Advice please

[moog5050]

My father and I did a fair amount of salmon and trout fishing from my early teens to early twenties out of Sodus.  Honestly, we probably weren't very technically sound, but caught our fair share of fish.  Mostly listened to chatter on the radio from the charter captains and copied set ups, depth, lures, etc.  Always ran 2 riggers stacked or top lined early and late season.

 

Fast forward 20 years and we decided to get back into it again.  Mid summer last year we got a boat set up and began fishing.  4 riggers, lowrance, fishhawk and figured we were good to go.  Began to learn about copper, leadcore, etc. but still hadn't introduced those weapons to our arsenal.  We did start using dipsys and were quite surprised at how many more fish we caught on dipsys vs. riggers.  In any event, I began to study the techniques used on this board and am trying to up our game so to speak.  I am now trying to put together the right pieces of the pie by paying closer attention to speed, temps, etc. 

 

To my request:  We have done OK since returning to the sport, catching some fish and a few large kings, but we don't seem to catch the volume I see reported here.  We fish out of I-Bay, typically 3-4 hour spurts morning or evening.  As an example, today we started out in 175 FOW.  I found 50 degrees at 100ft down.  We set up the four riggers all with spoons (NKs) - green and purple - ranging from 100 up to 80 feet.  We also ran two dipsys on no. 3 at 300 and 240ft with SDs and flies (one side wonderbread and the other green).  We only had 3 releases and boated a single medium sized steelhead.  I tried moving riggers up and down (generally between 120 and 75ft), circling back through bait, trolling from 175 fow out to 300 and back in and varying dipsy depth.  Speeds ranged from 2.0-2.9 on the fishhawk (mostly 2.4-2.7).

 

Any specific recommendations on what I could have tried to boat a few more fish? 

 

I plan to add lead core this week and am thinking about trying to target lakers when its slow with cowbells and peanuts, but haven't yet.  The 2 big kings (23 and 25lbs) we landed this year were both in cold water 43 and 45 degrees.

 

Honestly, I am more interested in getting more action for the sake of keeping my 12yr old son interested.  I enjoy it either way and am generally happy with better quality vs quantity, but I know I need to change things up a bit or he will lose interest.  We simply haven't had one of those 10 fish plus outings since we started last season.

 

Any advice is much appreciated.  Thanks

 

BTW - what happened to the captain chatter on the radio - we never hear a thing anymore.  Maybe its all text and phone.

[fathobbit0074]

It sounds like your doing the right thing. You prob just have to get on hot lures. It's def not wonder bread Right now my sucsess is on flashers and flies I'll run a spoon or. 2 But most f f right now for me Keep putting your time In. It'll come. Get on the water as early as you can. Most of my fish come before 8. I'll pm u

Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United

[moog5050]

Thx hobbit

[Jeremy Goodison]

If your highly qualified amature like me the one thing that separates the pros from the amature is not the lures and speed is the solid knowledge of where the fish are and when. 3-4 hrs seems like a short run to me. We catch a good amount of fish but we do solid 6-8 hrs shifts. Hour or two to get on them 4 hrs to catch them then hour or two to wonder where they went lol. That's the huge benefit from this site. Most of the veterans on here truly enjoy to help the amature's out with really good reports.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Lake Ontario United mobile app

[baitrigger]

I always run a f/f on a deep rigger. Spoons on the shallow. F/fly may be why your dipseys are hot. If FF is workin we put more out and cut back on spoons. Greens, chartruse, blue and black are great spoon colors. Wonderbread has never been good to me. Mix it up and play the hot colors and combos. We put copper and core out in different lengths and by the end of the day we are down to whats been hot. Im rambling. Hope this is useful.

[moog5050]

Thx guys

[Sk8man]

You might want to try running one or two lines (maybe 1 dipsey and one spoon down BELOW that 50 degree mark for the kings because as you mentioned they can be found in low 40's water while playng with stuff above that. You also mentioned your spoons were NK's  try using more of a spoon "assortment" (type and size wise)....NK's are good spoons but sometimes they want different size or action. Consider mixing up your presentation on the down riggers with a f/f on one  close to the ball and a spoon on another on a fairly short lead above it on another.....maybe paired that way if running 4 downriggers. Don't be afraid to run dipseys even 400-450 ( I use Deeper Divers) or so out and then gradually bringing upward (lakers or kings)

[Richard]

I find that the reports of boats with larger fish catches usually consist of a lot of smaller fish. I drive six to nine hours to get to the lake so I concentrate mostly on the larger fish. If I am catching fish below twelve pounds I tend to move away to find the larger fish. Sometimes they are just a little deeper. For a little more action in your spread you could add some free sliders for those smaller higher up fish. Just remember that a lot of these fish are lost due to the extended time of slack line as you reel the lower spoon up to the slider before the fish is tight to the rod.

 

Good luck and tight lines.

[moog5050]

Thanks for the thoughts guys

[Grand Slam11]

Try bumping your speed up. I think fish hawks run a little faster than most down speeds. I like to run between 2.9 and 3.1. Also don't be afraid to run lures in cooler depths. I like to start in 46 and run my spread up. Copper will prolly be a better choice than lead core. 350-450 feet. Hope this helps.

[ray koziatek]

It baffles my mind to see the type of advice given to someone asking questions,,,,guess i lernt nuttin in over 20 yrs on L.O. .....Their are so many things to take in account. tepms,currents,sun /clouds,direction of troll,species,water color,time of day (sun angle) ..and for the guy who moves off 12lb fish so they can only catch big ones I will hire you for the next 5 years during the pro ams at 1,000.00 a day .....

So what I am saying you really need to work 1/on 1, with a good captian or charter even then what worked out of his boat might be dead on your rig.... Hmm maybe some of us old farts should start a new service..If I wasn,t so busy i would be there to help..ya.

[on the lam]

Ray is 100% right.....  you can fish kings with a few flasher fly combos and as half dozen spoons and be successful IMO.  Its about finding fish first and foremost....  they move!!!  all the time...   speed and trolling angle are the things I try to dial in first, without those two your success rate will suffer..... water color, sun/clouds or sun angle impact the lure selection. all these things come with trolling experience and thats many hours and years on the lake....  or a weekend with a successful, info sharing captain or friend. 

again, i would change trolling angle and speed or location long before changing lure presentation, considering you have a respectable combo down there.  good luck !!!

[moog5050]

I know it will take time to really put the pieces together.  It was the same when I started hunting, but now I know I am proficient based on the deer I am able to kill every year.  Like you said, it helps immensely to have someone to bounce ideas off.  I need to pay closer attention to details, but will get there.  Thanks for all of the thoughts.