Ethanol and gasoline

[jimski2]

Our brain trust in Washington has come up with the answer to cut our oil imports by adding ethanol corn alcohol to our gasoline. What happens to your boats fuel is disturbing. E-10 means 10% alcohol content and this can create water inside your fuel tank especially if you're docked or stored near the waterfront with its high humidity. Daily expansion and contraction of your fuel due to temperature changes will bring in through the tanks vent a lot of humidity that will condense in the tank. Long periods of non-use can cause the gasoline to "phase separate" forming two separate solutions in your tank. Once phase separation occurs,additives and separators will not work and your tank will need to be emptied. I don't know a good answer to this problem, possibly a dessicant filter on the vent, or empty your tanks over winter, an expansion bladder that will contain the fumes and won't damage your tank or go back to 6 gallon tanks to store your fuel in smaller amounts and empty them at the end of the year. Also older boats have rubber lines that can't handle the alcohol and will fail. Make sure your fuel lines are alcohol use certified.

[emtystringer]

i have added a water seperator filter on my boat. do you think this would give me the protection i need ?

[stinger]

This subject was kicked around on other boards last fall. Between those discussions and my dealer I guess the best thing to do for now is be sure to have a full fuel tank before storage, add stabilizer and hope there is a minimum amount of water built up. My dealer says that an empty tank is even worse because of room for more condensation to collect during tempature changes. From what I understand, dry gas and the like will not work for this condition and a fuel/water seperator can hold just so much.

I only have a 48 gallon tank so it isn't any big deal to top it off for the winter but some of you guys more than double that. I'm planning on getting a syphon hose that will get down to the bottom of the tank, (easier said than done) and pull out that gasoline this spring and mix it in my truck a little at a time. Hopefully if there is any water in there it will come out during the syphoning stage and I'll see it in the collection can. It will be interesting to see just how much water does collect if any. I'll try and remember to let you know. :roll: That's my plan for now until something better comes along. :?

...to be continued....

[Shellback]

For those with certain fiberglass fuel tanks, ethanol is a disaster. These specific tanks were made with resins that the ethanol attacks, then that crap screws up your whole fuel system, whether carbs or injectors. If any of you have fiberglass tanks it would be wise to do some research before using any gas with ethanol. BoatUS probably has info on their site.

[Guest ReelDiel]

one thing to remember at least in WNY is not all stations are selling a 10% blend, most still have conventional 87. if there is a 10% blend it will have a sticker on the pump that states this.

[ray koziatek]

http//boatingsailing.sute101.com/article.cfm/solving_ethanol_boat_fuel_problems

[Fishstix]

It seems Ive got to stick my nose in most every topic. During this cold snap Ive been adding gasoline to my diesel fuel. have had no jelling problems. Just been dumping as much in as if I was adding additives . Its a whole lot cheaper.

As far as the gasoline goes I used to know some guys that haul it and it went in whatever tank needed it the most.I try to buy the cheapest. My snowplow sat all summer and started this winter no problems.I left it with 1/2 tank.

Im probably turning into a crotchety oldtimer that I used to hate but I seem to learn from life experiences.The sky is not falling.If its a nice warm sunfilled summerday and Im smoking a cigarette when my boat tank melts down,well Ive had a good life.

"ethanol, smethenol" dump in a little 2 stroke oil and go.Im going to.

[muskybob]

Ray, there's something wrong with that link. Doesn't work for me.

[ray koziatek]

i know but cant get the right link to pop up to take ya to article, if ya clean back to com it should get ya to the main site then ya could try to enter rest of search to there item rearch. found site by general search under,,,, ethonal problems ,,,,,found that suite 101 site on page two search.it said that water vapor in the vents is not the problem but sloppy practice by carriers and distributars is more problem stations need to change water seperators more often,we need to change our filters more often for awile till the crap in our tanks is loosened up and carried to the filter, ive had my boat for bout7 yrs now and never had problem with water in gas but this last summer several times when running in rough water i noticed water does hit vent opening on sides of boat and must allow some water to enter vent doesent affect tank im running on,think it burns water as fast as it enters vent, but when i switch to other tank after long runs under rough conditions i get a pretty good flush of water so bad that the old tub shuts down and i gotta switch back and play the flushing game till the waters out if its bee real bad ive had to (((((dissconnect fuel line install primer bulb into fuel line with 2ft of clear tubing pumpinto clear container till water is out reconnect and im fine)))))))this can be done in the driveway for those with rubber fuel lines at fuel pump sucks the crap from bottom of tank as fuel pickup is near bottom. Fishstix set your cigeratte aside during this process.we enjoy your photoshop too much to let you go too soon. this year im gonna try some of those lobster claw rubberbands around vents on tank not in use and maybe angling vents a little more to the rear .. or straight up :roll: :roll: :roll: jst kidding

[muskybob]

Here ya go: http://boatingsailing.suite101.com/arti ... l_problems

[stinger]

Thanks Musky for the link. That does help clarify some of the issues.

Found these comments to be helpfull.....

"There don't seem to be chronic problems in the fleet from moisture being adsorbed by ethanol because of vented boat fuel tanks. Problems have all been traced to contamination issues caused by poor housekeeping that allows mixing of ethanol with MTBE or water."

"Ethanol acts like a cleaning agent and will loosen years of varnish buildup in an engine or fuel tank. Without good fuel filters, these dissolved fuel system wastes can cause problems for a boater."

.....so from that last paragraph it would seem the older cars/trucks are just as susceptible to the same problems. I guess we don't need to panic though. Knowing how to deal with it should become common knowledge once Ethanol makes a bigger headway into our fuels.

Maybe some of the old closed down farms in New York can go into the corn growing business. I wonder how many guys will be selling their boats and buying tractors & corn harvesters :roll: .

[Guest ReelDiel]

stix you have to be very careful adding gasoline to your diesel fuel as you can do serious damage to your engine..a better alternative is to add 10% kerosene this will or should cure all your jelling problems and will not affect your motor.

[Fishstix]

Real Deal I got my info. from a group of oldtimers in the mid west. Off a tractor board set up kinda like this fishing board.So far they have been right.I still add kerosene when its really cold.But if good ole NYS ever caught you doing it there would be a big fine. [road tax] They forget who pays the bills and dont really care if your running or not ,they just want money....

NYS DOT only whorehouse in the country that doesn't show a profit...

[Erbyjoe]

I talked to a bunch of marine dealer at a show I went to yesterday and they all said the best thing to do before you use the boat this spring is to take a sample of the gas from right at the motor put it in a clear jug you will be able to see if there is water in your gas The gas will come from the bottom of your tank.So the sample should give you an idea what's in the tank.That's what I'm going to do this spring.I think that make alot of sense to me.They also said that this type of gas is just starting to show up in the east so it will be trial and error for the frist couple of years to see what will happen.They say that the more you use your boat the less likely you will end up with a problem.The boats that just sit for a long time have a chance of the gas separating.Will see.But what do I know

[HitorMissIV]

boaters along the shore areas from N.Y-Delaware are having problems from sedement in fuel tanks. They are constantly changing filters and in some cases having to empty & flush fuel tanks . A friend of mine with a 2 yr. old boat had to flush his tanks several times! Carburated engines should have shut of valves at tanks so that carbs. can be run dry when boats are not in use for lengths of time.The alcohol can attack the internals in the fuel bowls.Some float needle & seats that are not made of Viton material will be affected .