Kings...what's up this year?

[Yankee Troller]

You ain't kidding! I saw a couple of hotties taking scale samples at tourneys this summer!

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[King Davy]

And Rick....come on man....you know I respect the heck out of the fact that you are a true salmon hunter, but get off the snagging song....especially for steelhead. We all realize we'll never get rid of the skullduggerers ...but the majority of Steelheaders out there are the reason you guys have a lot of those 3 and 4 year old fish to catch...cause we don't kill them. Release rates are in the 95% and better range for trib guys.

 

You should realize those 10 + pound fish have way more then likely been caught numerious times before you boxed them by both lake and trib anglers. And remember....for at least four months....and many time five months ...those fish are the only targets we have in our trib systems...so just like Salmon are important to you and many others...those silver bullets are important to the trib community

[justtracytrolling]

Just check out the pictures of the south shore charter trip 8/7-8/10.If it wasn't so sad, it would almost be funny. Bandrus has it exactly right.One species is down,so lets decimate the next.Great.....lay all those flattails on the deck and push out your chests.Basic math boys!!!!

I suppose if you are that concerned with the fish you wont be fishing for them yourself again?  Im sure if you could ask the trout they'd rather you stayed out of the streams and leave them alone too... Really....THE purpose of fishing for many of us is to eat them!!  They are stocked and there is no shortage of steelhead.  You want to release your catch nobody is stopping you, but if the guys in the pic want to keep them its not your decision.   Nice catch Rick!  

[GAMBLER]

I'm all for them getting data but fin clipping and nose tagging lessens their chance for survival and stresses them. The DEC employee that delivered the fish to our pen project told me the kings will stop feeding for days after being clipped and tagged. He said the fish were bigger this year because they did not go through the stress of the marking trailer.

[bandrus1]

I'm all for them getting data but fin clipping and nose tagging lessens their chance for survival and stresses them. The DEC employee that delivered the fish to our pen project told me the kings will stop feeding for days after being clipped and tagged. He said the fish were bigger this year because they did not go through the stress of the marking trailer.

 

 

but in the long run all that gets accounted for... if there is a higher mortality rate they will raise stocking numbers... The DEC has done a fine job keeping the lake in check

[GAMBLER]

but in the long run all that gets accounted for... if there is a higher mortality rate they will raise stocking numbers... The DEC has done a fine job keeping the lake in check

Since when have they increased stocking due to mortality? Lakers have been shorted a couple times and no increase the following year? They did add some extra kings due to the coho issue.

[tove12345]

Other than the burt dam and a very few other choice places,most,and I mean most of the wading steelhead guys are true fishermen.Catch and release is the norm and not the exeption.small flies with a flick to unzip and send them on their way.I for one don't care that it is not their "hobby".Most of us are bustin our @ss working jobs so that,for a few days a year,we can escape to the rivers and challenge ourselves with fooling some steel,maybe take a quick pic and let them go!selfish  and short sightedcomes to mind.

[tove12345]

I suppose if you are that concerned with the fish you wont be fishing for them yourself again?  Im sure if you could ask the trout they'd rather you stayed out of the streams and leave them alone too... Really....THE purpose of fishing for many of us is to eat them!!  They are stocked and there is no shortage of steelhead.  You want to release your catch nobody is stopping you, but if the guys in the pic want to keep them its not your decision.   Nice catch Rick!  

If you read my earlier post,that is exactly what I did. I will not target steelhead.Enjoy yor meal!

[bandrus1]

Since when have they increased stocking due to mortality? Lakers have been shorted a couple times and no increase the following year? They did add some extra kings due to the coho issue.

 

 

not a specific reaction to die off but the overall stocking numbers are done based on their research and they have been rather stable so if they see that populations are down they will add to stocking.. so if fin clipping actually did decrease return numbers stocking would inevitably go up

[Tall Tails]

In honor of this thread I am going to wear my "Fillet and Release" Tshirt on saturday while I bonk those innocent tasty fish right between the eyes!

[justtracytrolling]

Other than the burt dam and a very few other choice places,most,and I mean most of the wading steelhead guys are true fishermen.Catch and release is the norm and not the exeption.small flies with a flick to unzip and send them on their way.I for one don't care that it is not their "hobby".Most of us are bustin our @ss working jobs so that,for a few days a year,we can escape to the rivers and challenge ourselves with fooling some steel,maybe take a quick pic and let them go!selfish  and short sightedcomes to mind.

Wading the tribs to "fool steel" isnt targetting steelhead? 

[tove12345]

excuse me.I was referring to trolling the lake where it is near impossible to revive a steelhead.

[sea yea 2]

excuse me.I was referring to trolling the lake where it is near impossible to revive a steelhead.

Although i dont catch many( probably a handful every year) i have never had

An issue releasing a steelhead. Is there normally a problem with releasing them? I would say i have the most trouble with bigger kings in warmer surface water.

I have spent 10 min hanging over the side of the boat until a fish kicks away from me. If it doesnt then its in the cooler. Im not big on eating them so i only keep what wont go back.

I have heard they all die anyway but i dont believe that for a second, i have seen way to many swim away strong and healthy to believe they all perish

[spoonfed-1]

excuse me.I was referring to trolling the lake where it is near impossible to revive a steelhead.

 

WOW!!!

I know that now I will stop releasing them.

Thanks for the info.

[TileMan Dan]

As I stated earlier this was a really great thread until the pissin match started and unfortunately it due to pretty much one party.

