Problem with Cannon Dual Axis Rod Holders

[Captain Carl Bish]

There are 2 pressed in pins that hold the ratchet handle in. Due to quality control and design flaws these pins work there way partially out and when the next fish hits the dipsy on the holder and you grab the rod the thin aluminum that holds the pin rips and the holder becomes a $100 paperweight.

This happened with one already and would have happened to a second one today.....

[CaptSpike]

Great I just switched over to these from the Bert's. Guess I'll keep an eye out for this.

Not being to familiar with the holders (just put on the boat and have used them once) I'm thinking to keep the pin from coming out maybe a center punch on the edge of the hole will help keep it in place.

I'll check it out next time I pull the boat out.

 

Any chance you could post a picture up of exactly where the issue is?

Thanks,

Spike

[jigstick]

Ive never had the problem that you are mentioning.  I run the Dual Axis holders all over my boat.  And they have withstood dipsy hits by slob kings, steelies, and lakers.  Maybe you got a lemon or something.  If you want to get rid of your rod holders let me know.  Ill take them off your hands.

[bigblue]

There are 2 pressed in pins that hold the ratchet handle in. Due to quality control and design flaws these pins work there way partially out and when the next fish hits the dipsy on the holder and you grab the rod the thin aluminum that holds the pin rips and the holder becomes a $100 paperweight.

This happened with one already and would have happened to a second one today.....

It happens on the single axis also . Not much metal at that spot and the roll pins seem soft . I peened them to make a flair at the ends hope this works . Nice unit but made in China . Still have Berts on our other boat USA manufacture the hardware seems to be of better quality .

[Captain Carl Bish]

Ive never had the problem that you are mentioning.  I run the Dual Axis holders all over my boat.  And they have withstood dipsy hits by slob kings, steelies, and lakers.  Maybe you got a lemon or something.  If you want to get rid of your rod holders let me know.  Ill take them off your hands.

I tend to use things like this a little more than most....but I will sell 10 of them to you for a total of $800 .... If you care to put your money where your mouth is..... Call me and they are yours...716-560-2878

[Captain Carl Bish]

Great I just switched over to these from the Bert's. Guess I'll keep an eye out for this.

Not being to familiar with the holders (just put on the boat and have used them once) I'm thinking to keep the pin from coming out maybe a center punch on the edge of the hole will help keep it in place.

I'll check it out next time I pull the boat out.

 

Any chance you could post a picture up of exactly where the issue is?

Thanks,

Spike

Spike,

I'll work on a pic.....I think if you could pean over the ends of the pin you may prevent the problem.

[Captain Carl Bish]

It happens on the single axis also . Not much metal at that spot and the roll pins seem soft . I peened them to make a flair at the ends hope this works . Nice unit but made in China . Still have Berts on our other boat USA manufacture the hardware seems to be of better quality .

New to track stuff....liked the looks of the cannons.....should have known better.....if cisco made a ratchet holder it would be a done deal....I'll have to look closer at the Burt's!

[TileMan Dan]

I run Berts and Cannons on my boat. The cannons are double dual axis monted to downriggers and after 1 year of use they loosening up and some dont spin easily. Have to look them over more closely to see what probls are , but at 250.00 plus for each one I shouldnt be having to do this for their age and use.

Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United

[TileMan Dan]

I run Berts and Cannons on my boat. The cannons are double dual axis monted to downriggers and after 1 year of use they loosening up and some dont spin easily. Have to look them over more closely to see what probls are , but at 250.00 plus for each one I shouldnt be having to do this for their age and use.

Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United

[jigstick]

I tend to use things like this a little more than most....but I will sell 10 of them to you for a total of $800 .... If you care to put your money where your mouth is..... Call me and they are yours...716-560-2878

Oh you're right.  I guess because Im not a charter captain I must not use my gear hard.  I was serious about buying them from you, but if you are going to run your mouth and be a dick about it you can unload them on someone else.  Good luck captain

[ray koziatek]

ohh gettin fun,

One of the beauties of a site with over 10,000 fishermen is ya get honest feed back on a product when its "Junk" or if its "Good" ....

My brother has much experiance with over seas mfg. some times he will send back 30,000 bike rims that dont meet his standards.. even if every one on that order is spoken for...his motto is Quality first...after you refuse a $200,000.00 order one or twice you would be amazed at the quality on future orders even from China.

This usually happens on a new change first run where the overseas supplier miss calculates the engineers prints....But with that said the Mfg. who puts their name on a product would do well by standing behind their products ....Michigan Stinger Lure Paint might stir a ppost or two.

[Captain Carl Bish]

Yes Ray......it is interesting especially when multiple experiences provide evidence of an issue.

[Gator]

Ouch, now you guys have me worried. We're running two single axis and two dual axis, and I was planning to switch the remaining Berts over next year. Maybe I'll wait until the final verdict.

 

I know a guy (who just admitted on another thread that he's not actually perfect, BTW  ) who has gone the whole route on his boat. He won't be happy if they start to crap the bed. And you wouldn't like him when he gets angry 

[Yankee Troller]

We've run these rod holders both in a track and on our downriggers. In 4 seasons we've never had a pin slide out. However, I have had one get crushed from the insane Genny surge in April when it went under the dock. There is a black piece that is part of the ratcheting system on the holder which is meant to be the break away piece in case of rough play. We have broken a few of those, but that's there so the pins and the rest of the holder don get damaged. 

 

That being said. I have had some of the holders get sloppy. This is easily fixed by pulling it apart and tightening down the hardware, and adding a little lok-tite. It's actually a good thing, because it gets you in there so you can lube up the moving parts.

 

I also want to clarify that to my knowledge, and I am going to obtain the answer from my contact at Cannon, everything is made and assembled right here in the USA. I know all the downriggers are, so I have no reason to believe the rod holders aren't.

