sawbellies

[justtracytrolling]

Les,

I've wanted to get my own bait on Otisco but don't for that exact reason. I buy it certified or more commonly snag it 1 at time and use it 1 at a time so I have no bait on the boat without a receipt period!

[Sk8man]

I hear you Justin. Better to be safe than sorry as far as I'm concerned as you can't count on someone "believing you" but I I think like much of the law the onus would be on the person to prove it did come from there not the officer proving you didn't

[justtracytrolling]

You are correct les! I have a working relationship with the ECO and would like to think I wouldn't have a problem when following the law to the letter. I think I'll bring it up next time I see him...I'm not a big bait fisherman anymore, but it is effective and some of my guests really do better with bait!

[muskiedreams]

Muskie you have it right from your last post but I think what you were saying previously about the bait that Mariam was selling isn't certified because it couldn't be and therefore it couldn't be transported raised all of the hub bub. I'm glad you referenced the regs in your last post and have it correct now. No harm no foul.

I would be curious to know where the certified alewives are from. If they are being raised in a pond or if somehow, each batch netted from the lake is certified. It seems like it would be expensive the certify every batch netted from the lake and there may be a delay in getting the lab results. I don't know if the whole lake could be certified to satisfy the requirement. If they are raised in a pond, it would only have to be certified once per year.

[frontrowjoe20]

My tackle shop tells me that 1 dealer is from Lake Seneca or cayuga and the other is Lake hopatcog in NJ. I've fished Hopatcog and they have large nets/baskets that float around the lake and capture the alewife. There are signs on them to keep boaters away. Not sure of their process to get bait certified but these places wholesale to all the tackle shops in my area. 

[muskiedreams]

I agree with Justtracy...

 

Muskie - maybe I'm misunderstanding your post, but it's completely legal to transport certified Alewives (i.e Familiar Bite products) in NY if I'm not mistaken? Am I missing something?

 

Please clarify - thanks,

 

Chris

Familiar Bite is frozen (not live) and reportedly tested and certified to be free of the approx 6 diseases NY requires bait be tested for. I didn't see anything about the origin and or any process used to insure no disease but there must be an acceptable process. It would be interesting to know but maybe it is a trade secret. Since they are certified, it would be legal to transport them and can probably be used anywhere in the state, including lakes that prohibit the use of live alewives.

 

Live alewives are different. First of all they are only allowed to be used for bait in a certain list of lakes in the state (see regulations). Second, they would have to be certified (by the required method of certification) to be free of all the specific diseases as required by the state for live bait. Bait retailers must give a receipt to the purchaser. If the bait is certified, it must be stated on the receipt. These baitfish can be transported over land for ten days. After that they are considered uncertified. Alewives caught in any of the lakes on the list where their use is allowed, can only be used on the lake of origin and cannot be transported from that lake (with the exception of the transportation corridors around Lakes Ontario and Erie and a section of the Hudson River). A bait retailer on one of those lakes is allowed to net and sell them for use on the lake. The receipt must give the lake of origin and it must have a warning that it is illegal to transport that bait over land by motor vehicle (except in the corridors mentioned above).

 

I would be interested to know if the DEC has condoned any whole lake certification. If not, the dealer would have to have a certification method and/or procedure that is accepted by the state for each batch netted from the lake if they want to sell it as certified.

Edited July 22, 2016 by muskiedreams

[muskiedreams]

My tackle shop tells me that 1 dealer is from Lake Seneca or cayuga and the other is Lake hopatcog in NJ. I've fished Hopatcog and they have large nets/baskets that float around the lake and capture the alewife. There are signs on them to keep boaters away. Not sure of their process to get bait certified but these places wholesale to all the tackle shops in my area. 

Are you in New Jersey? We are just talking about what is done in New York. Please clarify if you are in NJ. They may not be as strictly regulated there. Also it may be different along the Atlantic shore.

