ECOLOGY DISRUPTION/IS ONTARIO NEXT?

[skipper19]

http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=767291

I was in Cabelas Richfield, Wi. shopping and spoke at length about fishing Lake Michigan with one of the outfitters there. He mentioned that fishing Michigan was pretty good but for how long?...His reference to Lake Huron and the resulting collapse of the fishery there was astonishing, so I did a little reseach and found a few articles on the subject...see above link..Needless to say I was shocked to hear the number of charter's going bankrupt in short order. It is hard to believe that a once excellent fishery is now totally GONE in Lake Huron in a matter of just a few years It came as a surprise to the DNR and their scientists...it seems it all slipped in the back door and never was relized the potential destruction of a huge body of water in a blink of an eye...

We as fishermen on the big O can attest to the lesser amounts of bait showing up on the screen and the smaller the salmon have become over the most recent years. All you need to do is look at the archives of the derby winners and see the declining weights each and every year. There are no more 40lb salmon winning these derbys anymore. The invasive species are ruining the lake already in my opinion.. I don't want to say the sky is falling but maybe we should take account of all things in general and hope there comes a solution before it is GONE like in Huron....So when you see the DEC/DNR people doing a fishing survey in the tribs near your port...please don't avoid talking to them and make your concerns known, they are there for the research on the fish population and monitor the effects of exotic species and disease on our gamefish. Our governments need to be involved here in the USA and Canada to find a solution or this industry that brings billions of $ each year to the economy of this vast area might be gone faster than you can say SCAT!

Mark

[W.W.IV.]

skipper, I don't know why your so surprised , don't you remember the the middle nineties when the bait numbers were way down and they cut stocking in half to save the bait population. I chartered out of Sodus at the time and it got so bad you couldn't buy a solmon. I don't think the bait schools are big enough to feed all the small fish you all are complaining about and the big ones that are out there. The DEC. doesn't know how much reproduction there getting from the Salmon river or any other place theres natural reproduction. The netpen stocking is working very well so there's a bigger return from them. Maybe it's good there was a egg shortage last fall.Maybe It would be better to cut back the stocking just a little now and see where it goes now instead of waiting till we have disaster. Hey if the browns and laker's get to liking the gobie's it might take the pressure off the mooneyes, who knows maybe the salmon are feeding on them also. I'm not predict the demise of lake O. Have a nice day and don't forget you rain coat.

[skipper19]

Yes, I remember and I'm not surprised by what happened in Huron. It just came recently so very fast that I don't think people relize it's gone...I mean a whole colapse... no plankton, no alewife, no salmon...NONE...AND IT'S NOT THE SALMON THAT ATE THEM ALL, nor the fisherman taking them all, and it's not likely to come back. Sure they cut back the stocking program but that was only a small improvement in the bait population. The salmon were introduced back in 1960 as a top of the food chain solution to the nasty alewife dieoffs, 1980's saw a boon in a new top of the food chain, and that was us! I recall back in the 80's and early nineties 300 or more boats trolling in sight of each other at the mouth of the Salmon river...not to mention the thousands of snaggers lining the banks all the way up to Altmar. There still was a lot of salmon during those two decades even with the high catch ratio, every day in the late season, coming into the ladders of the hatchery. THEN, a fast decline in the bait and consequently a decline in salmon in the mid nineties....WHY?...zebra mussels cleaning the plankton out that the alewife eats..so they died mostly of starvation before the salmon could eat them. The Zebras are a shallow water dweller and affected the near coastal waters effectively cleaning the water in the shallower column where the photoplankton blooms. The alewife now have a competition for food greater than themselves...In Huron however there has been a proliferation of a new mussel..a deep dweller..unnoticed for the most part doing more damage to the deeper water columns.. The Quagga teams with the Zebra to more effectively clean out all the plankton and there fore creates the total colapse of the food chain necessary to support the salmon...In a nutshell, cutting back the salmon stocking or rearing will not bring the bait back from a situation like that..it is simply a matter of the invasive mussels taking the food away from the alewife.

My observation lately about the changes that are going on with the salmon habits in Ontario are reminiscent of more hunting than fishing. Has anyone ever noticed that the bite is only good for about a two hour spell early in the morning and then disapates rapidly with no bait and no marks suddenly. It's my guess that the salmon are in more shallow in low light looking for food and it's not alewife...it's maybe perch or bass or some other opportunity until the sun comes up and drives them off deeper. It used to be that you could bet on the salmon and the bait being out there all the time in the same place day after day. Now it seems the salmon are more nomadic in their feeding habits...and thats all they do is look for food during their life so they will go where it is nessesary to find a meal.