 

Every product has it's kwerks, and nothing is perfect. I can tell you Cannon customer service is great! The Cisco's you speak of are also great rod holders. We ran them for 3 or 4 seasons. However, we did have one snap on us during that time frame.

[Silver Fox]

Ouch, now you guys have me worried. We're running two single axis and two dual axis, and I was planning to switch the remaining Berts over next year. Maybe I'll wait until the final verdict.

I know a guy (who just admitted on another thread that he's not actually perfect, BTW ) who has gone the whole route on his boat. He won't be happy if they start to crap the bed. And you wouldn't like him when he gets angry

Ummmmmmm does he have grey hair?

[shadrapper]

This happens regularly on 2 of my 10 dual axis. I check and knock the pins back to center but will be trying the expend the ends of the pins. I still would not trade them for any other.

[CaptSpike]

Took a good look at my holders today and noticed the thin wall refered to (on the ratchet hinge point). In my opinion the worse thing you can do is try to expand, swag or what ever you choose to call it to the pins. If you do that when you go to remove them because you need to you will destroy the hole size in the aluminum. I would suggest upsetting the aluminum on the thicker side of the pin hole (inner edge) with a center punch (spring loaded would be best). This way if you need to remove the pin later it will only resize the hole to what it should be not make it bigger (make sure to center punch an area that isn't on the slot of the spring pin).

I reviewed the design of the holder today also. They definitely could have made some improvements. Starting with the thin wall where the pin in question resides. Since it is a special extruded tube they could have easily extended that area towards the ratchet handle without affecting the action. I also noticed on the four I have that some were sloppyier that others. The play between the two bases that rotate was not the same on all of them. So I broke one down. Two flathead screws hold the base on (these are thread locked to keep them in place). Then you rotate The base until the two holes line up with the two screws holding the tube on. Remove these two screws (which are also thread locked). Once the tube is removed you see a shoulder screw that sets the play in (distance between) the bases. If the thickness of the top plate is not "fit" to the size of the shoulder on the screw you will get more play. I was able to crank the shoulder screws a tad on the two loose ones I had. One tightened it up better the other did nothing. The two sections rotate on the shoulder screw. I did not see a bushing and I couldn't tell if there was a plate between them (to prevent metal on metal) it didn't look like it. I guess with all the axis movement there will be sacrifices in fit of the assembly. I'm pretty sure with the amount of use I will put these thru I should see yrs of use out of them with no trouble. I can certainly see if I used them a lot where trouble could show up. If you use them alot you should do as suggested above and tear them down (very easy) and make sure there is no problems: galvonic corrosion from two different metals, metal on metal wear (no buffer).

I am also wondering if one of the plastic pieces break can replacem,ents be found at local shops or should I preorder a couple to have on hand just in case?

 

Thanks,

Spike

[Silver Fox]

I'll tell ya. If they break and I lose equipment, there buying it. For how much they are they shouldn't have any issues. Also I'm not making improvements to something that's that expensive. We will see eh?

[Captain Carl Bish]

We've run these rod holders both in a track and on our downriggers. In 4 seasons we've never had a pin slide out. However, I have had one get crushed from the insane Genny surge in April when it went under the dock. There is a black piece that is part of the ratcheting system on the holder which is meant to be the break away piece in case of rough play. We have broken a few of those, but that's there so the pins and the rest of the holder don get damaged. 

 

That being said. I have had some of the holders get sloppy. This is easily fixed by pulling it apart and tightening down the hardware, and adding a little lok-tite. It's actually a good thing, because it gets you in there so you can lube up the moving parts.

 

I also want to clarify that to my knowledge, and I am going to obtain the answer from my contact at Cannon, everything is made and assembled right here in the USA. I know all the downriggers are, so I have no reason to believe the rod holders aren't.

 

Every product has it's kwerks, and nothing is perfect. I can tell you Cannon customer service is great! The Cisco's you speak of are also great rod holders. We ran them for 3 or 4 seasons. However, we did have one snap on us during that time frame.

The box mine came in says......MADE IN CHINA

[bigblue]

I had another holder drop a pin on a diver rig . It must have something to do with torque on the holder from the diver all the rigger and board set ups have been flawless . It is a great holder but that one flaw is a killer .

[Oncebitten]

This is the part that makes me nervous...

 

C1.bmp

 

[thefrenchman]

Hey there

excuse me but those rod holders are real cr...p

friend of mine showed me yesterday his set-up

he has 4 on each side of the gunel

the 2 first one on his side he uses for dipsys

and they wabble like bubble heads you put on a dash

and only a season not even fisnish at that

 

do yourself a favor and look at the new rachered rod holders

from traxtech i bought 2 this year to try them

wow you will see right away this is good stuff

not made out of cheap aluminum sheet

just go look at them

#GT100

 

thefrenchman

Edited July 30, 2014 by thefrenchman

[K Gonefishin]

If you want the best spend the money and buy Cisco. Small private company that takes care of their customers made in Cleveland ohio.

[jigstick]

I have two Ciscos as well.  They have super nice machining.  I also have some of their electronic mounts.  However, performance wise, they hold the dipsy rods no better no worse than my Cannons.

[CaptSpike]

As stated earlier I bought four of these last year. Yesterday while out fishing I had a pin come out of one side of the holder (luckily no parts lost) I pressed it back in and checked the other three. All three of them others the pin was starting to come out of as well. I don't use these half as much as most of you and for this to be happening just highlights how crappy a design that is. I will be calling Cannon about the problem.

Might have to go back to the berts I was using before....I do like being able to rotate the holders so I can lay them inboard for traveling and entry in and out of the boat when it is on the trailer....

 

Spike