Ruff Rider Video Tutorial - How to Run Copper

[TOP SECRET]

So Theresa and I have been playing around with making some "how to" videos for those just starting out salmon fishing... let me know what you think and if there are other videos you think new folks might be interested in.

 

 

I'll need to do a revisit on this video at some point to show how to use inline swivels and shrink tubing as well.

[momay4000]

Nice video Nick - it's great to see someone who has such great passion about fishing take the time to teach others. Couple of comments:

 

1.) When I spool my backing for copper or lead core, I always put a small wrap of electrical tape over the knot (unless you have a small stud on your arbor) otherwise I have found that the backing slips

 

2.) The copper depth charts are a bit inaccurate. With the new Smarttroll data, the copper does not always sink at the proverbial 22' per 100' out rule. Somewhere on this site, the sink rates were posted

 

Thanks again for sharing and taking such great time to help us - good luck on the water,

 

Chris

[TOP SECRET]

...unless you have a small stud on your arbor...

We actually have a big stud on our boat, just sayin lol

Thanks for the feedback, I'll try to include it in my follow up video!

[tlombardozzi]

great video, perfect for someone like me that is getting started, couple questions:

1. what line do you use for the leader?

2. what is the leader length?

3. can you set up the rig running behind the boat if you don't have an otter?

please post any other videos like this one, awesome info

thanks

[Fishtails]

Hey Nick, I just spooled up a 735 copper a couple weeks ago. You are welcome to use it in your video if ya really want to show the ugly side of copper. Teresa would like it a lot!!  I know Justin enjoyed pulling in lakers on it last week

[Big Water]

Nice video Nick!    I've had real problems with the copper Albright knot failing.  I think the copper eventually cuts through the other line.   That's why I always use inline swivels and shrink wrap.  Are you not seeing that? 

[Adk1]

Is copper line better to use than wire? I guess the copper sinks faster right? Sounds like copper is just like lead but with strength therefore not needing the Dacron outside?

[TOP SECRET]

great video, perfect for someone like me that is getting started, couple questions:

1. what line do you use for the leader?

2. what is the leader length?

3. can you set up the rig running behind the boat if you don't have an otter?

please post any other videos like this one, awesome info

thanks

 

tlom,

 

1. We've used 30lb and 50lb big game mono as well as 30lb flouro for our leader.  We use dodger/flies 99% of the time on copper so I'm not sure that the leader material really matters.  I certainly haven't seen a difference using each type of leader.
2. I've tried anywhere from 30ft to 5ft of leader.  I saw a significant decrease in hits when I used 5ft of leader.  From 15-30ft I didn't notice any difference in hits though.
3. You CAN run the copper right down the middle.  I used to do that when I first starting running it, but it quickly became a pain.  There's too much line out to quickly reel it in when you get a king on, so the best you can do is move it as far to the opposite side of the boat as possible, and hope the fish doesn't get into it.  It's so much nicer to put it out on the board way out of the way.  Well worth the $80 for an otter boat.

Nick

[TOP SECRET]

Hey Nick, I just spooled up a 735 copper a couple weeks ago. You are welcome to use it in your video if ya really want to show the ugly side of copper. Teresa would like it a lot!!  I know Justin enjoyed pulling in lakers on it last week

 

Rod that is like some kind of torture device!  Theresa wouldn't even let me bring something like that on the boat!  We are waiting on our bloorun copper to arrive so that we can spool up a new 300 copper.  We're going to use torpedo weights to get them down deeper and see how we like it compared to a 600' copper.

 

Nick

[TOP SECRET]

Nice video Nick!    I've had real problems with the copper Albright knot failing.  I think the copper eventually cuts through the other line.   That's why I always use inline swivels and shrink wrap.  Are you not seeing that? 

 

We had a real problem with tying the knots at first, then we switched to the Albright knot.  We also found that we had a crack in one of our eyes and it was cutting our backer.  Since then, we've had no problems with the knots failing (over a year).  That being said, I just bought some of the inline swivels to try though.

