Conesus 5/10/2014 Walleye

[fbg14619]

Very nice. Anybody would be mighty happy to get those.  thanks for the post and pictures. 

It gives us hope. Conesus is a hard hard lake to pull  walleye out of.

 

[Phisherman585]

Bsmaster.......walleyes life cycle wouldn't allow that. When the egg hatches it's becomes a icthyoplankton (super small baby fish that's at the mercy of water currents). There's no way you could separate them from the alewife. The only way to keep walleye generations going in an alewife filled lake is stocking unfortunately.

Justin I think a finger lakes walleye association is a great idea. Look at the pull the Muskie guys have.

Edited May 14, 2014 by Phisherman585

[mostlymuskies]

Yes,every spring I see all those big walleye up the creek,but when it becomes time to catch them durring open season I struggle to get just one and most trips none at all.The tiger muskies are also tough to catch there! But again the amount of bait fish one has to compete with makes it hard to hookup on most fish there. I believe a better managed tiger muskie program at Conesus Lake would help lower the bait fish population and increase catch rates of walleye. Also this year the water temps are much colder then mormal,so the walleye are now at post spawn and tight lipped,don't let those warmer surface temps fool you,it is still cold down deep.

[salmonite]

i am confused, conesus seems like a perfect walleye lake. Deep but not to deep, lots of bait, obviously reproducing in the lake on their own. What i am confused about it rarely gets stocked but honeoye on the other hand gets loaded with eyes almost every year.  Also has super low oxygen levels in 30 fow at its deepest and really no structure???  

 

so somebody way smarter than i please help me out

Edited May 14, 2014 by salmonite

[justtracytrolling]

Absolutely correct captain Larry. Ive never fished Conesus personally, but I know a few guys that fish Conesus with the same strategy I use at Otisco and they catch eyes everytime out all summer just like I do. They are catchable and there are guys who hammer em. We need a paradigm shift in the mentality of the walleye fisherman...the secretive, exclusive approach simply can only hurt the fishery. I dont know why trout and salmon guys get it and walleye guys dont! Just so im not mistaken, i am referring to stocked, managed walleye lakes...not ontario or erie or the alleghany watershed. I have taken a lot of bs from guys who criticize me for keeping too many fish and for telling the whole world about Otisco...my goal has never changed..I want to make the lake so popular that the state wouldnt consider taking our stockings away. The downside is more boats out there and more people, but the state isnt going to stock fish just for me anyway, and a good fisherman will still catch plenty even with more pressure.

[justtracytrolling]

i am confused, conesus seems like a perfect walleye lake. Deep but not to deep, lots of bait, obviously reproducing in the lake on their own. What i am confused about it rarely gets stocked but honeoye on the other hand gets loaded with eyes almost every year.  Also has super low oxygen levels in 30 fow at its deepest and really no structure???  

 

so somebody way smarter than i please help me out

Phisherman585 can get info on this for us I bet! When I have a question on Otisco I call Ian Blackburn from region 7 and he always makes time for me, and gets me some info at the least. The DEC is approachable and will help.

[idn713]

Hey justinttracytrolling I totally agree. I can't tell you guys how many times I've tried to get information about walleye fishing in the Rochester area. I always politely ask and and I am a reasonably knowledgeable fishermen so it's not like people are giving tips to a complete newbie. It has always seemed like getting information out of the walleye guys around Rochester is like trying to squeeze water out of a rock. Walleye fishermen make steelhead fishermen seem loose lipped by comparison.

I would certainly be interested in any tips or tricks regarding casting for walleye around the Rochester area. I would be especially interested in information around edible walleye as I'm not interested in catching any from the Genesee River as those are not edible. I live in Brockport so even information regarding the oatka, black creek, conesus, or the canal would be more than welcome.

Personal message me if you'd like to share any tips or tricks!

