New to Copper, a few questions

[greenboatluke]

I picked up a 300 copper and am planning to run it off an inline board. (My current program is 2 riggers and 1 dipsy off each side.) 

 

I currently have offshore inlines and through some research, heard they don't pull to the side well when towing long copper. I read church inlines will pull better. Anyone have experience using offshore, or should I buy a church tx-44 for my copper application?

 

Secondly, I want to continue to run a dipsy on the same side. I have the magnum size on wire. Any suggestions on what setting I should use on the dipsy and how far I should get the copper away from the boat. Last thing I want to do is tangle wire and copper!

 

Lastly, what is your go to set up on the business end of your copper set up?

 

Any advice and experience is greatly appreciated! Thanks.

[FleetTracker]

Run it down the chute Luke. I wouldn't mess with an inline. More trouble than what its worth. You'll want a 400-450 copper for our area though. 300 not deep enough.

Edited February 7, 2016 by FleetTracker

[bottom-feeder]

have no doubt you will tangle them in time

2 setting on dipsy should be fine

I run mine off my big boards but I do have a TX-44 you can have if ya want it

I;m just north of Pulaski....if ya want message me one of your trips up to sacketts and grab it

I believe its the starboard side

 

last year the stinger yellow tuxedo on my 300 produced many kings

Edited February 7, 2016 by bottom-feeder

[shawn393]

i tried putting a 5 color core out on a offshore once.it didn't even pull that very well.

[Sk8man]

Luke - Devin is right about sometimes needing to get down deeper than the 300 will go but in my experience it is in the mid/late summer period when the fish (especially salmon) can be down real deep but I run the 300 and even a couple 250's during much of the rest of the season.  Depending on boat speed and currents etc. you should be able to get down between 50-60 ft with the 300 copper if you are just running a spoon behind it. As Devin mentioned the 300 run down the chute is often productive and I usually run mine that way too. It will run off the TX 44 boards too. I don't use the Offshores  as I have all Church boards so I can't speak to that.  As far as the dipseys a setting of 1 -2 generally works well but it also matters how much other stuff you are running and where.  Bottom-feeder is right too - expect to tangle once in awhile and it may not even be your fault as cross currents and certain lure actions and a bunch of other factors come into play sometimes.....you can expect over time to have some shorter coppers than you started with originally My problems have never been with the wire rigs mainly with multiple leadcores.....

 

As far as how far out to run the boards with copper  you'll have to experiment. You want them far enough out to be sure that the other stuff you're running is clear of them  and I usually run one shorter than the other on the opposite side so that if they swing on turns they clear as well. I also don't usually run my downriggers as far back either and stagger the lengths of them as well.

 

I know some guys like using dipseys from coppers I normally just run a single spoon (usually small to medium for trout and larger for the salmon) just less to mess with and less drag coming in.

Edited February 7, 2016 by Sk8man

[Big Water]

Another option that has worked well and has been very productive for me is using a 200' copper down the chute. The difference is that I'm using 60# copper rather than the usual 45#. On a high speed reel,, you can clear this rod quickly if you're into a big fish. I also think that the 60# stuff takes more hits for some reason. Just a thought.

Edited February 8, 2016 by Big Water

[AnglingAddict]

If you are going to run copper - at some point you will get it tangled. Don't overthink it - you can run 300s on the smaller inlines - run your divers tighter on like a 1 1/2 setting and you will be fine. If you go with longer coppers then you can run one down the chute or go with the bigger TX-44s or the new offshore board meant for longer coppers.

