Trolling speed with out a probe

[munks]

Any idea how fast I should be going on my gps to achieve a near perfect speed at my downrigger ball I been out 3 times so far and can't seem to catch anything and I think it's speed related I have every spoon,flasher/fly you would want so it has to be speed

Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United

[GAMBLER]

Without a probe, you can't get it perfect. Current changes with direction of troll and the wind. 

[rolmops]

It used to be a matter of listening to the sound that the rigger cables make. And registering the speed and direction of the boat when a fish was caught. The theory being: If you hear the right sound and go exactly in the same direction and at the same speed as when you caught that last fish,you are doing good.

[mmdrevo]

We do not have a probe either. So far whats worked is varying speed from 1.8-2.0 mph on the gps. I have also been paying attention to the amount of blowback on the ball when we catch fish. After that we have been trying to recreate what worked and so far it has been producing. No expert here but thats what has worked for us so far. 

[Smoke-N-Finn]

1.8-2 is maybe 1.5 at ball on my Depth raider depending on current. The other day I had to be going 3.2-3.5 to get my baits 2.0-2.3

Sent from my XT1254 using Lake Ontario United mobile app

[TrophySeeker]

2.6 to 3.0 on GPS SOG for kings. Slower for browns and lakers.

Sent from my SM-G935V using Lake Ontario United mobile app

[King Slammin]

2.5 gps speed is a good starting point. I'll speed it up a bit or slow it down until the fish tell me how fast they want the baits. I have the drag set light on my divers so I hear the slightest change in speed. As long as my rods are bent correctly, and they are straight behind the boat, I'm good.

[fisherdude]

you can try a thumper rod down the shute , take a 3 way swivel 1bl weight  with a dodger and lure . watch the tip of rod when it starts thumping your speed will be in the ball park . 

Edited July 19, 2016 by fisherdude

[munks]

Thanks I'm new to this trolling for salmon so any and all tips are much appreciated I'm starting to get frustrated with it to be honest

Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United

[munks]

Is it faster with the current or slower and vise versa

Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United

[Xxx]

there is a angle of the rigger cable chart that gets you in the ballpark. Years ago the thumper theory was golden, and the tone of the rigger cables was used a lot like mentioned above. With all the new tech stuff the old ways before depth finder days and even the old paper graphs the tuned ear was golden, and those guys hammered the Kings up to 40#ers were brought over the side, all these older ways have gone to the wayside, it's a shame but that's the way it goes.

[Xxx]

Is it faster with the current or slower and vise versa

Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United

It depends if your going with the currant or with, against the currant your rigger ball will show more of a outward slant and the pitch of the cable will be higher, slow up, going with the currant will have a way less hum to the cable, and your rigger wire will be at a 90* or just a slight angle. I would go with the post above and start at 2.5mph in calm water and get a idea of the angle of the cable, then then try to duplicate that angle out in the lake, if nothing after a while speed up at 1/2mph till something fires off then circle around and try to do the same thing, going back the same way will be a whole differant ball game, after some time if it keeps producing then try going back the opposite way and keep the rigger cable at that same angle and remember that rigger wire tone!! Good luck.

[reeldilemma33]

Current has been brutal but was getting better last week it was a half mile an hour faster down below then surface but it changes daily

[reeldilemma33]

On a west troll...

[TyeeTanic]

Anywhere from about 1.8 mph to 3.6 mph.

Currents can easily be 1 mph in any direction.

 

And as you go along, it changes, so you might need to do 2 mph in one area, and then 2.6 mph in another area.

 

Without downspeed, you can only start at 2.5 mph, and then varie your speed up, then down travelling the same direction, to see if that generates hits. Then repeat, repeat, repeat (in the same direction).

[garrymny]

ah, yeah, pretty tough as I have discovered too, with no probe. But we keep trying, and we catch some once in a while, but so far no 25 pounders!

[garrymny]

I also wonder if the speed is to make the lure have the correct action, or is it the preference of the fish? It seems that you could use different lures, some that have action at higher speeds and some that have action at lower speeds, and you could always have a lure that is generating some action-movement, as the speed down at depth varies. 

[reeldilemma33]

Action triggers bites so def onto something here...

[Jeremy Goodison]

Before I had a probe I fished with four dipsy off my pontoon boat. Watching the bend in the dipsy gets you really close. Once a fish hit we looked at gps speed to duplicate

Sent from my XT1254 using Lake Ontario United mobile app

[Chowdaire]

I have a small boat running 3 divers and that's exactly how I try to do it. Get that rod bend just right. SOG might be down under 2 or over 3 but as long as that diver is pulling the way it should I figure my down speed is in the ballpark.

Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United

[munks]

How much bend should my diver rods have I'm running dipsy number 1's

Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United

[phil2]

Last time I was out I also have no probe. I was trolling east at 2.4 with bags out turned west 1.9 and ball and dipseys were cranking. Couldn't figure it out cable was at 50 deg never had a hit going west. Turn east 3.6 put bags out back to 2.4 fish on!

[Sk8man]

One of the things that strikes me recently is how much we Americans especially these days look for the instant, simple answer to issues or problems, or new situations that may either be complicated or relative in nature rather than experimenting ourselves to find the best answer for our own situation.  I mean absolutely no disrespect as I'm sure the above question is genuinely offered but it is a good illustration of what I am talking about.  There are so many variables to consider combined with unknown information that it is impossible to answer the question accurately and the answer is totally relative to that situation.  The bend in the rod depends on the characteristics of the rod itself such as the length, composition, and how soft or stiff the tip is for example and the boat speed, currents present, the type of setup, (e.g. wire vs. mono, flasher vs spinney vs. spoon or stick, size of dipsey and on and on. Basically, with a diver rod you want some stiffness in it but the length is related to personal preference mainly and the exact way you intend to set up your stuff. You may have different sized rods for each side of the boat or if running multiple dipseys different lengths on a given side to assist in line separation. I think the most valuable piece of info on any of my rods is what is happening at the rod tip. If you have experience with your setups or even specific spoons you begin to recognize familiar characteristics in the way the tip moves that can tell you when it is running the way you wish or too slow or too fast or if the spoon is spinning, or the attractor is revolving or swaying too fast etc.

Edited July 27, 2016 by Sk8man

[Chowdaire]

I always use the same rod in the same position as the gauge so there is consistency. Then see what it looks like when I start getting hits and duplicate it.

As Sk8man said, they all will look different depending on a bunch of variables so you have to dial it in for what you're running. The angle you're looking at the rod makes a big difference too which is why I always use the same position on the boat.

It seems you could also test the action next to the boat and then duplicate that bend when it's at depth but that's just a guess. Im not saying it works.

I'm still very new to this salmon stuff so I don't have too much to say on this site but, man, what an incredible resource it is. Amazing what the guys on here will share and how much it shortens the learning curve.

I still think one of the most rewarding times to be fishing though is when you're going out and working to figure something new out before you have all the fancy tools. Really enjoying it.

Maybe next year I'll get riggers and a probe and have a whole new bunch of things to learn.

Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United

[Sk8man]

Good points Chowdaire.