meaning of exception to regulations?

[sparkyice]

this is the email i sent to the DEC region 8 fisheries link ([email protected]) from their website last thursday. i'm still awaiting a reply. what is your opinion of the meaning of this exception to the regulations?     

 

 

 

Hello,

I have a question regarding the Finger Lakes and Tributary regulations.

Specifically;

 

Additional Regulations for Finger Lakes Tributaries

1. Any action to frighten fish and move them from concealment, including herding, driving, kicking, and stoning is prohibited.
2. Angling is prohibited from January 1 through March 31, and between sunset and sunrise from April 1 through May 15 and October 1 through December 31, except for those stream sections listed below.
3. Possession of gaff hooks and landing nets larger than 50" around the frame or with handles longer than 20" is prohibited, except for those stream sections as listed.
4. Use of more than one line with a single hook point is prohibited, except for those stream sections listed below.
5. Possession of hooks with a gap greater than 1/2" is prohibited, except for those stream sections listed below.

Stream sections for which additional tributary regulations 2, 3, 4, and 5 above do not apply (trout season is closed January 1 through March 31 in these sections):

• West River, Sucker Brook from Canandaigua Lake upstream in Ontario County;
• Guyanoga Creek from Keuka Lake upstream to route 54A bridge in Yates County;
• Cayuga Inlet and flood control channel from Cayuga Lake upstream to posted "No Fishing" boundary below the Fishway in Tompkins County;
• Old Barge Canal from Seneca Lake upstream to northernmost Route 14 bridge in Montour Falls, Schuyler County.
• Yawgers Creek from Cayuga Lake upstream to abandoned Lehigh Valley RR bridge in Cayuga County;
• Owasco Inlet from Owasco Lake upstream 2/3 mile to marked boundary at old railroad bed in Cayuga County.
• Fall Creek from Cayuga Lake to downstream edge of the railroad bridge below Rt 13 in Ithaca, Tompkins County.
• Note: Dutch Hollow Brook from Owasco Lake to Rt 38A fishing or dip-netting prohibited from March 16 to the opening of walleye season.

 

 

I understand this (in red highlights) to mean that angling is permitted in the Old Barge Canal all year long, but any trout that may be caught must be returned unharmed to the water immediately. I can recall this exact language being present in the DEC syllabus dating back to the 1970’s when I was a child.

 

I have been told by many people that any angling what-so-ever is absolutely prohibited from January 1^st through sunrise April 1^st  in this water, from an imaginary line on the shore of Seneca Lake at the Salt plant on the West to the shore of the lake at Clute Park on the East, meaning everything from the mouth of the canal at the lake upstream is off limits.

I have been told this also includes angling from a boat.

 

If I were to fish the water in question, (following all other Statewide Angling Regulations), between January 1^st and sunrise April 1^st  would I be in violation of any law or regulation?

 

Thank you for your time.

 

Sincerely,

[Hookedup]

Guys fish it when its not iced up all year with no problems. Same regs as lake.

[Salmo slayar]

This is a great question that I have often wondered about my self. Particularly at fall creek and salmon creek. Salmon creek is not listed here, so does that mean you can not fish from the lake to the rail road bridge after Dec 31?

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Lake Ontario United mobile app

[BSmaster]

It has always confused me.  I do not understand it.  If you get a response, can you post it? 

[sparkyice]

hot off the presses. this is the entirety of my communication with the DEC region 8 fisheries people.

(i redacted my name and email, seemed like the thing to do. send a PM if you have any questions)

 

Joe:

 

Sorry typo on my part, fishing is allowed January 1 through March 31.

 

In regard to your other questions on targeting trout, with this e-mail I will ask Law Enforcement to get back to you directly.

 

 

 

 

From:

Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2015 11:44 AM
To: dec.sm.fwfish8
Subject: RE: clarification of regulations

 

Thank you for your reply. Here at work we have been having an ongoing discussion about this.

There are always more questions, of course.

 

How would it be determined if one were “fishing for trout�

Ok, using spawn sacks or artificial representations thereof would be targeting trout. Live minnows, or lures representing them, that would be for trout, pike, or bass, all out of season at this time.

What about night crawlers, worms, wax worms, corn and the like? Bullheads, panfish, suckers and carp commonly take such baits. Would a trout be considered a by-catch on such baits?

 

Also, you stated “To answer your question directly; you can fish in the barge canal from January 1 through March 1^st “

Is “ March 1^st “ correct or is it March 31^st?

 

Again, thank you for your time and consideration in this matter.

By the way, I won my bet!

