coppers and dipsys

[reeladdiction2]

Is it possible and to run 3 coppers and 4 dipsys? I have a 400, 450, and 500 copper. 2 10-6 and 2 8 foot dipsys. I was thinking 400 and 450 on the planer boards. The 500 down the middle. The 10'-6" at a 3 setting on a size 1 dipsy. And the 8" at a 1.5 setting on a mag dipsy. So that's my master plan. I only have to wait till april to try it. This will be my first year on lake O with my own boat and last year was my first year that I got into fishing it a lot. I do understand if the fish are in 40 foot of water that my coppers will be no good. If someone can point me in the correct direction. ie, that is a good idea or you are stupid for thinking that. I need to get the most bang for my buck..........................................................................im going nuts i just want to fish!

[Paul Czarnecki]

Just because you CAN do something doesn't mean you SHOULD. Sometimes less is more......and that's all I'm gonna say about that.

[BAZOOKAJOE]

Sounds like a recipe for disaster!

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[Raaven]

Just because you CAN do something doesn't mean you SHOULD. Sometimes less is more......and that's all I'm gonna say about that.

Just give me ONE, that works!

Is it possible and to run 3 coppers and 4 dipsys? I have a 400, 450, and 500 copper. 2 10-6 and 2 8 foot dipsys. I was thinking 400 and 450 on the planer boards. The 500 down the middle. The 10'-6" at a 3 setting on a size 1 dipsy. And the 8" at a 1.5 setting on a mag dipsy. So that's my master plan. I only have to wait till april to try it. This will be my first year on lake O with my own boat and last year was my first year that I got into fishing it a lot. I do understand if the fish are in 40 foot of water that my coppers will be no good. If someone can point me in the correct direction. ie, that is a good idea or you are stupid for thinking that. I need to get the most bang for my buck..........................................................................im going nuts i just want to fish!

What is important to remember is that you are trying to focus your spread in a controlled depth....THE STRIKE ZONE.

We sometimes will have 5 coppers and 4 dipsys out at the same time, as well as three downriggers. But we run two coppers off of each board, and another down the chute. If our target "strike zone" is 20-50 feet down, we replace the coppers with leadcore. If the fish are hitting a 300 copper...we will put out 4-5 of them, and adjust our dipsys accordingly. By running all the same length coppers, we can slide the one in the chute to either board after the one on the board hooks up. Reset the one that fired back down the chute. Saves alot of cranking copper just to reset a longer one first, then redeploying a shorter one. but when that length copper shuts off...you have to change them all...We start by using a longer one down the chute, and a shorter one on the inside position on the boards...find the "strike zone" again, and FOCUS ON IT!

I understand not every boat has 30 copper rods aboard to play with either..... But we have a little problem with our tackle addiction

[reeladdiction2]

O no....I never thought of having more than one of the same copper. That makes all the sense in the world though. A man once told me that they had over 20 copper rods. I thought they were like 300, 325, 350, 375 and so on. But now I understand I need to take another loan out and buy stock in copper rods. WOW!

[BAZOOKAJOE]

I'd run 2 dipseys and 2 coppers off big boards. Leave the chute open. Or better yet get 2 riggers. Their's days you won't want the hassle of the coppers/boards. And days the dipseys just won't dig down to where they should.

[ Post made via iPhone ]

[reeladdiction2]

There are 4 riggers on the boat. I was told that some days the fish dont like the riggers. Whats the best spread to start out each day? riggers and dipsy? and if the dipsy are hitting get the coppers out?

[Raaven]

There are 4 riggers on the boat. I was told that some days the fish dont like the riggers. Whats the best spread to start out each day? riggers and dipsy? and if the dipsy are hitting get the coppers out?

Tough for me to tell you what is the best daily starting spread for your situation....We are chartering. Captain , mate, and 2-6 guests everyday....so we are putting out a minimum twelve rod spread if the conditions allow.....4 riggers, 4 dipsys, 4 coppers....If it is rough, 4downriggers-2dipsys-2coppers-...really rough, 3 downriggers, 2 dipsys and one copper down chute...

