Otisco 3/12/16

[MeatHunter737]

Old man, I never tried a sit on top model.... I got a sit in model the ascend fs10 ..... I've been out at otisco and little Sodus Bay in white caps and never felt threatened.... let alone the over 3 ft tiger I stringered last spring on otisco, that was a bit of a challenge in the dark.... but I love my sit in model.

[Ivan]

Next time just shake that little 36"er off with pliers in the water and let it swim away instead of stringering it. [emoji6]

[justtracytrolling]

Meathunter is coming around! I think he still wants to 1 tiger to try on the table, and that isnt the end of the world as they dont reproduce, but hopefully we will get the limit to 40 and then its much less an issue....hard to catch a mature fish if we dont put the immature fish back...

[MeatHunter737]

Yea guys, that 3ft plus straightened out my stringer and lived to see another day... but I will also mention that since that happened I figured not only was it not meant to be, I have grown alot of respect for the species and otisco itself.... I'm at a place in life (turning 40 soon) that I may keep a northern from another body of water but the Tigers are sterile, and therefore will get a release by me.... I've grown quite a bit since last may primarily from reading opinions from this site.... with that said, I'm gonna kill some eyes in 2016 !!

[Ivan]

That's great!  Glad you are coming around.  Walleyes, perch, and crappies are the best eating anyway.

[RWhite]

I remember a topic on this page a couple years ago. People stated that there is little if any natural walleye reproduction on these lakes and it depended on the Dec to keep up on the stocking programs in order to keep the walleye population up. Whats the difference in getting mad if someone keeps and kills a sterile tiger vs a walleye in a fishery that can't sustain itself? Kind of the same thing?

[Ivan]

For me, it has little or nothing to do if the fish are sterile or not.  If they are sterile then obviously the population needs to be maintained through stocking.

 

The difference between muskies and walleyes are the population densities and the mentalities of the anglers targeting them.  Muskies are stocked or exist in densities much lower than walleye.  Muskie fisherman (people who actually target the species) fish for the enjoyment of the hunt/catch, not to eat them.  99% of muskie fisherman release their catches.

 

I'm not a walleye fisherman, but I'd venture to guess that most guys targeting walleyes keep the majority of what they catch to eat. I'm sure that's taken into account when stocking numbers are determined.

 

It's really a difference in philosophy between the two species and what's needed to properly manage them.  What we, as muskie fisherman, want to avoid is the killing of fish caught incidentally by anglers not targeting them. This gives us a better change to catch and release them again.  We also don't want to see small fish kept that aren't even adults...increased size limits can help there. A 36" muskie really is a small muskie.

 

If you want to catch fish to eat, target a species that can support the harvest because they have higher population densities.  Fish like panfish, walleyes, etc....not muskies.

[RWhite]

To me I release 95% of my fish and I could care less about what people do with them. We all pay for a license. However Atisco lake and Conesus Lake walleye do not reproduce naturally due to the Alewife eating the walleyes eggs. So the only way to sustain the walleye population is threw stocking just like tiger muskys in these lakes. So why isn't the catch and release mentality the same for the walleye as the tigers?

[Ivan]

"So why isn't the catch and release mentality the same for the walleye as the tigers?"   I think your question is for the walleye fisherman.

 

Don't forget... walleye population can sustain more harvest because there are more of them. Any muskie kept hurts more, because there are fewer of them.

[RWhite]

I actually catch 3 times as many tigers as walleye on conesus. Sometimes in the months of may and June its not uncommon for me to catch 5 or more tigers in a couple hours. But I'm sure that its the same on otisco. Especially during the dog days of summer.

[Ivan]

I've never fished Otisco, so I couldn't comment specifically on that lake.  I'll probably never make it there either, because of the drive time.  Too many places with better size potential that are the same distance or closer for me.  My comments are more generalized and not for one specific lake.  Maybe Justin will chime in...he fishes both walleyes and tigers on Otisco I think.

[muskiedreams]

I actually catch 3 times as many tigers as walleye on conesus. Sometimes in the months of may and June its not uncommon for me to catch 5 or more tigers in a couple hours.

Are you sure they are tigers and not pike? That would be a believable catch rate for pike in Conesus, but not tigers.