 

Sincerely,

Joe

 

From: dec.sm.fwfish8 [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2015 9:06 AM
To: Brown, Joseph F
Subject: RE: clarification of regulations

 

Mr. Brown:

 

Thank you for your e-mail.  As you have stated the barge canal is a tributary to Seneca Lake and therefore falls under the Finger Lakes Tributary regulations, although it is exempted from several special regulations.  Fishing in the Barge Canal is allowed year round however, ice fishing is not allowed.  Creel and season limits are the same as for other tributaries, i.e., trout may be harvested from April 1 through December 31, 15 inch minimum size, and 3 in combinations catch shall not include more than one rainbow.

 

To answer your question directly; you can fish in the barge canal from January 1 through March 1^st

Ice fishing is prohibited.

You may not fish for trout during this period.

For all other species follow the state-wide regulations for season, minimum size, and daily limits.

 

Good luck.

 

From:

Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2015 12:56 PM
To: dec.sm.fwfish8
Subject: clarification of regulations

 

Hello,

I have a question regarding the Finger Lakes and Tributary regulations.

Specifically;

 

Additional Regulations for Finger Lakes Tributaries

1.    Any action to frighten fish and move them from concealment, including herding, driving, kicking, and stoning is prohibited.

2.    Angling is prohibited from January 1 through March 31, and between sunset and sunrise from April 1 through May 15 and October 1 through December 31, except for those stream sections listed below.

3.    Possession of gaff hooks and landing nets larger than 50" around the frame or with handles longer than 20" is prohibited, except for those stream sections as listed.

4.    Use of more than one line with a single hook point is prohibited, except for those stream sections listed below.

5.    Possession of hooks with a gap greater than 1/2" is prohibited, except for those stream sections listed below.

Stream sections for which additional tributary regulations 2, 3, 4, and 5 above do not apply (trout season is closed January 1 through March 31 in these sections):

·         West River, Sucker Brook from Canandaigua Lake upstream in Ontario County;

·         Guyanoga Creek from Keuka Lake upstream to route 54A bridge in Yates County;

·         Cayuga Inlet and flood control channel from Cayuga Lake upstream to posted "No Fishing" boundary below the Fishway in Tompkins County;

·         Old Barge Canal from Seneca Lake upstream to northernmost Route 14 bridge in Montour Falls, Schuyler County.

·         Yawgers Creek from Cayuga Lake upstream to abandoned Lehigh Valley RR bridge in Cayuga County;

·         Owasco Inlet from Owasco Lake upstream 2/3 mile to marked boundary at old railroad bed in Cayuga County.

·         Fall Creek from Cayuga Lake to downstream edge of the railroad bridge below Rt 13 in Ithaca, Tompkins County.

·         Note: Dutch Hollow Brook from Owasco Lake to Rt 38A fishing or dip-netting prohibited from March 16 to the opening of walleye season.

 

 

I understand this (in red highlights) to mean that angling is permitted in the Old Barge Canal all year long, but any trout that may be caught must be returned unharmed to the water immediately. I can recall this exact language being present in the DEC syllabus dating back to the 1970’s when I was a child.

 

I have been told by many people that any angling what-so-ever is absolutely prohibited from January 1^st through sunrise April 1^st  in this water, from an imaginary line on the shore of Seneca Lake at the Salt plant on the West to the shore of the lake at Clute Park on the East, meaning everything from the mouth of the canal at the lake upstream is off limits.

I have been told this also includes angling from a boat.

 

If I were to fish the water in question, (following all other Statewide Angling Regulations), between January 1^st and sunrise April 1^st  would I be in violation of any law or regulation?

 

Thank you for your time.

 

Sincerely,

[BSmaster]

Bass and pike close on March 15th.  Well, at least this isn't as cloudy for me today as it was yesterday.

[sparkyice]

update:

 

Joe,

Thanks for your questions and concerns.  In order for a conservation officer to write a ticket they have to have reasonable cause to believe a violation of the law has occurred. For fishing for trout or targeting them when they are closed the tackle or gear  and style of fishing would certainly be looked at.  If the officer observed an individual catch 5 trout and never changed their gear or fishing style, then the individual has made no attempt to avoid catching them.  Hope this answers your question.

 

Enjoy the fishing,

Lt. Josh Ver Hague

Region 8 NYSDEC

[jason]

you can catch trout. You just can't target them.

[Salmo slayar]

Hmmm. I am still a bit confused. I guess the answer for me is to not fish those waters when the trout season is closed. Seems like it is too much of a grey area to even risk it.