Again, The whole object is to find the depth the fish are striking at, and focus your efforts there.

If you are alone, start with 1 downrigger(probe) one dipsy, one copper. What ever fires, DUPLICATE.

[Gill-T]

To answer what has not been already covered......depends on water temp and time of year. Your long coppers might come into play in May off Niagara County, but really won't shine consistently until later in the summer when the fish are deeper. Get on a boat as an observer for any of the four Pro/Ams and you will see there are some little tricks to keep tangles down to a minimum. The July Sodus Pro/Am would be the one I would pick to see the long Coppers in action.

[reeladdiction2]

That is something that I did plan to do this up coming year. I also wanted to enter in a few myself. I would love to get some money or prizes for my addiction. Learning the tricks to keep my lines untangled is just like winning a prize. If you run 2 coppers off one planer board. Should the longer be out farther or closer to the boat. How far out is the planer board usually? Is there any relation to the length of copper?

[Tim Bromund]

longer copper should be closer to the boat, so that if the outside line gets hit, it will swing in behind the boat above the deeper inside line. The other way around, the longer (deeper) outside line would tangle with the higher inside line when it got hit.

Tim

[Iceman]

There you go again Tim, clouding the issue at hand with facts!!

Agree!!

[Yankee Troller]

I think you need to slow down and perfect running your riggers well with dipsys. Once you have that down start experimenting with Copper. It's nicer to run them off to the side with a planer board rather than down the chute where it can really get in the way. If you are not 1) Tourney fishing 2) Chartering or 3) going to consume the fish I would not run coppers longer than a 300. It will pretty much kill the fish.

Copper is an expensive game because you need different lengths to achieve different strike zones. I am in no way affiliated with Torpedos, but for someone starting out with "junk lines" I would buy two wire set-ups and two sets of Torpedo divers. The depth chart is included and you can cover so many depths for much cheaper than investing in 4-10 copper set-ups. They can also double as your 3rd and 4th diver if you want to run 4 wires.

[rolmops]

Hm,I always thought that a combination of different lines and depth set up a balanced overall presentation,which is attractive because it is balanced.

What I read here is very different. where does balanced overall presentation stop and singular presentation start?

[Gill-T]

Depends.... at first light, fish are often feeding at a certain level so flooding the hot zone to cash in would be a good tactic. If I am steelhead fishing offshore during the summer, I am often fishing a tight band of ideal water temps so I will flood the target zone. Conversely, in search mode.... spread 'em out until you can figure out what is going on that day.

[Raaven]

longer copper should be closer to the boat, so that if the outside line gets hit, it will swing in behind the boat above the deeper inside line. The other way around, the longer (deeper) outside line would tangle with the higher inside line when it got hit.

Tim

Hmm, I will have to try that! I always ran the other way, longer out, shorter in, or both the same length on a side....Never had too many issues with tangles on a straight troll strike...turns and crazy coho seem to tangle more often for me!

If you don't get tangles, you are not fishing aggressively enough.......

I agree with the torpedo weights. Another great tool in the arsenal!

[reeladdiction2]

Alright if I run a bunch of lines and only get tangles with myself I should be fine. Which brings me to my next big ponder. I purchased a pair of 14lb rigger weights for a pretty good deal. Now need to find another pair. I am looking at the cabelas directional weights. They are only 12lb. SO..... are they no good for getting to 100'? I am thinking they would be a good idea. But! they might not be I have never used them. They could be a disaster waiting to happen. Get another pair of 14lb, get the directional pair, or go with both? Never can have enough tackle right? Keep helping the helpless. THANKS!

[TyeeTanic]

I always target a range of depths, especially when I start out in the mornings and need to hone in on where the fish are. I run 4 dipseys and 2 mono's on weights off the planer boards. I would be nervous about putting one down the chute as when the dipseys pop a lot of line goes out and anything down the chute could get tangled.

I usually have my monos on planer boards in the 20 - 40 foot depth, two dipseys at 40 - 60 feet and two at 60 - 90 feet. If all the bite is in one place, we operate everything within a 30 foot depth within the strike zone.

