Spawning Salmon?

[Adk1]

Ok, so I really do not know what happens to the salmon once they spawn other than dying. Are the rivers loaded up with flowting dead salmon? Stupid question but  I really dont know

[NickR]

Yup! Or the guys from PA take them LOL. Natural process they sink to the bottom and decompose or get eaten by scavengers

Students going to school for biology or fish studies collect all of the dead salmon and count or stack them up/dispose of them, or let the coons eat them up.

Steelhead fishing in nov I end up stepping through one or two and get a good smell from it. (from the ones that sink to the creek beds)

[bandrus1]

yep river is littered with dead salmon.... they are pretty slippery to step on

[Jolly II]

The most important part of the dead salmon in the rivers is they are a source of food for the young salmon fry after they consume their yoke sacks. This "baby fish food" gets them to a size big enough to consume other sources of food, such as insects. It really is a perfect plan.

[john1947]

a solution to this is do away with kings and dedicate the fishery to atlantics which don't die and are native

[Adk1]

Jolly II I agree! john1947 that is a bold statement and should be an interesting read in the coming posts.

Edited September 3, 2013 by Adk1

[GAMBLER]

a solution to this is do away with kings and dedicate the fishery to atlantics which don't die and are native

This would make on hell of a sport fishery since Atlantic populations are piss poor for the amount stock ( mostly by Canada). Look at the numbers stocked in Canada compared to the numbers that return. Hundreds of thousands stocked with a hundred or so returns every year. Remember Atlantics spawn more than once in a lifetime so that makes that hundred or so even worse. The dead kings are not an issue. If you ever want the truth about Atlantics, log on to spoonpullers and look up a guy by the screen name Kwikfish. He will give you some good facts on Atlantics

[Tim Bromund]

a solution to this is do away with kings and dedicate the fishery to atlantics which don't die and are native

 

The Atlantics that were "native" to Lake Ontario were wiped out 140 years ago, so any new introductions that have been taking place with very limited success will be just as  foreign as the pacific salmon are.  Besides, the many factors that ultimate led to the demise of the "native" Atlantic Salmon are still in place today, so why would you expect these replacements to do any better?

 

As long as there are alewives in Lake Ontario, Chinook salmon will be stocked, and that's exactly as it should be.  Atlantics will never, EVER, be anything more than a rare novelty fish.

[CHAZZBAH]

The Atlantics that were "native" to Lake Ontario were wiped out 140 years ago, so any new introductions that have been taking place with very limited success will be just as  foreign as the pacific salmon are.  Besides, the many factors that ultimate led to the demise of the "native" Atlantic Salmon are still in place today, so why would you expect these replacements to do any better?

 

As long as there are alewives in Lake Ontario, Chinook salmon will be stocked, and that's exactly as it should be.  Atlantics will never, EVER, be anything more than a rare novelty fish.

I netted a 16 lbs Atlantic in July this yr, what a great fish !!!!

[Sk8man]

I guess after having a lot of fun with the Atlantics over the years in the Finger Lakes it would seem that there is a place for them in the Lake O fishery as well. They are a pretty incredible fighting fish once they reach a decent size and their arial displays are like none other in the fresh water fishery.  It doesn't have to be an "either or" situation....the habitat will support both. They were largely over fished commercially in the late1800's/early 1900's which was the primary reason for their demise not really factors relating to "not belonging" here and like the Paciific salmon they are actually saltwater fish for most of their "natural" lives so neither is truly "native" to these waters. The concerns about reproduction issues are valid concerns - especially for the fisheries folks but as sport fishermen we are very lucky indeed to have the variety of fish that we currently enjoy on Lake O.I for one celebrate the diversity of the fishery rather than feel that because I intensely enjoy fishing for the kings other species should be left on their own as they add an element of"surprise" to the total ball game. 

Edited September 3, 2013 by Sk8man

[Tim Bromund]

Just for the record, I don't have a problem with Atlantics, the 2 (yes 2) we've gotten on my boat over the years were fun and I am happy they are a component of the overall fishery, but discontinue king stocking for them?? NEVER!!!

[Sk8man]

I couldn't agree more Tim.

[ifishy]

alright just for fun has there ever been any research or thought on stocking kokanee.  I know there little but they are very tasty and could provide just one more fishing option and with there ability to spawn in short streams or even just near shore once established they would be very cheap to maintain and provide yet one more alternate food sorce for bigger salmon and trout.  also they will eat plankton so there is a possability they could help to curb the fleas. just a thought from some one who would love to be in the dec running the study

[Patriot]

I predict a near discontinuance of Chinook stocking, due to the amount of reproduction that’s happening. I don’t know if the DEC still does fin clipping but I didn’t catch a fin clipped fish this year.