 

Nick

[TOP SECRET]

Is copper line better to use than wire? I guess the copper sinks faster right? Sounds like copper is just like lead but with strength therefore not needing the Dacron outside?

 

Adk, correct on all accounts.  The copper is much heavier than stainless wire, which makes it sink faster.  Copper is excactly like leadcore, except heavier and without the Dacron sheathing.  The copper is strong enough to not need the Dacron.  Since I've started using copper, I've found no need for leadcore.  I'll just let the copper out less (maybe 250ft of my 600ft copper) and it will stay at a depth similar to a leadcore.

 

Nick

[bloodrun]

Nice video Nick - it's great to see someone who has such great passion about fishing take the time to teach others. Couple of comments:

 

1.) When I spool my backing for copper or lead core, I always put a small wrap of electrical tape over the knot (unless you have a small stud on your arbor) otherwise I have found that the backing slips

 

2.) The copper depth charts are a bit inaccurate. With the new Smarttroll data, the copper does not always sink at the proverbial 22' per 100' out rule. Somewhere on this site, the sink rates were posted

 

Thanks again for sharing and taking such great time to help us - good luck on the water,

 

Chris

 

Here is the link to the new copper depth numbers...

 

http://www.bloodruntackle.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/CopperDiveChart.pdf

[TOP SECRET]

Great thanks for the new numbers.

 

[skipper19]

Hey Nick, I just spooled up a 735 copper a couple weeks ago. You are welcome to use it in your video if ya really want to show the ugly side of copper. Teresa would like it a lot!! I know Justin enjoyed pulling in lakers on it last week

Rod that is like some kind of torture device! Theresa wouldn't even let me bring something like that on the boat! We are waiting on our bloorun copper to arrive so that we can spool up a new 300 copper. We're going to use torpedo weights to get them down deeper and see how we like it compared to a 600' copper.

Nick

Nick, I might be one of the most unorthodox, give it a try kind of guys out there....I like your willingness to experimentation. I hope the torpedo/copper idea works..I am sure it will.

I have had strange comments about some ways I keep deep running rigs closer to the boat without winding in 600 feet plus another 700 of backing torn off by an express king! 1300 feet! Might as well reel in a boot full of water, that fish is pretty dead!. I have a 600, I don't use it all. It is torture!

My 200 and 300 get more use. I like your idea on the torpedo/copper.

Have you thought of trying a standard 1 dipsy set 0 to 1 chute or gunnel style as a normal diver set? With 300 ft of 45 lb copper, that combo hits the area of a 600 plus. Never got an exact measure, but it hits bottom at a ratio near 2.3 to 1. Maybe someone with smartoll could check it out. It has drag so not easily used on boards, but no worse than a wire diver. No fleas either.

Ok, now I'm gonna go sit in my corner. Cause I might have put a clown horn on a Harley-Davidson. I still say its a train horn on a tricycle...and I like hollow core for transitions to backing and leader...no knots...no swivels.. no catchy guides.. wind on leader.

Oh, and this is much less stressful in tight quarters with other trollers if ya gotta fish deep with long lines!

Mark

Edited June 30, 2013 by skipper19

[Fishtails]

Torpedo's will work, I know dive bombs do. So does putting it on your center rigger. The 735 copper started as a joke to see how much we could get on a reel with 450 ft of 30lb power pro backing. I had some custom 45 lb copper made that is only .033 dia. That's what fit on a Penn 345 GTI. Coulda squeezed 750+ but the spooler didn't wind it on level.