[Phisherman585]

i am confused, conesus seems like a perfect walleye lake. Deep but not to deep, lots of bait, obviously reproducing in the lake on their own. What i am confused about it rarely gets stocked but honeoye on the other hand gets loaded with eyes almost every year. Also has super low oxygen levels in 30 fow at its deepest and really no structure???

so somebody way smarter than i please help me out

There is no walleye reproduction in Conesus lake. I don't know honeoyes stocking schedule but I can see Albany being more willing to give that lake fish because there are more year round walleye fisherman on that lake. It gets used more so they get more fish also there are no alewife in that lake so there is some natural reproduction in honeoye. Albany would rather stock a fishery that can hopefully at some point become a self sustaining fishery. Something that will never happen in Conesus.

[salmonite]

Can you tell me why conesus has no natural reproduction because of the alewife population?

[RWhite]

Yes what proof is there. I don't think the alewives would be picky and just eat the walleye and not bass or pike. I also believe that all the walleye spawning doesn't take place in the outlet. Example-- I fish silver A Lot and I know for a fact there are a good number of eyes in that lake. And the majority of the walleye in that lake spawn on the east side rocky shoreline.

White_instincs @instagram

[BSmaster]

There is no walleye reproduction in Conesus lake. I don't know honeoyes stocking schedule but I can see Albany being more willing to give that lake fish because there are more year round walleye fisherman on that lake. It gets used more so they get more fish also there are no alewife in that lake so there is some natural reproduction in honeoye. Albany would rather stock a fishery that can hopefully at some point become a self sustaining fishery. Something that will never happen in Conesus.

 

This has been mentioned before.  Has Albany considered introducing a new species to minimize the alewive population?  A species that is designed to eat them such as striped hybrids.  I asked years ago why this fish was no longer stocked in NY and I received a very nice explanation which I can accept.  However, when I do a cost benefit analysis on a lake like Conesus, I have difficulty letting it go.  1st, the 3 reasons.  1.) Cost  2.) Low angler success & 3.) fishes tendency to migrate.  So cost is what it is.  The fish will have to be bought from out of state hatchery just like PA does.  Low angler success may be attributed to the fact that fisherman have little experience fishing for them and will take some time for the learning curve to spread out amongst anglers.  I think since then with the alabama rig and presentations like it the result will be different.  The fishes tendency to migrate is seen in man made resevoirs that have bottom discharge.  I have no reason to believe that these fish will not remain in a natural lake.  How will it affect the ecosystem?  Probably where the biggest debate will be after whether or not the state would even pay for it.  I believe in balance.  In the summer the water boils with alewives.  So it should be able to sustain more predators.  Why not make it a sterile predator that can be controlled solely by stocking numbers?  Put more tigers in too but I do not think that will improve the lake.  MHO - Maybe Just rambling.  This could be a good lake to study the effect of Hybrids.  I meant to bring it up this year at state of the lakes but I couldn't make it.  I am glad that we are discussing it here. 

 

I also am not into trolling but a chapter for walleye sounds like a good idea Justin.  Some of us like to jig, long line and back troll for fish and all of these tactics work...  If the Lindners say so it must be true.  The idea of getting a unified voice may give more clout to our ideas as it does for the trout fisherman.

 

Can you tell me why conesus has no natural reproduction because of the alewife population?

Almost 100% of the walleye fry are susceptible to alewive predation.  Adult Walleye eat Alewives and then Alewives return the favor for walleye offspring.

 

Joe

[Phisherman585]

Yes what proof is there. I don't think the alewives would be picky and just eat the walleye and not bass or pike. I also believe that all the walleye spawning doesn't take place in the outlet. Example-- I fish silver A Lot and I know for a fact there are a good number of eyes in that lake. And the majority of the walleye in that lake spawn on the east side rocky shoreline.

White_instincs @instagram

There's a bunch of study's that prove it. It doesn't matter where they spawn....lake or creek it doesn't matter. When a walleye egg hatches it's so small it's a plankton meaning it's at the mercy of the water current. During this time they get eaten by the millions of alewife in the lake. They are such efficient planktivors they effectively eliminate all walleye plankton. Bass, pike, sunfish.....when those species hatch they stay in the shallows and do not drift out to the alewives habitat like the walleyes do making them unavailable for alewife predation.