[FleetTracker]

Luke - Devin is right about sometimes needing to get down deeper than the 300 will go but in my experience it is in the mid/late summer period when the fish (especially salmon) can be down real deep but I run the 300 and even a couple 250's during much of the rest of the season.  Depending on boat speed and currents etc. you should be able to get down between 50-60 ft with the 300 copper if you are just running a spoon behind it. As Devin mentioned the 300 run down the chute is often productive and I usually run mine that way too. It will run off the TX 44 boards too. I don't use the Offshores  as I have all Church boards so I can't speak to that.  As far as the dipseys a setting of 1 -2 generally works well but it also matters how much other stuff you are running and where.  Bottom-feeder is right too - expect to tangle once in awhile and it may not even be your fault as cross currents and certain lure actions and a bunch of other factors come into play sometimes.....you can expect over time to have some shorter coppers than you started with originally My problems have never been with the wire rigs mainly with multiple leadcores.....

 

As far as how far out to run the boards with copper  you'll have to experiment. You want them far enough out to be sure that the other stuff you're running is clear of them  and I usually run one shorter than the other on the opposite side so that if they swing on turns they clear as well. I also don't usually run my downriggers as far back either and stagger the lengths of them as well.

 

I know some guys like using dipseys from coppers I normally just run a single spoon (usually small to medium for trout and larger for the salmon) just less to mess with and less drag coming in.

 

Les you bring up some good points.  Luke the 300 will be most applicable in June and early July where you fish.  After that, you'll need a longer Copper to reach the Kings.  I caught more Kings last year on 400 and 450 Copper then I think all Riggers and Dipseys combined... it's lethal!

 

I have a 250 Copper that I run during this June/July timeframe, as well as a 10 color.  I run either of them down the chute, or if it's pretty calm with minimal boat traffic, I deploy big boards and will throw one down each side to spread things out.  I haven't had as much luck on the 250 or 10 color during this time of year.  Riggers seem to take most hits in this water column range for me.  Like I said though, the deep copper is lethal late Summer.  Look into picking one up for this year... I'll help ya spool it up this Summer.  See ya soon man... season is almost here!

Edited February 8, 2016 by FleetTracker

[Sk8man]

I can't help but think that there is some kind of interaction going on with copper in the water that attracts the fish whether it is the vibration or electrical conduction stuff etc. who knows but I seem to have better luck with it in terms of number of hits than with the leadcores despite my buddies swearing by the cores (but they also don't use coppers yet....you know who you are... Bob )

[greenboatluke]

Thanks for all the advice and tips guys. Les, your insight is great! Devin, I have an extra 200 that came with the reel of 300. So if I can attach the 2, boom I got a 500. What do you think?

[BAZOOKAJOE]

Get big boards and run one per side. That 300 will work down the shoot in the spring or early summer. But you will have a better chance of tangling it up down the shoot! This comes from my own personal experiences.

[TyeeTanic]

I run copper off the TX44 boards. We normally let 100 - 150 ft of line out after we've clipped the board on the backing. It keeps the copper well away from the boat.

 

As for the dipsey, we use 1, 2 and 3 settings. That line dives way steeper than the copper so it's nowhere near it. 

 

We just like to keep it careful on the turns, I never have my boards approach more than the middle of my transom.  Slow and easy.

 

The only time we really have problems with the wire crossing the copper is (A) if a fish hits the wire and then moves to the outside and crosses the copper. Generally we try and keep the wires short, but sometimes if you need to go deep you have 250 ft to 300 ft of wire out, so it's hard to guarantee anything.  (B) a dispey is popped and we don't realize it. Then you go into a turn, and MESSSSSSSS!

 

We probably have 2 copper tangles a year. It's not fun. Cut your losses if this happens, cut the copper and move on, otherwise you will spend your whole fishing day untangling that mess.

[TyeeTanic]

Thanks for all the advice and tips guys. Les, your insight is great! Devin, I have an extra 200 that came with the reel of 300. So if I can attach the 2, boom I got a 500. What do you think?

 

How big's your reel?  How you plan on attaching it? A lot of people use a spro swivel to connect lines on copper. They make a fairly thin one that goes through the line guide on the reel.

[TyeeTanic]

Also I'd say 300 is the most popular (in terms of hits), then 400. 500 is difficult to use as you need to be in deep water, so depends on where you are fishing and whether you need to move in and out of a shole.