I only wish that the Oswego river was better for spawning fish.

[Capt Vince Pierleoni]

No need to blow up a long running thread on a Chinook vs Atlantic debate. The FACT is, the only shot to restoring self sustaining numbers of Lake trout, Walleye,and Atlantic Salmon in Lake Ontario is to control the Alewives with Pacific Salmon. Alewives consume the hatch of Lakers and and Walleye, and are not a good diet for viable Atlantics. We are not currently doing a good enough job, the Alewife population is mind boggling and the current number of Kings are not doing it. I feel the naturals are carrying the fishery, as the quality of the hatchery fish has suffered in recent years. The DEC says they are trying to remedy the problem, and I'm sure they are smart enough to know the mighty Chinook drives the fishery and justifies toying with the other programs.

Once man screwed with all the tribs by deforesting and building dams,all bets were off. We are very lucky to have the fishery we have for open water Chinook--the greatest fish that swims.

[Sk8man]

Amen!

[Tim Bromund]

Yeah, what Vince said.

[Gill-T]

The two species Kings and Atlantics will be forever joined at the hip (or caudal fin).  Without the Kings to keep the alewives in check.....atlantics will never make it.  One of the theories about the increased numbers and size of Atlantics being caught is there may be an increase in fitness with the stocked atlantics due to goby ingestion (of all things).  Where as the invasive alewife is high in the reproduction killing enzyme Thiaminase, research at Cornell has concluded that the equally invasive goby is rich in Thiamine.  Seems to me the best of the Lake O story is yet to come.  We may have a day when we have fishable runs of both species to target.

[ifishy]

on a similar thread i think the goby infestation could lead to some record lake trout catchs in 10-20 years you may see 40 pounders and they will get bigger as time goes on there are many mid to high teen fish and pleanty of 20s as well with the large easy to catch food supply there growing season will increase as they feed all fall winter and spring in the shallows.  i would still rather have a chance to fish for kings but its cool to think that in my lifetime i may see a 50 or 60lb lake trout come out of the lake. 

[Tim Bromund]

The Browns are feeding heavily on gobies as well, which is probably why we've been seeing so many just slob football brownies lately.

[GAMBLER]

Another reason the lake trout are getting bigger because the pressure has been off the fishery the past couple seasons. The king fishing was good enough the past couple years and the charters did not have to lean on the lake trout population to help support their trips. Same thing goes for the browns.

[Yankee Troller]

Another reason the lake trout are getting bigger because the pressure has been off the fishery the past couple seasons. The king fishing was good enough the past couple years and the charters did not have to lean on the lake trout population to help support their trips. Same thing goes for the browns.

 

I disagree Bri....The East end of the Lake tore them up this spring due to a lack of Kings and clear water, which made the BT fishing tough. It's all they had! Not to mention you still have guys in the middle of the Lake who would rather set-up on those things rather than using them as a last resort. They still take a HUGE beating! Then there is this guy named Brian Gamble. This kid goes out and power fishes them FOR FUN!!!!           

[Lund SSS]

I disagree Bri....The East end of the Lake tore them up this spring due to a lack of Kings and clear water, which made the BT fishing tough. It's all they had! Not to mention you still have guys in the middle of the Lake who would rather set-up on those things rather than using them as a last resort. They still take a HUGE beating! Then there is this guy named Brian Gamble. This kid goes out and power fishes them FOR FUN!!!!           

Rich I don't think catching 54 in 4 hours counts as "power fishing" it's plain old WORK !!!!!   :lol: .... Sorry Brian it was just to tempting 

[Gill-T]

Yep, Lake Trout are effected by the alewife Thiaminase problem as well so gobies may be the key to their future reproductive success.  There may be a day when there are too many Lakers and Brian can enter them in the LOC derby?   

[Sk8man]

I think some of the reasons for the growth of the Lakers is related to the fact that they can live 6 to 7 times longer than browns or Pacific salmon (30 yrs or so) and the "slot limit" protects them to a degree, they can feed in the shallows and compete with other large fish without the fear of being eaten as well as the fact that they have a very diversified diet and are not truly dependent on alewives. I have found sunfish, perch, small bass and various crustaceans in their stomach contents over the years suggesting to me that they are very "adaptive".

Edited September 10, 2013 by Sk8man