(Possibly) making a difference.

[rolmops]

Did anybody ever consider setting up a pen project higher up in a stream and having the pens in for several months? If so please give your opinion and thoughts.

I am considering setting up a project in lower Irondeqoit Creek and trying to make it work like the Credit River hatchery project. ( the floating pens part ).

Please toy with this idea and if you have thoughts about it please share them.

Thank you ,Cornelis.

[Capt Vince Pierleoni]

Wonderful idea and welcome to the world of thinking outside the box. Be prepared to be met with all kinds of resistance, the first being WHOS fish are they going to be taken from?(NYSDEC is stuck on the target number) The second one will be, can a truck get anywhere near where the pens will be? There is only so much pipe that can be extended. The 3rd would be is it a secure site where vandalism/predation could be prevented? Lastly, in a Trib like Iron wild water level fluctuations are to be considered, a blowout could be catastrophic to the pens or the 2 inch long fish.

I would imagine there is some natural repro in that trib or its feeders, it may be better to improve the habitat with the effort. I know there is money available for stream rehabilitation.  

[Patriot]

Water temp may be an issue, depending on time of year

[Xxx]

It's a good thought even if it's only that!! It shows some have the initiative to grab the bull by the horns!! I can only imagine what one would have to go through. I'm involved with a gun club and we raise our own trout, amazing the amount of guys that show up to fish, but last year we needed to make repairs on the hatchery and it's only the same guys that show up when we mention the words "help" "work" just makes a man wonder sometimes, ironically I'm the youngest that shows up and I'm 50 yrs old and the other got 10-20yrs on me, but the 30 and younger are there when the bell rings one the opening day! Go figure.

[Sweet Caroline]

Interesting you mention Irondequoit creek. There has been a decent salmon run for years without any salmon stocking there in probably 15-20 yrs. Could be strays but I gotta believe the stream has the potential for some natural reproduction. I have seen good amounts of spawning salmon up very high in the system on some good gravel. I have also caught steelhead smolts in the middle of the summer that seemed to be doing well as well as what appeared to be naturally repoduced browns i.e smaller with more brilliant colloration than any of the stockers. All the development around this watershed is concerning though.   

[jlogger]

I would certainly be willing to donate some time and elbow grease on this if it were determined to be feasible. The lower end of the creek stays at bay level so I think the depth and flow would be fairly predictable. I have canoed that creek between Ellison Park and the bay for the past 15-20 years and there are some good spots for pens. Capt Vince's accessibility concern is a good point though. I only know of one real good spot that would have truck access, pending approval from the town of Brighton.

[rolmops]

I would certainly be willing to donate some time and elbow grease on this if it were determined to be feasible. The lower end of the creek stays at bay level so I think the depth and flow would be fairly predictable. I have canoed that creek between Ellison Park and the bay for the past 15-20 years and there are some good spots for pens. Capt Vince's accessibility concern is a good point though. I only know of one real good spot that would have truck access, pending approval from the town of Brighton.

It just so happens that I am employed by the town.

[rolmops]

Interesting you mention Irondequoit creek. There has been a decent salmon run for years without any salmon stocking there in probably 15-20 yrs. Could be strays but I gotta believe the stream has the potential for some natural reproduction. I have seen good amounts of spawning salmon up very high in the system on some good gravel. I have also caught steelhead smolts in the middle of the summer that seemed to be doing well as well as what appeared to be naturally repoduced browns i.e smaller with more brilliant colloration than any of the stockers. All the development around this watershed is concerning though.   

Irondeqoit Creek  had a lot of restoration work done to it in the past few years and a lot of silt has been removed thereby restoring the gravel beds.

At this point I am thinking about the Brighton spot which has good access and is well protected while I am also thinking about a spot in Allison Park with good access next to the seasonal skating rink. A third place can be on Heberles stables property.

I have no idea what the survival rate would be if the fish are released that far upstream with a swampy area to negotiate and with the bay to traverse as well.

Nor do I know if it would be a good place for kings,although you are right about the browns and the steelies. I have never seen kings actively spawning up there although I have seen them next to the hatchery.I have seen Atlantic smolt in there.

Irondeqoit Creek is about 47 miles long mostly under trees and mostly privately owned and as such quite hard to access for snaggers.

Edited November 9, 2015 by rolmops

[LongLine]

The DEC stocks browns every spring at Brighton, Perrinton, Penfield & Pittsford.  Usually in the 8-15" range.  Plus they put a bunch of walleyes in the bay.  Their journey to the lake might be just as perilous upstream as it is at the mouth of the river, or more so.     Definitely deserves some thought though.

 

Tom B.

(LongLine)

[GAMBLER]

The DEC stocks browns every spring at Brighton, Perrinton, Penfield & Pittsford. Usually in the 8-15" range. Plus they put a bunch of walleyes in the bay. Their journey to the lake might be just as perilous upstream as it is at the mouth of the river, or more so. Definitely deserves some thought though.

Tom B.

(LongLine)

Didn't they discontinue the walleye stocking Tom? Last I knew they were not doing it anymore.