It will not take you long to search thru American fisheries society and find study's that have been published and peer reviewed proving alewife effectively eliminate walleye reproduction.

I'm not saying there isn't a bunch of eyes in Conesus but what I am saying is numbers are down. Also what I'm saying is we get half the amount of fish as we used to. Also another thing. During the shocking very few small fish showed up. That's not a good sign. You need year classes coming up to take the place of all the fish being taken out. That's common sense.

As for introducing another fish.....that's walking a thin line. Do we really want to take that risk? Conesus is a great pike and bass fishery. I'm not sure I'm willing to potently sacrifice those fisheries by introducing another species even if they can't reproduce. Alewifes in Conesus are here to stay barring some huge environmental change.

Edited May 15, 2014 by Phisherman585

[RWhite]

I'm not being a dick and just trying to argue. However there are studies saying a lot of things out there. But when it comes to bait fish I think of bottom of the food chain. And bottom of food chain means shallow water life for safety or large schools. So I hardly believe a study that states bass and pike are safe from alewives because they don't live in shallow water which provides cover from predators. And if the walleye are at the mercy of the wind the winds would push them to the shoreline. Pretty quick.Not like conesus is very wide. Maybe it's the pike and tigers, maybe it's over fishing. I don't no. I only started fishing there the last 3 years. And i have had no problem with catching fish. I have also seen the biggest walleyes I have ever seen follow lures back to boat.(reason why I fish at conesus now) With a lake like conesus that has deep drop off for big fish to move up into the shallows to feed very easily, and safely I believe there are very big fish there. Plus all the bait that there is, life could be sustained very easy.

White_instincs @instagram

[Phisherman585]

I'm not being a dick and just trying to argue. However there are studies saying a lot of things out there. But when it comes to bait fish I think of bottom of the food chain. And bottom of food chain means shallow water life for safety or large schools. So I hardly believe a study that states bass and pike are safe from alewives because they don't live in shallow water which provides cover from predators. And if the walleye are at the mercy of the wind the winds would push them to the shoreline. Pretty quick.Not like conesus is very wide. Maybe it's the pike and tigers, maybe it's over fishing. I don't no. I only started fishing there the last 3 years. And i have had no problem with catching fish. I have also seen the biggest walleyes I have ever seen follow lures back to boat.(reason why I fish at conesus now) With a lake like conesus that has deep drop off for big fish to move up into the shallows to feed very easily, and safely I believe there are very big fish there. Plus all the bait that there is, life could be sustained very easy.

White_instincs @instagram

So why is it bass and pike need zero stocking? They have great reproduction in that lake. You stop stocking walleye and they will be gone in a few years, how many I don't know. Pike and tigers are not effecting the walleye population.

[Phisherman585]

I'm not trying to be a dick either but show me one lake that has alewife as the primary bait fish where walleyes are naturally reproducing. Then try and find one lake with Alewifes as the primary bait fish that doesn't have a natural bass, pike, sunfish or pickerel population.

Also alewife might be low on the food chain. Definitely not bottom of the food chain but still they are open water planktivors. There habitat and the habitat of baby pike, bass, sunfish do not cross.

Edited May 15, 2014 by Phisherman585

[BSmaster]

I also noticed the Rudd population is increasing.  I doubt there are too many studies out there addressing this invasive species.  Probably a lot of speculation.  I bet the muskies love them.

 

Phisherman, I respect you and your thoughts and I really do not know fine points.  This conversation makes me want to learn more.  Besides reading articles, I would like also to talk to other states who have embraced different stocking strategies to see what are the outcomes whether they be  positive or not.

 

Also, Can you use the Conesus inlet swamp as a walleye rearing pond?