[muskiedreams]

I am in southern NY and as you can see on the regulations I can transport and use them anywhere in the Hudson valley. Every tackle shop in the area (10-12) all carry certified alewife. The dealer is in the finger lakes region and sells to the 6-7 counties around me. So as long as you are on a body of water on that list and your bait is certified you are fine. I have been stopped many times by DEP and DEC and never a problem as long as I have a receipt.

You are talking about bait that is caught in the Hudson and allowed to be sold, used and transported within the Hudson Valley Corridor. It cannot be transported or sold outside that corridor. That is not the same as certified bait which is certified to be free of a list of diseases based on lab tests.

[muskiedreams]

Obviously, these regulations are difficult to enforce and there may be those who want to violate them in order to make a buck without regard, concern and/or understanding for any consequences to our fisheries. There are sound reasons considered by professionals who made recommendations to our State Legislators to enact these regulations. It is the duty of all of us to follow them in order to help preserve the fisheries that we love. Some of you may not agree with these regulations but if you look at the reasons, I think it makes a lot of sense.

[Frogger]

Good question Muskie, when the sampling was first required, they would sample the batch" the pool population " with several fish. Not sure now how they do it. It was if I remember at the time $900-$1000 a sample. Hense the 3.50 -$$$ upcharge from years past. But it's vague in my memory bank. All I know is you better have a slip if you have bait. Or be prepared to show where when and how you got em.

[Troutlaw]

A lot of shops around the finger lakes sell them

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[justtracytrolling]

I'm not sure how the bait gets certified but alewives can be bought certified in many locations. They are expensive enough to have made a trip to a lab! Lol. Steve is 100% right that it's a very serious topic. I can't tell you how many times I've called in cast netters getting bait illegally on Otisco....the ecos are too busy to do anything apparently.

[Troutlaw]

The sampling/ testing is the same as frogged explained, and yes it is expensive... You should only use bait that is verified... We have enough problems now with our fishery without adding nor

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[hermit]

I would be curious to know where the certified alewives are from. If they are being raised in a pond or if somehow, each batch netted from the lake is certified. It seems like it would be expensive the certify every batch netted from the lake and there may be a delay in getting the lab results. I don't know if the whole lake could be certified to satisfy the requirement. If they are raised in a pond, it would only have to be certified once per year.

I know of one bait wholesaler that nets off of Taughannock State Park on Cayuga Lake at night, and they sell to bait shops all around the area. So at least some of them are coming from Cayuga, and are tested before being sold to the bait shops as certified.

Les I just make sure I have my sabiki rig with me, sometimes I'll catch alewives from shore and then use them right after in the boat. I could leave the sabiki in the vehicle but instead bring it with me so I have something to point to if I'm ever questioned... I think if you have a means of catching them with you it wouldn't be a problem, I hope anyway!

Edited July 22, 2016 by hermit

[Sk8man]

Lets hope so Alec   Good idea too.

[10lykedf]

Can you explain what a sabiki rig is? thank you

Edited July 22, 2016 by 10lykedf

[frontrowjoe20]

Muskiedreams:

This bait is caught or raised in Cayuga and nj by professional bait fish wholesale companies. They then sell this bait to tackle shops all over NY as certified bait. I fish the NY city reservoirs who have very strict rules and have never had an issue and 90% of fisherman use them. You can transport this bait because it is bought certified bait and not hand caught. The 10 day rule on the receipt is what they check for

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[hermit]

Can you explain what a sabiki rig is? thank you

It's basically a perch rig but with little flies and what the package says I don't know why... a string of little lures on little leaders attached to a mainline, you put a relatively heavy (1 oz for me usually) weight on the end. Mine is made by P-Line and is hook size 10.

I use it for getting alewives at night, I suppose you could do it during the day too but I never really tried, I usually do it from shore around here on Cayuga and that means night. Find a thick cloud and jig it sometimes they bite and sometimes you end up snagging them.