I put it in the water twice. It takes several minutes to let it all out,it caught a fish within 10 minutes both times, then took like 45 minutes to reel it in. LMBO Something like that really needs to be on an electric reel. My electric reel is named Justin, but it's very slow and needs to be upgraded, lol

I do think the length plays a role along with depth. Maybe not enough for it to matter day to day, but definitely when money is on the line

Edited June 30, 2013 by Fishtails

[MeanMachine]

Nick - you ever have any issues clamping the copper directly to the release for the planer. I'm a little hesitant to clip mine directly to the clamp. BTW great video!

[BALLS DEEP]

Nice video

[TOP SECRET]

Nick - you ever have any issues clamping the copper directly to the release for the planer. I'm a little hesitant to clip mine directly to the clamp. BTW great video!

 

I haven't, but I can imagine it depends on what kind of release your run and if they are in good condition or have nicks in them.  Mine are pretty light, so there isn't much pressure put on the copper.  That being said... I prefer to half hitch the rubber band and put the rubber band way down in the release.  I get a lot less false releases that way... although sometimes if you get a dink on it can be hard to tell.

 

Nick

[TOP SECRET]

Nick, I might be one of the most unorthodox, give it a try kind of guys out there....I like your willingness to experimentation. I hope the torpedo/copper idea works..I am sure it will.

I have had strange comments about some ways I keep deep running rigs closer to the boat without winding in 600 feet plus another 700 of backing torn off by an express king! 1300 feet! Might as well reel in a boot full of water, that fish is pretty dead!. I have a 600, I don't use it all. It is torture!

My 200 and 300 get more use. I like your idea on the torpedo/copper.

Have you thought of trying a standard 1 dipsy set 0 to 1 chute or gunnel style as a normal diver set? With 300 ft of 45 lb copper, that combo hits the area of a 600 plus. Never got an exact measure, but it hits bottom at a ratio near 2.3 to 1. Maybe someone with smartoll could check it out. It has drag so not easily used on boards, but no worse than a wire diver. No fleas either.

Ok, now I'm gonna go sit in my corner. Cause I might have put a clown horn on a Harley-Davidson. I still say its a train horn on a tricycle...and I like hollow core for transitions to backing and leader...no knots...no swivels.. no catchy guides.. wind on leader.

Oh, and this is much less stressful in tight quarters with other trollers if ya gotta fish deep with long lines!

Mark

 

Mark,

 

No doubt in my mind any of that would work.  Lately I find myself asking less of "will it work" and more of "is it worth it".  Putting copper down the chute at any time has fallen into the "not fun" category for me   Putting it out the side on a dipsey should work, but I imagine you'd need to tighten your dipsey release down pretty tight so the weight of the copper wouldn't trip it while going through waves.  I wonder if this would limit an entire side of my boat to one rod though, as any other dipsey on that side or even something off the boards might just be asking for trouble and would tangle unless you were really really careful?

 

Nick

[skipper19]

I don't do it often, but in tight traffic, I have and it works well on a 1 setting and any thing on the wire diver set is a 2.5 on that side. It is in really close, and the wire diver never even gets close. As far as chute goes, it is a little better than just bare copper because it angles down so quickly, most anything that hits the riggers blows past it, but not always. Everything gets a chance at tangles with a jumping steely though. I try to Target steely with less lines and more width. Moving a chute rod around is never the best fun like you said. Wire is wire, but copper helps the diver do what it does best....dive better. Tension on the diver remains the same.

[Dipsey]

Good stuff! Love my 450 copper.

[Adk1]

Do you need to have a special rod to run copper line? i.e. like wire line? Also, would a 30 class reel hold enough copper?

[erupprecht]

Great Job!

[Tim Bromund]

Do you need to have a special rod to run copper line? i.e. like wire line? Also, would a 30 class reel hold enough copper?

 

No, and No.  Copper line is soft , so it won't damage the guides, but it also has a large diameter and needs a big, high capacity reel to hold the copper and adequate backing.

 

Tim

Edited July 1, 2013 by Tim Bromund

[Adk1]

ok so a 40 class then. Would you use a dipsey diver style rod or downrigger?