8 Species in 1 day

[jekyll]

Had an interesting day last Saturday in Mexico Bay - I caught 8 different species trolling between 100 and 190 FOW. Started with a nice King on a double glow ghost spoon on a 10 color and then followed it up with a coho on the same rig. Then came a steelhead followed by a large rainbow on sliders. After a few more kings and steelhead, I released a 23 inch Atlantic and finished with several browns, one of which had a lamprey. The lamprey made for the 7th species but, it went back in pieces. Oh yeah, the 8th species was an earth worm that came on a rigger. It didn't put up much of fight as it was only 1 1/2 inches long. I'm surprised it survived in 100 FOW. I did catch a mooneye on a spoon the day prior so, 9 species in back-to-back outings. IIR, the most species I've caught in one day was 5 prior to this. 

 

I was targeting steelhead for the LOC so I was running 2 riggers for salmon and the remaining lines were cores on boards. Most kings came on the riggers though several came on the cores. The sliders and cores brought in a good number of steelhead and a few browns over the weekend, regretfully I missed the steelhead leader board by several ounces. 

[John Kelley]

Umm, correct my math if I am wrong but king, coho, steelhead, brown, atlantic, and lamprey are only 6 species.  Seeing that rainbow and steelhead are the same fish would still have only gotten you 7 if they were different species.  I did not see lake trout on your list. Just wondering where you get 8 from is all.  Oh and the mooneye gets you to 7 though, so still quite a few species.

Edited July 9, 2013 by John Kelley

[p3434]

It sounds like a good day.  

[BSmaster]

It sounds like a good day.  

 

To me too.

[reelintense]

Umm, correct my math if I am wrong but king, coho, steelhead, brown, atlantic, and lamprey are only 6 species. Seeing that rainbow and steelhead are the same fish would still have only gotten you 7 if they were different species. I did not see lake trout on your list. Just wondering where you get 8 from is all. Oh and the mooneye gets you to 7 though, so still quite a few species.

Technically a steelhead and a domestic rainbow are different fish! If he indeed caught a domestic rainbow. A steelhead is a hybrid rainbow/salmonoid and while we throw these two fish into the same category, they really are different fish species. Like a tiger musky and a "regular" musky!

[John Kelley]

Umm, correct my math if I am wrong but king, coho, steelhead, brown, atlantic, and lamprey are only 6 species.  Seeing that rainbow and steelhead are the same fish would still have only gotten you 7 if they were different species.  I did not see lake trout on your list. Just wondering where you get 8 from is all.  Oh and the mooneye gets you to 7 though, so still quite a few species.

Sorry, but you are incorrect with that statement, they are the same species of fish: latin name Oncorhynchus Mykiss.  A tiger musky is the cross between a pike, Esox Lucius, and a muskellunge, Esox Maskinonge.  Rainbows are just the name that everyone gives them, but really they are all just steelhead. They all develop the red band more distinctly when they enter the rivers, just like the brownies get their color back when they enter the river.  There are different strains of steelhead or rainbow, but that is a different discussion altogether.  For this discussion they are all the same species. And no, a steelhead is not any kind of hybridized type of fish.

[Tim Bromund]

Technically a steelhead and a domestic rainbow are different fish! If he indeed caught a domestic rainbow. A steelhead is a hybrid rainbow/salmonoid and while we throw these two fish into the same category, they really are different fish species.

No, Sorry, they're not, technically or otherwise.  A steelhead is a rainbow and a rainbow is a steelhead. Domestic/inland nonmigratory rainbows and migratory steelhead are different genetic strains of rainbow trout, but are the same species.  

 

What is a salmonoid exactly that they supposedly hybridized a rainbow with, and who was it that performed that supposed genetic engineering many thousands of years ago?

[reelintense]

i will stand corrected and am not afraid to admit that.  I was told several years ago (apparently incorrectly) that a domestic rainbow was not the same as a steelhead.  This was at a point where i caught a "rainbow" for puposes of this discussion that looked nothing like a steelhead. Downrigging in Lake Ontario off I-bay in +/- 150fow.   It was much squattier or football shaped like a healthy brown....had a beautiful well developed rose colored stripe down the side and while the head resemled that of a steelhead it looked nothing like what I think we all call steelhead. Where we see a hint or light pink stripe, but the body is mostly steel/silver and long and thin body!  At this point i was told that a steelhead was a cross much like a chin-ho (chinook/coho) where rainbows and some salmonoid variety had been breed. I was not sure if that was accidental (as does happen in nature, like Chin-ho's) or if it had been engineered by man that way.  But i didnt question it....sorry, but i trusted the source.  So now I have googled several websites to understand anadramous vs resident rainbow.   Maybe I got a resident rainbow that was lost out to Lake Ontario, or maybe they occassionally go out there or maybe it was just a really beautiful looking steelhead of different shape and size and color.....but that is why i made the incorrect statement that they were different.  Similar but different....but I stand (or sit) corrected.  Sorry guys! 

