kicker advice - short or long shaft, charger without electric

[youngknight]

I have a 2000 19 ft 1900 Prosport Lund boat with a 2002 yammy 4 stroke in 115 hp. Love the yammy but I think it is finally time to get a kicker motor...safety and security when heading out far from shore on Lake O. and also to really slow things down for trolling for walleye.

 

So buying new is not in the budget.  There are a many 4 stroke out there of various makes and models.  Looking at either an 8 or 9.9 4 stroke.  However, very few are long shaft, very few are electric and fewer still are electric and long shaft.

 

I want to be able to keep batteries charged while trolling..don't want a surprise after downrigging all day and go to start the 115 to find the battery doesn't have enough juice.  So electric start would be great, or at least one with a charger without electric start.  Not sure if a motor that is not already set up with an alternator can have an aftermarket add on??

 

I am really unsure of how to mount.  If a long shaft then I guess I can mount it right on my transom??  Or can I use one of the flip up motor brackets to use a short shaft??  I do not want the motor dragging in the water when I'm boating with the big motor..also use the boat for pleasure boating with the kids.  Any advice on this?

 

Note that my intent is to invest into a throttle control, like a protroll I think its called.  I would like to just hook the steering up with an inexpensive EZ steer rod from front end of both motors and use main wheel to steer. A manual short shaft would be most attainable as there are many out there.

 

Thanks for any assistance you can share.  Note that my transom isn't particularly high...of course the 115 is a very long shaft but I figure it would steer the boat as a rudder as much as the kicker running would.

 

Thanks guys.

[tbulhead]

Some things to consider:  Do you plan on keeping the boat for the next 10 years?  If your answer is yes you may want to save up and buy something new next year.  You can always use a trolling sock to decrease your speed.  Do you winterize your outboard and change the 4-stroke oil yourself or do you have it done by someone who services Yamaha?  If you have it done by someone else then you may want a Yamaha so it can all get done at once.  I believe the rule still applies of having the cavitation plate lined up with the bottom of the boat.  

[rolmops]

There are plenty 4 stroke long shaft electric start outboards  that charge your battery. They are called Tohatsu. It is the company that makes the Mercury and Nissan outboards.

You can buy them factory direct with free shipping. Another less desirable solution is a 2 stroke longshaft with starter and power supply. (for example a 9.9 1979  longshaft electric start Johnson for $425),but you would have an extra fuel tank on board.

As for placing it on your transom, you will have to measure the space you have on your transom next to the main engine to see if it fits and still be able to have the engines turn for steering. This would be the best way to go because an adjustable kicker bracket will place the outboard a foot and a half  behind the stern. When using the bracket you would have to buy the expensive EZ steer instead of the cheap Sterns connector bar ( one is $25,the other $425).

You can either use a pro troll or a regular remote with box next to the steering wheel.

As for batteries,you should consider having 2 batteries so one is for trolling and the other for starting.

Edited February 23, 2014 by rolmops

[lineman49]

   X2, agree with Rolmops,    Also look on this site in the classified section there  were/are a few good kickers for sale here.  Long shaft/short shaft is normally a matter of 3"-4" unless you are talking extra long shaft (sailboats).

[MCF]

You need to know what your transom height is.  If it is 20 inch or long shaft for your main motor and there is room to mount the kicker on that same transom, you may be able to get away with a 15 inch kicker motor.  I have a 19 Sea Nymph now and a 17 Starcraft before that, both with the 20 inch transom and mounted a standard shaft kicker on both.  Send me a PM if you want to get into specifics.      

[doublett]

I use a 9.9 Yamaha electric on my 19 spectrum and it works great right off the transom.My boat has a slot for a kicker though . I used a up down mount previously with my 9.9 merc but that one was a short shaft. I use controls up front just like the big motor and it is very good and very economical. we trolled at the oak last spring two good days and only used 4 gallons.

                                                                                                               doublett

[youngknight]

Thanks for the replies guys.  First, I don't see myself saving for an entire new system...would be nice but too many other pressures.  Second, my post I guess wasn't clear...I appreciate that if it has an electric start, will charge batteries...however, it is motors that do not have electric start, some have alternators and a small wire coming out of them to then hook onto a battery to keep it charged...I just wonder if this is something that can be added as opposed to a factory installed idea.