[Sk8man]

Spro Power Swivel #8 (50 lb test) works great.

[Legacy]

How big's your reel?  How you plan on attaching it? A lot of people use a spro swivel to connect lines on copper. They make a fairly thin one that goes through the line guide on the reel.

 

No need to use a swivel to connect copper to copper. Just a back to back haywire twist.

[Sk8man]

I thought he was referring to attaching leaders to the copper

[TyeeTanic]

True. Although thinking further with it, he could put on a long section of braid between the copper segments and then decide whether he wants to use 300 or 500 ft.

[greenboatluke]

The reel is a penn 345. Thanks so much guys! I'm fishing the trench, wall, and beyond.

[greenboatluke]

True. Although thinking further with it, he could put on a long section of braid between the copper segments and then decide whether he wants to use 300 or 500 ft.

I think I'd like to be able to use the 300 early and adjust to 500 later... Not sure if I want to cut the extra 200 I have in half to make a 400 or maybe 450. I have time to think, I guess.

[greenboatluke]

No need to use a swivel to connect copper to copper. Just a back to back haywire twist.

So I assume I can run the 300 for a while, than take the leader off and haywire the extra on, put on a leader and roll with it. After trolling deep water, I could then take it apart again... How well does a haywire untwist? Can it be used again or should the few inches be cut off for a new haywire? Edited February 10, 2016 by greenboatluke

[Legacy]

So I assume I can run the 300 for a while, than take the leader off and haywire the extra on, put in a leader and roll with it. After trolling deep water, I could then take it apart again... How well does a haywire untwist? Can it be used again or should the few inches be cut off for a new haywire?

Don't untwist. Cut and retie.

Sent from my E6782 using Lake Ontario United mobile app

[The Scottsman]

1- Use BIG side planner boards. One on each side of your boat. ( I make my own that will pull two 400 coppers and a 10 color on one side.) *throw away the TX-44's*

 

2- Never ever use swivels to attach backing to copper or copper to leader. Tie with the albright knot. (look it up on line) TIP- After tying the knot apply a drop of rubber cement or epoxy

 

3- There is no need to splice mono anywhere in the set up. On the reel should only be backing,copper and leader. 

 

4- The scotty pinch pad realeses in big and small will work ( water conditions will determine the size to use)

 

*If your interested in a BIG set of boards PM me*

 

5- Have fun! Copper is a great tool for Big Kings. Spring,Summer and fall.

Edited February 10, 2016 by The Scottsman

[Sk8man]

Just a comment about big boards vs. inlines for folks that possibly haven't used either option yet. -  The big boards are nice as far as pulling control goes and especially with heavier setups (e.g. longer coppers and cores) providing you have a boat with room that will allow you to locate a mast forward or on top or sides of top if hard top and anchored real well to drag them with. They may also pull better in rough water depending on the particular boards. The inlines are best for shorter setups and toplines or small dipseys as they are a bit easier to run in and out near the shoreline (e.g. for browns etc.) and are often faster to bring in in heavy traffic adjustments. They also take up much less room in the boat and are less expensive for the budget conscious (unless like some of us where you end up with a bunch of them ). They each have their place in the arsenal and strengths and weaknesses as well.

 

Although a purist may go with the Albright or another knot for connections I have never had a Spro #8 swivel failure regardless of knot used and they don't require gluing etc. and Rob is right cut don't re-tie those ends

Edited February 10, 2016 by Sk8man

[BAZOOKAJOE]

I don't trust Albright knots. Although I never have used the glue on them. But I do agree that those spro swivels everybody uses aren't the best for a leader connection. I started using mustad size 8 88 lbs diamond eye swivels and they are more gentle on your leader. From my experience braid slips through a Scotty release. I use 5 ft of 30 lbs big game between my braid and copper.

Edited February 10, 2016 by BAZOOKAJOE