next best improvement was the Boga or Berkley lip gripper. Keeping the fish out of the net and off the boat floor is a huge improvement! Fighting a fish for a real long time is not good as well . If you fish with 2 lb test this could be a problem but anything over that the fish should be O.K. I would guess we keep about 3 or 4 pound load on the rod.

[Sk8man]

Quality Time's input is right on....I've used the gripper successfully in the past and it does a good job but I've found the long needlenose pliers to work even better for me at least (I only use stainesss single salmon hooks on all my lures except Rapalas etc. ....even the Suttons despite chenging the action a bit). I grip the hook itself and turn it upside down in their mouth and 90 percent fall out of the "hole" without touching the fish at the back of the boat where they are a little protected from the turbulance and right at the water level...most take off like a rocket but again some don't and thats where I have a problem with the 1 limit.. once you've kept a fish that goes belly up and obviously isn't going to make it ( I know an ocassional fish will) any others have to be left for the seagulls and often the fish are much too big for them...I often fish by myself so only one fish is possible to keep unlike the charters or guys that fish with several in the boat. Most of my tackle has 12 pound test with 10 lb fluoro leaders with the exception of the leadcore, wire, thermocline rigs etc. but as you know rainbows jump alot and fight hard right up to the boat and I only net if I'm going to keep a fish. I don't care much to eat Lake Trout and they sure aren't as much fun to catch as the rainbows, browns and landlocks (after 50 years of it) and I no longer bass fish as I burned out on that years ago. Looks like more perch fishing is in order (I'm always torn between it and the trout at this time of the year anyway :>)

Les

[quality time]

Try the lake trout like this and you might change your mind about eating them! Start by getting fish on ice as soon as it is landed. Many gill and bleed as well. You must eat these fish fresh. The flesh goes down hill in a hurry and I most often eat them as soon as I am home or the next day. If you freeze these fish you will not get the same results. Place fillets in a ziplock bag with lemon garlic marinade. Marinade for at least 30 minutes 45 is even better. Next I place the fillets in a foil boat pouring the remains of the marinade over the fillets. Add a good sprinkle of raw or brown suger and dill weed if you have some.I put them on the grill and add a few chunks of hickory or apple wood for a nice light smoke . Do not over cook and I don't even flip the fish unless it is a real big fillet. I use charcoal grill but you can put wood chips on a gas grill if you put the wood in foil and put holes in the foil to let the smoke out but keep it from burning. After writing this I might need to get the boat out again! Wes

[lakebound88]

Imo, if you believe the one fish rule is something that shouldn't of happened, the DEC would probably like comments and concerns.. I know they like any feedback I've given. Wheather good or bad..

Nick

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[Sk8man]

Thanks for the input guys....I'll try the recipe etc. and send an email to DEC as suggested.

[ERABBIT]

This new rainbow regulation is great. The DEC stocked many bows in Catherine this past year. Will it help? Who knows time will heal, now were losing a strain of fish ang gaining another if it takes. I do know, this year was a great year for bows from may-end of august. I can not complain. I support the support of the rainbow regulations and I for sure am glad they made to decision to follow through. I fish the bows year round from stream to the lake and love C&R on these guys. I keep my share of Atlantics. Better off getting them in the lake because by the time they run the creek, they are snagged up, litterally.

Nick are you dead on on this "new" strain ....... that just sucks , I didn't agree with this when they were talking about it and would have been louder if I knew they were going to put in a new strain. I did write and send a e-mail they were looking for input , against this .....I said if it was so bad they were going from 5 to 1 fish they should just colse the stream spawning areas or shut down the small tribs one or two each year or put money into one and close it ALL the time upgrade the spawning area............. this stocking fish in a stream is a BAD thing....... they have found that out in Pa. a long time ago........only so many places for fish to hide behind a rock or where ever put the NEW guys in in force and the chase the natural re-pro ones out and some end belly up trying to keep there spot........

I keep my share of Atlantics. Better off getting them in the lake because by the time they run the creek, they are snagged up, litterally

That is just wrong what are the DEC guys doing when this is going on................

[lakebound88]

I do not think the new strain is good, no but I do hope it promotes the bow fishing. As far as the fall run atlantics, the Dec watches them, but it's all during hunting seasons peak so they are busy elsewhere...

When I said I don't waste.. I meant that I won't waste that specific fish. I will not take my chances keeping 1 too many fish it is not worth the fine. however just for example during the memorial day tournament when we do I big fish Friday we got a 10 pound rainbow and a 8 pound rainbow we did release both of those fish because it was just not worth winning 200 dollars to me to ruin two fish that were beautiful and healthy.

I don't like to keep short fish.. even if legal, hardly any meat on them. I like a good eating fish, not a fish that is like eating "fish sticks".

I want to see the bow population back to what it was when I was riding a tricycle around. Good old days are gone..

It's all opinions... The DEC deals with the facts? Or do they....

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[Sk8man]

Here is what I sent to DEC and just received back. Note the name and addresses below is where my email was forwarded so if you ever have input (either way) this is where it should go.

Mr. B:

Thank you for your email and observations.

Webster Pearsall

Region 8 Fisheries Manager

[email protected]

585-226-5339

>>> Fish FW 10/19/2012 10:37 AM >>>

Dear Sirs:

I won't reiterate all the details of my concerns here but will rather refer you to the following link wherein I outlined my concerns:

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=35951&p=216832#p216832

My suggestion for rectifying my concerns would be this change to the regulation: A daily limit of ONE Rainbow Trout on all Finger Lakes TRIBUTARIES but THREE for the lakes proper which would be in line and consistent with the limit on Landlock Salmon. My reasoning is discussed in detail in the link provided at the top. Thank you sincerely for any consideration given to my input. Keep up the good work that you do despite the short staffing.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[FLXTroutman]

I talked to a local Canandaigua old timer and he said the new rainbow regulations were more aimed at all the other Finger Lakes except Canandaigua Lake but the DEC figured it would cause too much confusion amongst anglers if all the Finger Lakes were not ruled the same way. I kept a diary last year for the DEC for Canandaigua Lake and I caught alot of rainbows compared to the other diary keepers. Not all the bows were large fish but it shows that there is a healthy population. I can attest to releasing rainbows in August and seeing them go belly up. I can also attest to watching fish struggle belly up and eventually kick and go down.

Quality Time's recipe sounds delicious and I will have to try it the next time I have some fresh lake trout filets. I have also pondered the bleed them out technique to improve the quality of the prepared catch. See ya out there Sunday, I still have room for maybe one more guy.

[ERABBIT]

I have also pondered the bleed them out technique to improve the quality of the prepared catch.

Do it , Jason told me the same thing ever since I cut the gills put them in the livewell in water , then on ice......

One more to try is : Ken's Steak House Vidalia Onion Dressing , put it on the laketrout filte 15 to 20 minutes then on the grill MMMmmmmm !!!!!

If you like deep fryed fish I have a good one for laketrout also.......

[lakebound88]

yes thats a great one! I bleed out fish for clients, plus it makes for easier cleaner fillets. Also, I have a recipe,

Soy sauce, Italian Dressing and brown sugar- mix of equal parts till a thick syrup is made then marinate fish in sauce. DELICOUS!

[pokepole39]

ahhhhh the days of the seflong wish they were back grew fast faught hard and ate and craped like a king to bad theirs no bait left for beans