[justtracytrolling]

Im only discussing the natural walleye reproduction issue last time...THERE IS NO REPRODUCTION! The walleye from the hatchery have a genetic marker in their ear bones in laymens terms. The dec samples the lake and then looks for the marker. They havent found fish without it! We can argue, but why? We all agree we wouldnt mind more fish, so lets FOCUS on that 1 isssue. These lakes are definitely put and take, and its not overfished its underfished. We have to show the dec that the lake is fished successfully by the masses if you want fish every year.

joe,

There is no wrong way to fish....just the way you like it is the right way!

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[justtracytrolling]

Everyone can do their own research, but when you do you will be where phisherman585 and i are. Im for uniting not fighting amongst each other. I only want to be involved in constructive dialog. Remember we are on the same team! A finger lakes walleye assoc. is the way to make our voice matter.

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[Phisherman585]

Couldn't agree more! Btw to anyone who is interested the dec is going to be doing a state of the lake meeting for the western finger lakes this Monday in Lima. Meeting starts at 7 but at 6 there's going to be a meeting on contributing to angler diaries. Here is the link.

http://www.dec.ny.gov/press/95586.html

Edited May 15, 2014 by Phisherman585

[Trucksrule58]

Couldn't agree more! Btw to anyone who is interested the dec is going to be doing a state of the lake meeting for the western finger lakes this Monday in Lima. Meeting starts at 7 but at 6 there's going to be a meeting on contributing to angler diaries. Here is the link.

http://www.dec.ny.gov/press/95586.html

Is there any other way to get involved with the angler diaries other than going to this meeting? I would like to attend but it's a pretty far drive for me.

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[Phisherman585]

Is there any other way to get involved with the angler diaries other than going to this meeting? I would like to attend but it's a pretty far drive for me.

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I'm sure there is. I'll pass along any info I can.

[hermit]

I also noticed the Rudd population is increasing.  I doubt there are too many studies out there addressing this invasive species.  Probably a lot of speculation.  I bet the muskies love them.

 

I know Rudd have been in NY since 1936 but I don't know how long they've been in the Finger Lakes.  They've been here as long as I remember which is only 12 years of fishing or so, I'm sure they've been around a lot longer than that.  I read up on them at one point but forgot most of it, I think they can hybridize with Golden Shiners.  They can't be good but there's much worse invasives on the way.

Edited May 15, 2014 by hermit

[justtracytrolling]

The angler diary program is available with a call to your regional office...they mail you a packet. Then after you turn in your books you will recieve a summary of the data collected in your region, and your packet for the following year. Its a little time consuming but necessary if your personal fishing is in stocked waters.

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[labsrus]

I like the idea of a fingerlakes walleye association. I cannot make the DEC meeting but would like to hear about meeting.

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[muskiedreams]

I am VP of Musly Inc. Chapter 69 in NY. Last month Brad Hammers from region 8 DEC office came to our meeting and gave us a presentation on the angler diary study. We had previously talked to him about it and he decided to start an angle diary study for Waneta lake because we showed an intrest in participating in one to help them gather useful information which will help them to gauge the past and present musky stocking efforts and help them determine future efforts. They have been doing fin clipping for many years and the information we can provide them in the diaries, including size and fin clips, will allow them to detemine how well various year classes are doing in the lake. With the size and knowing which fin is clipped, they can tell the year class of each fish and gauge growth rate etc. They can also use the information to determine angler success in fish per hours of effort. The more anglers they have paticipating, the better and more accurate results they will have. Even if you do not catch any fish, you fill out a page with info on how long you fished and the species you were targeting and that helps them to determine number of angler hours per fish. Also the more years that they have good numbers of angler participation, the better it will help to determine long term trends. So the more anglers particiipating and the longer they participate the more useful the data becomes. The more anglers that participate will help to show the utilization and this information could even be used to show the legislators in Albany the degree of utilization which in turn can mean more funding.

 

I also signed up for the Conesus Lake diary. I may only fish a few times there this year but I figured it can still be useful information to them.

 

Here is a phone # Brad Hammers gave us to call if you want to participate in the program. 585-226-5343.