J

[Tim Bromund]

No, the state stocks both domestic rainbows and steelhead in the lake.  It's interesting that the domestic rainbows have been genetically manipulated in our hatchery system (using light manipulation I believe) to be fall spawners instead of spring like rainbows naturally are, so those are the ones that run earlier in the fall, with the washington (chambers creek strain) steelhead picking up in November. 

 

Our domestics are clearly a different genetic strain of rainbow trout and have a distinctly different look than the Chambers Creek steelhead, usually much thicker bodied relative to length and with more vibrant coloration (emerald green backs, faint but evident red stripe even in the open lake) than the long lean fish with pure chrome sides with and almost gunmetal (dark green/gray) back of the steelhead.

 

I don't have a lot of domestic rainbow pics in my photobucket account as we don't keep a lot of bows/steelies but here is one, the stripe didn't show up great in the photo:

 

 

typical chambers creek steelhead

 

 

 

 

Tim

[reelintense]

Well that clears it up! I guess it's easy to call them different, when they look so much different side by side. So I assumed same family, but more like cousins. Thanks for explanation Tim, it is appreciated!

[CaptSpike]

I believe Jekyll stated 8 species, not 8 species of fish.So you forgot to count the earth worm! And not to break this down completely I believe for a species he listed the rainbow and steelhead seperatly just as the various salmon were listed a different species. Species strain ....whatever......He caught 8 different things, which I believe was the point.

 

Sounds like a great trip. I hope my trips go half as good as that.

 

Spike

[Yankee Troller]

You guys are too technical! I just call them Steelbows! Problem solved! LOL I guess they could be called Rainheads too....Hmmmm

Edited July 9, 2013 by Yankee Troller

[Custom Deluxe]

i like steelbows. nice and easy. theres enough to worry about on the water

You guys are too technical! I just call them Steelbows! Problem solved! LOL I guess they could be called Rainheads too....Hmmmm

[LongLine]

10 if you caught any fleas......

 

Just playing...sounds like you had quite an outing.  Congrats.

 

Tom B.

(LongLine)

[Big Dave]

Call-em what you want !!  Still sounds like a great day on the Bay!!  

[BSmaster]

So I have posted this clarification before but here is a reminder.

 

If it jumps more than 3 times it is a steelhead...

If it jumps less than 3 times it is a rainbow...

If it jumps 3 times it is a hybrid....

 

Really...  That simple.

 

Where it gets complicated is with the skamania doing the aerobatics.  I do not know how to describe this one.  Just just have to know that the fish is doing something different.

[fshnwmn]

wow tim u opened a can of worms with just that one LOL

see ya soon

fshnwmn

[jekyll]

wow tim u opened a can of worms with just that one LOL

see ya soon

fshnwmn

Yeah, I expected the earth worm to generate the discussion.......

[Fish Hunter]

So I have posted this clarification before but here is a reminder.

 

If it jumps more than 3 times it is a steelhead...

If it jumps less than 3 times it is a rainbow...

If it jumps 3 times it is a hybrid....

 

Really...  That simple.

 

Where it gets complicated is with the skamania doing the aerobatics.  I do not know how to describe this one.  Just just have to know that the fish is doing something different.

................and if jumps into the net.........it's caught.

[Ceed]

Selective breeding in hatcheries and through crossing different varieties (there are many varieties) (as well as up to 8 recognized subspecies; some only recognize 3) of rainbows, i.e. Coastal rainbows, McCloud River Redband, Beardslee, Kamchatkan, etc, various resulting populations have been reared and stocked in NY waters over the years (and continuously crossed and back-crossed, and artificially selected for differing traits including color, growth, feeding, and reproduction). As a result, different Lake Ontario rainbow (steelhead -a name adopted from the term historically used to describe anadromous rainbow subspecies/varieties) varieties have been developed including spring-spawning varieties, as well as fall-spawning varieties. "Rainbow" refers to permanent stream resident populations.

 

Also, triploidy production in rainbows can be employed (though I haven't heard of any mass production in NY state), where sterile individuals are created by subjecting fertilized eggs to either very high pressure or uv light. These individuals rapidly grow to larger sizes as no energy is spent on sexual maturity and reproduction.

 

Another point: appearance of individuals changes with conditions (surroundings, sunlight, water visibility; spawning -fish become darker, spots become more prominent and pink stripe more intense, males' jaws lengthen and lower jaw develops a kype).

[BSmaster]

Stopped by Hamburg, PA yesterday and saw some Palominos.  Genetics is some pretty amazing stuff. 

[motoman]

A little steelbow school going on in here. Wow 8 stains didn't know of more than three, still learning

[ray koziatek]

Dude I change my undies after 3 stains...

[muskybob]

Dude I change my undies after 3 stains.

Inside out, then front to back?

[panfisher]

Ceed.... thanks for those "reel" clarifiations on ........I love it......."rainheads".