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Posted

I had my 1986 evinrude 90 hp worked on by Hank (by far the best boat mechanic i've ever had - i drive 90+ miles from springwater because he is so good). Since he's right near Lake O, i thought i'd check out the motor and do a bit of solo fishing. Before i could get my second line in the water, this king nailed a glow frog spoon 100 down over 200 fow. I ended up with a few others, but none this big.

That day, as well as yesterday, i am having trouble with my fishing line getting tangled in my downrigger cables. Unlike most folks, i use shimano curados on casting rods for my downrigger rods - i love catching big kings on light gear! I use 20# braid for my main line, and Black's downrigger releases. I hope i can make clear what my problem is, so that one of you might troubleshoot it for me. Here's the problem in more detail (it doesn't happen all the time, i'm guessing about 1/3 of the time on Lake O, and much, much less on the fingerlakes):

When i wind up my rigger, my fishing line is still in the release, but the line between the release and my rod is wrapped 20-30 times around the rigger cable - wrapped so many times that if a fish hit, it couldn't release. I know this happened the other day because my 20# flouro leader was broken off and the braid was wrapped around the rigger cable. I can't imagine how this is happening. When i watch my ball a few feet below the surface, it seems to track well. Has anyone had this problem and/or know how to fix it? I wonder if the more powerful currents on Lake O are contributing to this, but i bet most of you don't have this problem.

 

many thanks,

 

andre

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Posted

What kind of downrigger weights are you using? Also are you keeping your rods loaded as you put the riggers down? Meaning are you keeping the rod bent as you deploy your rigger.

Posted

I agree with past post......keep constant (but not too much where the pop the release) pressure on them when letting downrigger weights down.  If you do that, it shouldnt happen.   Are you stopping or going in neutral often when using dodgers or spin docs?

 

Blacks releases are ok, but I prefer offshore brand releases (Offshore tackle).  They hold true and you can set them to be light or heavy release simply by how far you put the line in the release.  And the biggest benefit of the offshore releases is that you can easily tell when you have a small/tiny fish on which you cant with the blacks release because the line is twisted and "set in place".  The offshore release you will see the line slipping when you have a small skipper on (which means you are not dragging it around wasting time)

Posted

How is your black release attached to the cable? I put a crimp between the two holes on a black and crimp it about a foot above the ball. This keeps the release there on the cable but it is free spinning on the cable.with tension from your lure trolling the release should stay straight even if the ball does spin. I have never had any issues with line wrapping on cable.

Posted

Black makes 2 style of releases. Mine clip between swivel at the end of the cable and ball. I've never had an issue unless they have twisted before being lowered into the water. I always snap the rod to release the line before bringing the ball up.

Posted

How long are the booms on your riggers and your rods. Sometime when using ling books and short rods your line doesn't have enough space between your cable and line and with the currents in lake O it can make a big mess

Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United

Posted

Thanks to everybody for their replies. I do keep the rod loaded as the ball goes down - perhaps I have too much pressure when I do that. I also let the ball down very quickly - I have manual not electric downrigger's. I never stop or go neutral with my Riggers out. Attached is a photo of my set up and the problem tangle. My booms are 40 inches

my rods are shorter than most - they are 7 feet but I've used them for years and this problem just started happening

My releases swivel very freely around the cable and as I said earlier the downrigger balls appear to track nicely

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Posted

it can only happen as stated ,by stopping to fight another fish,or on the drop(ya have to be moving also)..your just dropping to fast . I have seen the blacks do a single spin when not properly deployed ,but several wraps is something yer doing wrong your line should Always have some blowback even if yer holding a tight line putting it out (best way) ain't ne current gonna wrap yer line that much,unless yer sitting under a water spout.

Posted

The eyes on your balls seem to be bent forward. In the picture of it hanging it appears to be not horizontal, but pointing upward more than usual. The ball could be spinning on it's tail when down deep with the water pressure being higher. I've never seen weights in that position, they are always close to level. Bend the eyes back toward the tail and see if they hang more level.

Posted (edited)

"When i wind up my rigger, my fishing line is still in the release",  Dre- do you normally pop your lines from the releases before bringing up your weights if a fish doesn't release it? If you are checking your lines or changing lures etc. by bringing up the downrigger with the lines still in the release instead of popping them first it could do that on the way up. I'm assuming that you had tried the release and it didn't release the line before bringing up the weight though....