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[tove12345]

Releasing steelhead has always been a problem for me.They always seem like they are ready after a good amount of time holding and reviving,only to let them go and have them go belly up. I agree,sometimes the big kings can be tough,but pulling them for awhile usually yeilds good results.I too only keep what will not survive.Fishing the Salmon river, I see salmon pulling spin drs. up river every year,so many survive .I am fully aware of the put and take thing,but all I advocate is to take less than is put. Everyone wins!!!.Just take a look at the Erie steelhead debacle.3 per person per day in the river. 35 miles of river on the 2 major tribs and NO ONE can figure out why the fishing is not near what it was.WOW...!! miles and miles of river and these fish get destroyed the first 500 yds. of river.

[tove12345]

As I stated earlier this was a really great thread until the pissin match started and unfortunately it due to pretty much one party.

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Discussing helps everyone see every side.....don't judge unjustly.

[pvelyk]

It's amazing how myopic some people want to see the world. It's great to see the world one way and do what you think is best but it's pretty crappy to try to make everyone live their life by your standards and hypothesis on what makes the world the best. There is nothing wrong with respectable, controlled harvest of resources to be consumed. I doubt nature wanted the lakes and streams to just be large aquariums for us to view.

Edited August 13, 2014 by pvelyk

[GAMBLER]

As I stated earlier this was a really great thread until the pissin match started and unfortunately it due to pretty much one party.

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If this is directed at me, I just stated a simple little fact. Trib guys want to piss and moan about charter captains keeping too many fish yet they do not participate in the pen projects as much as lake guys.

[bandrus1]

If this is directed at me, I just stated a simple little fact. Trib guys want to piss and moan about charter captains keeping too many fish yet they do not participate in the pen projects as much as lake guys.

 

 

how many charter captions are members of LOTAC or show up to the stream restoration, tree planting projects or river clean ups? ... Goes both ways and each side has good people working on the fishery 

Edited August 13, 2014 by bandrus1

[tiogafishaddict]

One down year brings out some interesting stuff. One point is true. Charters, guides etc. Its their main job. But as history shows its a tuff one to rely on mother nature. Stocked still has to answer to mother nature's changes as well. That's why the good ones adjust and the ones who demand consistency have more serious ups and downs. Part of what makes fishing/hunting/trapping so great and not so easy to live on.

[TileMan Dan]

Point I wanted to make is that parties are blaming each other for the absence of kings this year and its total bs. It was a great debate until the first rock was thrown because opinions were on track and non accusatory of any particular group

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[GAMBLER]

I did not read one post that showed one side saying the other was at fault for the low king numbers.

[Jammin]

Not a pro prob not even a amateur like to fish many species started in creeks moved to boats started fishing lake Ontario late eighties can remember years where we caught fewer kings and most were small jacks but the coho steelhead and browns plentiful. We fished for trout and salmon so didn't target kings specifically then the following year or next we would boat more kings we fished weekends from may till September till 02 when my Buddie sold his boat I fish mostly by myself now and set up mostly to catch trout and coho twenty plus pound kings are a hand full for me I release dozens of fish at the boat seems to work for me if I can let the hook out when in water still steel like to stay in the water unless small and still green. I think numbers of all species fluctuate and unless all stocking is stopped no group is gonna over fish a species if the rules are followed. We need both groups to do their part without the streams there is no lake without the lake the streams wither. My boat has a trash bag that is always getting filled with trash at launch ramps and out in the lake sometimes its staggering how much plastic is floating in the lake. I don't fish everyday so I have to prospect so I head out to look for bait and start when I see some usually between 60 & 120 and put first rigger ten feet off bottom and then set rest up and and head out till I find a taker and it seems like the bigger kings have been laying on the bottom next to Lakers most have come off lowest rigger when its within 50' and a lot of 12-15" kings under the steelies. Oh yea if you tell me where the coho s are I'll leave the kings and most of the steel alone ↩

[Yankee Troller]

And Rick....come on man....you know I respect the heck out of the fact that you are a true salmon hunter, but get off the snagging song....especially for steelhead. We all realize we'll never get rid of the skullduggerers ...but the majority of Steelheaders out there are the reason you guys have a lot of those 3 and 4 year old fish to catch...cause we don't kill them. Release rates are in the 95% and better range for trib guys.

 

You should realize those 10 + pound fish have way more then likely been caught numerious times before you boxed them by both lake and trib anglers. And remember....for at least four months....and many time five months ...those fish are the only targets we have in our trib systems...so just like Salmon are important to you and many others...those silver bullets are important to the trib community

 

Dave - I respect you, and I know you have a great knowledge of the fishery. We can agree to disagree on some things. I am a float fisherman, and if I foul hook 1 fish in 4 months that's a lot. I fish very pressured fisheries on the West end and I see it all day long. I didn't say anything about people keeping anything in my post. Just like I keep limits of them on the Lake I have no problem with someone taking their limit in the stream. I'm just talking about the methods used. I can't describe the amount of piercings these fish get from the fly whippers, or ones who think they are fly whippers, in the trips. Dragging a fish in backwards and sideways irks me, and I believe most of the ones caught in the mouth were flossed. I know some very good flossers out there! If it was up to me I would ban fly rods on our tribs, but that's a whole other topic! 

 

I also feel Dave that we have to get the stream guys and the lake guys on the same page! I mean the stupid Kayakers were able to get together and have the power company release water for them on specific weekends over the summer that end up drawing fish into a warm river! You stream guys want us to lay off the Steelbows, and us lake guys want more Kings. If we have Kings to target its a fact we lay off the Trout. Help us push for more Salmon stocking and less wasted money and race way space dedicated to Atlantic programs and Lake Trout! I see that as a win win for both sides!

 

Now, onto some good news. I spoke with a buddy last night that talked with a Canadian angler out of Oshawa, ON, and apparently they have some stellar Salmon fishing going on over there. I heard this 3rd person, but maybe it's a sign of hope! The next few days looks pretty crappy, so maybe the winds will blow in a miracle!

Edited August 14, 2014 by Yankee Troller