MANDATORY ANTLER RESTRICTION WILL BE VOLUNTARY FOR MOST OF NEW YORK STATE

[Giz9219]

How do you have partial and voluntary antler restrictions? You either do or don't? One buck per person should help? Don't agree,need to limit the doe to one or two too? Instead of people shooting 2-5?if so they should drop the cost of the license if they are limiting the deer to one buck?

Edited February 17, 2016 by Giz9219

[FLO1919]

The DEC implementing rules without any evidence is terrible.  5 more years of the same old, same old.  We rely on them to make changes based on evidence, data, and science and they implement a 2 week antlered hiatus during bow season as a way to increase antler-less harvest. There's no evidence that it is an effective plan of increasing antler-less harvest.  At least APR's have been shown to increase antler-less harvest in other states. 

http://wiredtohunt.com/2012/06/25/a-deeper-look-at-antler-point-restrictions/

 

How many hunters and where you hunt are factors but, New York could be a destination state for deer hunting like Ohio & Wisconsin.  We have the genetics & environment for big deer but, hunter mentality & the DEC keep us from achieving it. 

 

"QDMA means small deer are spared and less tags filled means less deer shot." Hmm??? Not exactly.

 

    Harvesting enough does and protecting young bucks would provide a chance at a balanced age structure with both bucks and does, fill all our tags, and meet the states needs to manage the herd. While rack size is a genetic factor, we rarely get to see giants simply because we shoot them when they are young, not because the genetics don't exist here in NY.  We need herd balance. I just don't think we will ever be anything other then a "meat hunter state" while this is voluntary.   

 

License sales are dropping.  Hunting has to compete with all sorts of things now and how are you supposed to keep a young persons interest when the quality of the hunt is lacking so? Would you troll around Lake O if there were slim chances at catching a fish, just to be out there? How many seasons like last year would it take with bad fish numbers before you started fishing Erie more???

[Todd in NY]

In my area the does far outnumber the bucks. On my 2 trail cameras I will see 3 to 5 does in August, all  hanging around my camera, with NO fawns in sight. That tells me that those does didn't get bred the year before. Lucky for me I'm a meat hunter and not a trophy hunter, so I have no problem taking a doe or 2 that wouldn't get bred anyway.

 

Another problem around my area are the poachers who take deer out of season and at night. Most of our deer are nocturnal from September thru March, depending on the severity of the winter. I didn't hunt this year, and according to my neighbors I didn't miss anything.

 

The local farmers who are still in the area brought up another point about the deer herd. Years ago when the land was still heavily farmed, all the farmers went out of their way to kill coyotes all year long, which limited the number of natural deer predators. Now only a few active farms are left and the coyote population is back up because there's no coordination and cooperation between the current land owners to kill the coyotes.

[Nautitroller]

It all comes down to the property that your boots are on! Trail cameras do tend to prove that there are Giants in this state..... actually seeing them and killing them is a different game. NY bucks are wiser to human presence then other states mentioned IMO. Robs thread this year proved that some guys are seeing a "shooter" every other trip to the woods and others didn't see a single one all season. Me personally it took till November 29th b4 I put my eyes on one and I hunt my balls off for a opportunity at a mature animal. But mature animals arnt even the problem right now its the shear numbers of Whitetails thats the problem. Having to travel to another state to have the opportunity to hunt a healthy deer heard is not the answer here! Having the state pulling there head out of there a$$'s is the answer hands down.

Totally agreed! Well said

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[Kingfisher06]

Don't ever expect the state to solve a problem. Expect the state to offer solutions to the problems it creates. Don't expect these solutions to solve anything because that is not the racket they're in; expect more problems and more clumsy ineffectual solutions. Want a clean, ethical, properly managed environment that suits your needs, then own it. Can't own then lease. Can't own or lease enough to solve your problem then team up privately. E.g., can't afford to fish the clean, ethical, properly maintained private stretch on the Salmon River, then relinquish state control of the entire river and provide competition in a free market to lower the price. Individual interest and responsibility solves problems.

[Nautitroller]

Don't ever expect the state to solve a problem. Expect the state to offer solutions to the problems it creates. Don't expect these solutions to solve anything because that is not the racket they're in; expect more problems and more clumsy ineffectual solutions. Want a clean, ethical, properly managed environment that suits your needs, then own it. Can't own then lease. Can't own or lease enough to solve your problem then team up privately. E.g., can't afford to fish the clean, ethical, properly maintained private stretch on the Salmon River, then relinquish state control of the entire river and provide competition in a free market to lower the price. Individual interest and responsibility solves problems.