 

Walleye are tough to catch in there because of all the alewives but there are a lot of them in there. They should be in the Inlet in a week or two. I heard that the pike are in the Inlet now. Most of the successful walleye anglers there troll the dropoffs at night very slow (less than 1.5 mph) with stickbaits in May and June. Casting with an erratic retrieve can work when the alewives come in to the shallows at night. It would be interesting to see if Justin could apply his techniques there.

[RWhite]

Yes they are tigers.

[Ivan]

So are you just saying that the walleye stocking/fishing could be improved and you wish more people released them?

Or are you suggesting that the release of tigers, or tigers in general, have something to do with poor walleye fishing?

Not being argumentative, i'm just curious what your angle is. Are you disappointed catching the tigers?

[RWhite]

I'm saying that the walleye in them lakes are in the same boat as the tigers. Meaning only sustainable for fishing because of the efforts of stocking just like the tigers. Tigers can't reproduce and walleye natural reproduction gets cut off because of the alewife eating the young walleye. So the question is why do the tiger musky guys get mad when someone kills a tiger when the tiger guys kill the walleye and its OK. It's a double standard if you understand the eco system of the lake. Which most tiger musky guys do. I'm not arguing or trying to. Just curious to people's thoughts.

[315angler]

Obviously in addition to what Ivan is saying re: pop density.

People catch walleyes to eat more than anything, catching big ones are fun but main focus is for food. Tigers are caught for fun more than anything (although not bad to eat either), so bigger the fish bigger the fun hence more release

[muskiedreams]

Sort of like comparing lake trout and salmon or steelhead.

 

Walleye filet out better too.

 

I think walleye are easier and cheaper to raise in a hatchery.

[justtracytrolling]

I dont mind if someone keeps his or her legal fish to eat or mount. Its not my place to say...i advocate letting them grow...i dont keep the walleye at 18 either...the states term for the fishery is put grow take...i wanna emphasize the grow part as there a limited number to take. 315 makes a great distinction between sport fish and table fare. The DEC manages the tigers as a trophy fishery especially considering there arent many places 40 inch plus tigers are regularly caught as they dont grow to pure musky proportions. To most walleye arent a sport fish though on otisco its plenty sporting!

[Ivan]

Yeah. I guess it's just how the majority of fisherman view the fish. Walleye are thought of as good eating fish by the majority of people, and muskies are released by most people that target them.

Maybe those lakes need something different though. I release my incidentally caught walleye every year. I just dont fish the lakes you are talking about. It takes time to change people's ways. Muskie fisherman didnt always release their fish. Ive heard plenty of stories from older guys in the sport about when they used to keep all their muskies. Then at some point in the 70s and 80s they started releasing some if their fish because they knew it was going to be the future of the sport.

Edited March 19, 2016 by Ivan

[HybridHunter]

On a side note, the walleye I caught depicted in the original post of this thread was caught in the south pond and was headed toward the inlet, and was full of eggs. I'm sure there is some natural reproduction, even though the alewives take out many of the eggs.

[muskiedreams]

Oneida Lake probably has a lot of natural walleye.

[Tigerhunter]

I think there are a few different things to look at regarding the question of keeping tigers versus keeping walleye.

The mindset/goals of fishing for muskie/tigers versus walleye has been discussed and I totally agree that Muskie/tigers are typically targeted as C&R trophies whereas walleyes are typically fished for table fare. I don't know many, if any, people that fish walleye to release them.

Another thing I think needs to be looked at in this discussion is the number of fishable populations. I can count on one hand the bodies of water in New York State where you can fish and actually have the opportunity to catch a respectable tiger. Now take a look at lakes with fishable walleye populations.....many many more options.

I release 99.9% of the fish I catch regardless of species. I've personally only kept one trout and that is because it was poorly hooked and after multiple release attempts it was a floater. I have released many respectable walleye at otisco and plan to continue to do so.

[justtracytrolling]

On a side note, the walleye I caught depicted in the original post of this thread was caught in the south pond and was headed toward the inlet, and was full of eggs. I'm sure there is some natural reproduction, even though the alewives take out many of the eggs.

If you ask the DEC the fry are all wiped out...there is some that make it and ive caught little walleye in years where no stocking occured.

[HybridHunter]

That's to bad.