 

Tohatsu...looked up prices, certainly better prices than yamaha for instance but still up there and from what other posts have said, a poor quality motor and certainly one that does not hold value at all.  Still something to keep in mind.  I was looking for a good used motor in the $1500 general range.  I will have to do some arranging but a spare gas hook up may be the best idea anyhow.  I'm a coast guard auxillary member through our local fire department and it was said that most vessels in distress are because of engine problems and most engine problems are fuel issues...so two engines with same fuel issue can have both the main motor and the backup out of service.

 

I winterize my motor and change oil/filter every year myself.  Changed the impeller last year myself as well as fluids.  But other postings on other sites seem to put yammy well up there and although not a necessity for aesthetics at all, having 2 yammys side by side would be ideal I think.

 

I measured my transom where the kicker would sit and it is 20 inches.  So, although a short shaft would still sit in the water...and since it won't be up on plane would push the boat but not ideal.  There does seem to be enough room between the main engine and where the kicker would sit right on the transom so I guess my best choice would be a long shaft.  So since finding a long shaft with electric is unlikely at a decent price... my choices are I guess going without electric and buying another battery which then has to be charged...or go through the wiring and perhaps battery switch which I don't have a lot of room for and then pushes price up as well.  Or, is there a mount lift (straight up and down) that is advised?  Another site I found had many people saying definitely no to the gaerlick type of mounts.  I appreciate the comment that the connecting rod will not be a straight forward economical one if I use an engine bracket that sticks out behind the transom.

 

Perhaps best bet is to buy a lottery ticket.

[Nemesis]

Look at controllking.com and see what engines are compatible. That's where I would start. I can't imagine trolling without one. Makes life so easy.

I am a CTK Rep and can sell any LOU member one for $214. Shipped from the factory to your door in the USA.

Just PM me with what you end up buying and I will give you all the info. This goes for any LOU members as well.

Brad.

Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United mobile app

[jimski2]

You need the assistance of your main engine for rudder control as the offset trolling motor is very weak turning to the side it is mounted on.

[youngknight]

Hi Jim,

Yep, my intent for steering was to link the main motor so both motors turn the boat.

 

I have pretty much decided that I need to go a long shaft and mount directly on the transom...I just need to determine if I truly have enough room..I think I do.  Looking on the internet I see boats no bigger than mine with two motors mounted on the transom...but don't want to buy and then find out they are too tight.

 

As for the controllking...I will give that some thought..it was actually the trollmaster Pro2 I had been looking at...need to compare the two once I decide on my motor purchase.  The Pro2 seems to have continuous throttle adjustments as opposed to just selected settings. 

 

Here is a question to anybody that may know...on most Yamaha later models (2004+) 4 stroke 8 or 9.9 hp 4 strokes with electric start, do they also have a pull cord for manual starting?  On a smaller fishing boat of mine I have a 2009 20 hp electric with power tilt...but no manual pull cord so if battery dies, it is off with the cowling and trying that little emergency cord. 

[Chas0218]

Where did you read tohatsu motors are un-reliable?  I have never seen one with an issue if correctly maintained.  Nissan makes 3/4 of the motors on the market that are under 15hp. Just like anything there is always one or two out of a thousand that have issues but the Nissans I have seen run like a top for years without requiring anything more than general maintenance.

[L&M]

Might of been a slip with the wording Chas. But Tohatsu makes all of Nissan motors as well as smaller engines for others including Merc. & a good reliable engine they are.

[Chas0218]

I was just kind of shocked that someone would feel that way about the tohatsu/nissan motors. Everyone has there favorites but they are a great motors.  I don't personally own one but unless I can find another model cheaper with the ability to charge my batteries I will buy it.

[mr 580]

I don't know if the small Yamaha electric start motors also have a pull cord. I do run an 8 hp Yamaha manual start on my Lund and a 9.9 on my ProLine. Both of those little four strokes do have alternators even on the manual start model so they charge my battery while I'm trolling. My 9.9 has tons of hours and has been great. Just keep the oil changed and it keeps ticking. My Lund's transom was setup for a kicker from the factory so I think you could add one pretty easy as well.

[youngknight]

Chas, thanks for calling me out on tahatsu. I have now did a review of comments on them and the fast majority of owners rave about them. Old stories about some of the midvrange nissans in the 1990s that i heard about coupked with my admitted bias against what i erroneously viewed as no name led to my unfair comment. However on some boaters forums about kickers that yamahas got the thumbs up way more than anything else including from owners of mercs and hondas.price is very good for tahatsu.e