May we privatize our state government too ? Please!!

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[Kingfisher06]

May we privatize our state government too ? Please!!

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I am not an anarchist, and do believe we need a good referee, and the best referee's are the ones nobody ever has to talk or complain about because they are doing there small, but very important job so well. I don't think we need an army of armchair biologists soaking up taxes, but rather private folks more actively engaged in management per their own agendas.

[Nautitroller]

Lets not go to anarchy I agree but the system doesn't work unless you have your own land. The problem is deer age class. There are good populations of deer around NY not what it used to be ten to fifteen years ago but there are plenty of deer. I have friends that own property in areas that have great bucks, but they don't see them, only on camera. I'm Lucky enough to have a piece of land that i can choose what is killed and how I manage its carrying capacity. If I want to see bucks that are over 3.5 yrs old on my land one thing is mandatory, stay the heck outta there til its time to kill, Nov 1-15... If you get busted you have probably lost your chance unless he's really comfy holing up his doe on your land. Its each land owners right to shoot what they want I'll never tell someone that they should shoot a certain age class deer, it would be nice if more guys follow a bit of deer management but they do eat very well so I'll just keep working harder to shoot a three yr old or better. And I will keep complaining about our state government that doesn't do its "little job" representing our rights as land owners...

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[Gill-T]

 

 

"QDMA means small deer are spared and less tags filled means less deer shot." Hmm??? Not exactly.

 

   

 

 

 

I know what QDMA is.  My statement was from a PETA person's perspective.  They will see passing on young deer and not filling your tag as a good thing.

[Ryno23]

I live in the Southern Tier and there is more deer here than you can throw a stick it.

To be honest they need to be thinned out where I live. I drive home 30 mins from work and I can literally see 200 hundred plus deer in the fields in the summer. It's crazy the numbers we have.

I live around a lot of Amish and they do a good number on them in the summer too and still have crazy amounts running around.

Not to mention the bears and coyotes that get their far share of the fawns.

Edited March 14, 2016 by Ryno23

[RD9]

Ryno23, Yep I live on the Cattaragus and Chautauqua county line. People had a harder time this year but no shortage of deer here. Lots of pretty dedicated hunters and plenty of food. Lots of bucks of all sizes taken. Plenty of big mature bucks taken but I live in a prime location in NYS. I do have a close friend that moved to Kentucky and hunts a private farm whom grew up in WNY and said the hunting there is stupid easy from what he grew up doing.

[Chas0218]

I have been lucky enough where I hunt in 8F and neighboring properties seem to show some (I use that term loosely) restraint when killing bucks. I have killed a few 130"+ 10 point whitetails in NY but that is only because we have a 8 point rule on our property. If it doesn't have 8 points then it walks (I let the smaller 120" 8 points walk as well). Now in the southern zone on my buddy's property they shoot everything I mean everything. I have only saw one deer on camera that was bigger than a 6 point. My first year hunting on his property I killed a 120" 10 point, not a bad deer for the area but in the last 6 seasons I have seen maybe (2) 4 points. I say MAR is a must for trophy class deer.

 

On a side note, all of the deer I have taken in 8F that were 130" or bigger were 4.5 years old except my 161" 10 point that was 5.5 years old.

[Ryno23]

Ryno23, Yep I live on the Cattaragus and Chautauqua county line. People had a harder time this year but no shortage of deer here. Lots of pretty dedicated hunters and plenty of food. Lots of bucks of all sizes taken. Plenty of big mature bucks taken but I live in a prime location in NYS. I do have a close friend that moved to Kentucky and hunts a private farm whom grew up in WNY and said the hunting there is stupid easy from what he grew up doing.

I've been lucky in my life growing up in NW Indiana right on the tip of Lake Michigan. I could going hunting during the rut and literally see 5 to 10 nice adult bucks in one sitting. Pick of the litter pretty much where I hunted growing up. It wasn't unusual for my dad or I to shoot a doe that field dressed ard 175 lbs. every year. Deer are just bigger out there due to the land and amount of crops.

Now living in the Southern Tier I don't see as big as bucks or deer but still nice to go out in my woods and know I will see Deer and a chance at a decent buck. Yes, everybody where I live around me has the brown it's down attitude.

There is a TON of poaching around my area also, which I think does a number on the bigger bucks that hunters won't see that follow the rules. That is one of the biggest reasons I think I don't see the big big bucks is because they are taken down at night in the summer around me. I know guys like to be hush hush on that stuff I bet it's also one of reasons others don't either.

Just my two cents.