[jlogger]

It just so happens that I am employed by the town.

That makes things convenient. That is a good spot down there. A lot of northern pike in there though. That might be a problem come release time, but it is fairly close to the bay.

[LongLine]

Brian - It was supposed to go to every two years.  (in the old numbered years)

[UNREEL]

Pens in Irondequoit Creek. Great idea. Or anywhere in I-Bay for that matter. I would be willing to help with that effort. The DEC fish guru's are going to be at the Genesee Charter Captains meeting the 1st of December at the Iron. Bay Fish & Game Club. Would be a perfect time to bring this up. Maybe try to get them to think "out of the box".

Kevin

[rolmops]

Pens in Irondequoit Creek. Great idea. Or anywhere in I-Bay for that matter. I would be willing to help with that effort. The DEC fish guru's are going to be at the Genesee Charter Captains meeting the 1st of December at the Iron. Bay Fish & Game Club. Would be a perfect time to bring this up. Maybe try to get them to think "out of the box".

Kevin

I just realized that this may increase the survival rate of the fingerlings because they will be in a nutrient rich environment in which they will learn to feed on the naturally occurring food sources while still being fed pellets, and their transfer to the big lake will take longer but this time is in a nutrient rich environment.

Edited November 11, 2015 by rolmops

[jlogger]

Is anyone considering addressing this topic at the GCC meeting? I don't know the first thing about pen rearing salmon so I do not feel too confident about taking point on the subject, but would gladly attend, listen, learn and offer any help I could.

 

Jack

[jimski2]

The Niagara River has a lesser salmon fall return because the salmon follow colder water temperstures as they enter the lake. The Niagara is Lake Erie water that is warmer than Ontario water until later in the season.

[rolmops]

What is the exact date and time of this meeting?

[Missdemeanor]

Edit

Sent from my VS980 4G using Lake Ontario United mobile app

Edited November 26, 2015 by Missdemeanor

[UNREEL]

The meeting is this Tues. Dec 1st at 7 PM at the Iron. Bay Fish & Game Club 658 Bay Front S. I just checked with the president of the charter captains and the DEC is still on board. Stop down on the early side and have a $1.75 beer.

Kevin

[jlogger]

The meeting is this Tues. Dec 1st at 7 PM at the Iron. Bay Fish & Game Club 658 Bay Front S. I just checked with the president of the charter captains and the DEC is still on board. Stop down on the early side and have a $1.75 beer.

Kevin

I'll never say no to a cheap beer. Hopefully this is OK with all of the members of the GCC. I do not want to be seen as trying to hijack their meeting. I'm sure there are plenty of topics and concerns that members would like addressed with the DEC above and beyond a new pen rearing project.

Jack

[UNREEL]

I hear ya about hijacking the mtg. The DEC has a few topics to talk about, but I'm sure the question could be asked if fish would be available or not for a pen project. If so, I'm sure I could get the OK to put a couple pens at the game club, if nothing else is available. There is a good spot for them at our guest dock.

[rolmops]

On December first I went to the Captains meeting at the Irondeqoit Fish and Game Club to find out what if anything can be done to improve fishing for next season. Apart from a group of Captains and guests there was also a respectable number of DEC people including Steven Lapan.

Steven Lapan informed us about a lot of the work the DEC has done this summer and came up with a lot of numbers. He also explained about the man power problems during peak stocking season and the limitations that it brings with it. He told us that the Salmon River Hatchery is staffed by six employees who maintain the hatchery,breed and feed the fish and on top of that also transport and stock all the fish into the different places around lake Ontario and other stocking spots. During peak stocking season these people do put in a lot of effort and hours.

At one point I had a chance to ask if it is possible to add some pens in Irondeqoit creek or I-Bay. Steve Lapan answered that for 2016 there was no chance of doing this because only a certain number of fish is stocked yearly into the lake and deviating from these numbers may upset the balance between bait (alewives) and predators (chinooks). But then he continued and explained that according to their creel reports the pen fish are double as likely to survive to the point where they come in to spawn.compared to fish just stocked in the rivers. Bearing this in mind it is impossible to add pens for 2016 because that would likely upset the bait /predator balance. However it is a possibility for 2017. Which is just as well because we would need time  to organize additional pens.

I was left with the impression that the DEC fishing department is a slow and lumbering  organisation not because they are not active ,but because they are extremely careful about upsetting the natural balance in the lake and all their actions are based on the information gathered during any given year,which can only be used in the next year and comparing this to additional information already available from other years.

Do not expect the DEC to make sudden moves or change direction without proper scientific research.

Edited December 4, 2015 by rolmops

[UNREEL]

Rolmops, I was not able to stay for the whole meeting last Tues. so I did not here that question. At least you got a straight answer from them about 2016. We can concentrate on 2017. I will persue this with the people involved with the other pen projects for any info.

[rolmops]

Let's hope this is the start of a great project that will lead to trolling for salmon in the bay when it's bumpy on the lake.

It should also lead to great volunteer participation. Just think of it. You come to feed the fish and you get a beer for free for every time you feed them. The first case is on me!