[skipper19]

Too many coppers and a pod of steelhead in frenzy....now you will have a frenzy and a lot of expensive copper to replace or untangle for the next hour. Less is more..TOTALLY AGREE! Rick is right! riggers and dipsy control and experiment with copper in different positions according to the target depth.

[bloodrun]

We successfully and at a minimum run three coppers a side but more regularly run 4-5 coppers a side here on Lake Michigan. That with two wire divers each side is a very standard spread for rec boats and charter boats here on lake MI.

What we have found is that generally an optimum strike zone is roughly 30 feet in the water column. Example, strike zone in early spring would be lets say 40 feet down. Our spread would be three riggers (Lake MI standard) at 25, 30 and 40. Two wire divers each side at 90 and 140, and then 4 coppers a side at 100, 150, 200 and 250 foot segments. Those will run at 20, 30, 40 and 50 feet down respectively. Sometimes we will run a 300' to keep them honest at 60' down.

We have effectively just stuffed the strike box with 15 rods with that program. We ONLY run coppers off inline boards, for a variety of reasons. We prefer to use Church Walleye boards for our short coppers. For our long 350+ coppers we pull them with Church TX-44 inlines.

If fish are deeper, and optimum strike zone is 120 down, we would pull riggers at 110, 120 and 140. Two wire divers each side of the boat set at 300 and 400 respectively, and 3 coppers a side at 450, 500 and 600...again pulled with Church TX44 inlines, which are the only inlines capable of pulling longer coppers with paddles on them.

Described above is a very vanilla standard Lake MI program guys pull all day long over here. Most of us never turn, we straight line troll into the current, so tangles are at a minimum. We do occasionally make wide turns with this program with good spacing between boards without issue.

I will be covering this setup in great depth with visuals at the Blood Run Tackle table at the LOTSA show in late Feb. Stop by and we can go over some finer details.

Also, we run 50, 100 and 150 coppers all day long in 40 feet of water and less. We no longer pull leadcore over here, and its quickly going the way of the dinosaur for a number of reasons. Your depths here would be 10, 20 and 30 feet down with those segments. Deadly on staging kings and steel when the lake rolls over and cold water gets trapped onshore.

[Yankee Troller]

I've never seen an in-line pull anything over a 5 color very good out to the side. I also haven't used the TX-44s. I guess I am just used to how far out to the side I can get a line when slid down an Otter Boat. Personally, I can't stand having to fight an in-line, however I am trying hard to like fishing with them to get more lines out especially on tougher days. Great first post!

[reeladdiction2]

Putting out 12 plus rods would be a sight I would love to see. I never thought it was possible until recent knowledge from you guys. 4 riggers, 2 dipsy, and 2 coppers would be the most I would dare to try. I can understand why a charter would put a big spread out but I plan to just try to show off for my friends and family. Hopefully the fishing is great I will not even put 8 rods out. If it is real slow I will try to get a few more out. Ill be the best lure washer here in Starkville, NY! Thanks again!

[bloodrun]

Thanks for the feedback, hope the info was helpful. Board spacing is a big deal with wide programs like this, and pulling the right angle into the current is paramount to its success...and pulling multiple inlines actually tells us the best angle to troll. Compound a high diver out 400 with a 600 copper running over it things can get dicey. Prior to the intro of the TX-44 inlines we struggled to get long coppers with flashers out far enough. But, the 44's are unbelievable at what they do an can pull out as far as necessary. That said, when the high diver goes off we rip the rod out of the holder and get it over to the other side of the boat immediately just to avoid it coming up under the 600.....it works.

A few years back our DNR pushed the limit up to 5 per person so as charter operators, some of us felt compelled to continue to deliver the limit catches our customers got used to. So instead of 12 fish being a good day, now if we dont come back with at least 20 to 30 its a bad day! We had to stretch the limits of what we had to do on the water to hit those numbers consistently in a 5-6 hour trip so we pushed the envelope.

Anyway, looking forward to maybe meeting some of you guys if you are going to the show in Feb. We have alot of interest in some tactics you guys use as well and hopefully we can pick up some tricks to use over here.