I also remember getting on top of a bait school for a hundred feet or more back a few years but now if you got a bait ball the lenght of your boat.. thats a good one.

Just remember the alewife was here from ballast dumpers FIRST and then for thirty years the salmon were feasting on them and not putting a huge pressure on them but then came the Zebras and now the Quaggas and between all three (salmon being the least) the forage base is getting smaller at an alarming rate in my observation..and I've been fishing the lake religiously since 1986 as my school of hard knocks. Maybe I'm wrong and I hope there isn't something bad going to happen, but it already has in Lake Huron...and thats sad and for real..

Mark

[Gill-T]

Maybe, the D.E.C. should be spending money, not on restoring Lakers but bringing back the Lake Whitefish.....Kings can feed on those and they seem to do better in cleaner water.

[Tim Bromund]

The DEC doesn't spend nickel one on lake trout. That's a federal native species restoration effort by the US Fish and Wildlife Service.

Tim

[CBish]

Good topic for the winter when more time can be spent on writing about solutions.

IMO Who in their right mind would put 100% into a charter business on a lake that is all put and take at the whim of the NY legislature. Really how important is LO fishing in the big NY picture?

LO or Health Care?

LO or Roads?

LO or Schools?

LO or welfare?

LO or your assemblyman's paycheck?

LO or Broad based tax cuts?

LO or State Police?

LO or ....................................................?

Building a real business based on LO Fishing is alot like a story I heard about a man who built his house on the sand.

I don't know about the business around where you fish, but here at Pt Breeze we are seeing marinas cater more toward the saliors and powerboaters than I ever saw in the last 20 years. Bobbers and snelled hooks are where spoons used to be in some bait shops. It is not smart to be a charter captain, but I have never claimed to be smart the future is like setting lines with your 8 best baits and knowing that you have done all that you can do the rest is up to the fish and the powers that be.

CC

[skipper19]

The state of NY should cater to Lake Ontario....it's the one of the biggest hand that feeds them from millions of dollars spent here from locals and out of state money as well....and thats money that would otherwise be spent in other states...remember the tax base from sale of everything related to sport fishing in the state...and that is pretty important to all the legislature and the politicians pockets in Albany...But that's another subject and way too deep to go into from gas, lodge, food, tackle, licence, and even the tickets that the DEC writes so many times during the fall run. It all feeds the pig in Albany and they better NOT FORGET IT :!: ..WHAT ABOUT THE LOTTERY MILLIONS EVERY WEEK! ok ok ok now I'm off the beaten path...sorry..I just wanted to bring attention to a fishery that has gone bye bye... not that it should be any concern to charter business alone...It's my concern and yours cause we like it so much..the fishing that is...and the solution should not wait for another collapse.

Mark

[skipper19]

Exactly right jolly, we need to talk to the legislature, Canadian federal, Ontario provincial, US federal, New York State and any other border states that are reading this and have some concern for the fisheries here in ALL the Graet Lakes....and remind them that someday there will be a huge deficit in the tax base for the functionality of the governments..what ever that may be...but it should remain hgh on thier list of important issues to maintain recreation and the attraction of money to the area...lobbyists need to bring our point closer to a solution to the preservation of the sport...I'm sure they understand all the other consequences of the plugging of water intakes and other bad issues of the invasives...but I'm not so sure they get the whole larger picture...Maybe The collapse that just happened recently in Huron should be brought to highlght and the resultant losses of tax support to the state of Michigan..Lord knows they already are broke in that state, but I wonder if they realize why in the big picture...they think it is due in a greater sense to the auto industry woes, but I bet they haven't assessed the damage done to the local economy by the collapse in Huron....

The only thing Ontario has going for it is the relative lack of shallow embayments where the mussels thrive the best....unlike Huron that has many bays and shallow water structure, for the mollusks to thrive..

Quaggas and Zebra mussels are progressing everywhere unfortunately, even out to Lake Havasau, in Nevada and California, some have been found in the Colorado river system and that's just a minute list of the infestation...just remember to clean your boat and equipment real good before going to other lakes and water systems...that's how they got into Lake Simcoe, Ontario..Use bleach solution in the bilge and other water vessels in the boat...and don't forget the trailer....It all helps to keep the spread to a minimum...It's a disease that needs a cure that's for sure.

Mark

[Iceman]

Every time I have an encounter with or see the Coast Guard, I get irritated. Where were they when all this contaminated ballast water was allowed to come into our fresh water???? They spend countless hours bothering us, but the big ships come & go as they please, no one checks the treatment of the ballast water, or makes any effort to keep the bas---ds out of our water. It is much easier to monkey with the lake & river boaters, and it seems that the coasties enjoy it. Just another clear picture of how our government has gone wrong!!!!! The revolution is coming!!!