Edited by Sk8man
Posted

finned balls can corcksrew on the way down if dropped too fast. We see this with other styles of balls too. With the set up you posted, if that were happening, it would spin the blacks release with it. Try adding a heavy snap swivel below the release and see what happens.

Posted

thanks very much for the advice. I will try to more the eyes forward on the ball (if i can't, i'll get a new ball), add a swivel between the ball and the release, and also lower the ball slower.

Again, thanks so much - you guys rock!

 

dre

Posted

I have used blacks releases as the one you have for years but I have never seen one attached like yours.

 

Normally the blacks release is above the ball around 1 foot and attached to the down rigger cable or what ever line your using on your rigger.

 

Your down rigger weight looks small for lake ontario and I expect with the down currents like this year it is spinning alot if your seeing 30+ twists around the cable.

 

If this is happening more and more then I would suggest that you use a heavier weight or something more in line with directional weight like Shark or something

otherwise you will be loosing alot of hardware and fish that have junk stuck in their mouths.

 

 

Posted

Your release is catching on the coil wrapping of the wire & when the ball spins, it spins also.

riggrrelease1_zpsa671f051.jpg

 

The Blacks should be above the cable/cannonball swivel.  To do this, cut the swivel off, cut the wire off the Black's. String your cable thru the holes in the release.  Place a crimp between the legs( to pin it in place).  Re-attach the swivel with appropriate crimps. 

 

0de2703b-8309-4684-98a4-808f4c360df8_zps

 

Tom B.

(LongLine)

Posted

Long Line's solution should cure the problem, but your weight will still spiral going down because the rudder is leading way. "The cart is in front of the horse." Downrigger weights need to be somewhat ballenced. The cable attachment eye is way to forward. Mind you this only another fisherman's opinion.

Posted

It sure looks like the ball is the problem Dre and Tom's diagram together with your pic of the ball pretty much cinches it - the ball is off balance because of the eye that the wire is attached to  being angled too far forward instead of being perpendicular or vertical.....and the suggestion of a (heavier) torpedo weight is a good one too.

Posted

Thanks again everyone. I still need a few things clarified for me.

First, where can i buy the crimps needed for the setup Tom recommends?

Second, what is the red, egg-shaped object between the ball and the swivel (in Tom's diagram)?

Third, i want to try to re-set the eyes in my rigger balls so they hang horizontally. I know lead is toxic, so should i NOT drill new holes in the balls in which to set new eyes? How would you recommend i re-set the eyes, because they broke when i tried to bend them forward and unscrew them.

thanks very much!

 

dre

Posted (edited)

There are a couple guys around who make torpedo weights, you may be able to swap your lead + a few extra bucks for a couple new10 or 12 lb  torpedo weights . Troutman 88 is one of them. There is a thread on here with his contact info. He lives in Watkins Glenn. There is one more local, some one here may be able to give you his info.

Edited by Steve.e
Posted

No need for a crimp. Make a loop and tie a simple overhand knot just like you would on a wire diver, The egg is the snap under the swivel. Drill and tap for a new eye or trade the weight in (scrap lead value)  to someone who casts torpedos for a discount on a new weight.

Posted

 I changed rigger balls and lowered them more slowly and fished Lake O for 5 hours without a tangle!!!

I went out of sandy creek saturday from 4-9p. Only managed one bite (45' down over 350 fow) on a glow frog - a 20# king.

 

i wanted to thank everyone again for the helpful advice!!!

 

dre

Posted

The eyes on your balls seem to be bent forward. In the picture of it hanging it appears to be not horizontal, but pointing upward more than usual. The ball could be spinning on it's tail when down deep with the water pressure being higher. I've never seen weights in that position, they are always close to level. Bend the eyes back toward the tail and see if they hang more level.

I agree 100% with the eye on your downrigger weight. I'd bet the unusually stong currents this year are spinning the the tail of that weight like a top.

Posted

 

Second, what is the red, egg-shaped object between the ball and the swivel (in Tom's diagram)?

I'm a lousy artist. :$   That's the clip that attaches the swivel to the ball.

 

Tom B.

(LongLine)

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