Alewives

[LongLine]

Alewives

Thinking about alewife’s – knowing what happened to Huron, Stocking cessation in Michigan & our own stocking reduction of Kings – got me curious about the worldwide population of these fish.  I found this article in the Federal Register which I thought was interesting.  If you have a couple of hours to kill, you may want to read through it.  

https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2013/08/12/2013-19380/endangered-and-threatened-wildlife-and-plants-endangered-species-act-listing-determination-for

Basically, it’s about saltwater alewife & river herring from the Northern part of Florida all the way up into Canada.  5 or 6 years ago, NOAA was petitioned to put both species on the Endangered Species List.  They say neither saltwater species qualifies for endangered or threatened status however most states have banned or restricted catching them.  Ocean and Lake Species (andronomus ..sp..and landlocked) are now physiologically different.

Towards the end, in their conclusion, they say:

 

“While neither species is currently endangered or threatened, both species are at low abundance compared to historical levels, and monitoring both species is warranted.  We agree with the SRT that there are significant data deficiencies for both species, and there is uncertainty associated with available data.”

They further say they’ll revisit the subject in 3-5 years, although earlier in the article they say it generally takes 18 years to obtain proof for their determination of endangered/threatened.  That should be interesting.

 

I find it interesting that it’s not just a Great Lake issue but that throughout its native range, the alewife is struggling. Also the requirements for getting listed are “wow”! 

I can’t help but thinking:  One factor that all fishing literature talks about is that pollution affects fishing quality and yes I do agree with that, however back in the 60’s, Ontario was quite polluted,  (Remember mercury, merex, dioxin, PCBs, and a whole bunch of others.) and there was a tremendous alewife population.  Well, Ontario’s retention time is estimated at 6-7 years. (i.e. it takes 6-7 years to replace all the water in the lake) and I can’t help but wonder if the anti-phosphorous legislation, in just about all the states, had an undesirable side effect.  For Ontario, especially in combination with the invasive mussels that take the other “good stuff” out of the lake.

They do talk at length about climate change, but a few years back, that was quite the bandwagon to climb on. (I’m not saying that they’re wrong about it.)

Oh, well, just thoughts.

Tom B.

(LongLine)

[HB2]

Fully agree w/ the phosphorus thing. Phosphates in fertilizers & laundry detergents way back  found its way into the lake and exploded the bottom of the food chain. Legislation & Zebras cleaned out the lake .

[AnglingAddict]

Time to start dumping a bag of fertilizer every trip into Lake O.....obviously I'm joking...but there is data I have seen which shows markedly declining levels of phosphates in the lake as well as other nutrients. 

Edited January 18, 2017 by AnglingAddict

[TileMan Dan]

Been saying for years that Lake O's water is too clean.  Seeing to bottom and being able to count the rocks in 20 fow is not a good thing from fishing stand point.

[Lucky13]

You are from New Jersey, some of us up here like our drinking water clean!

[HB2]

Id rather choke on the water  and catch more fish

[Yankee Troller]

5 hours ago, HB2 said:

Id rather choke on the water  and catch more fish

 

Wegmans sells water cheap! I agree! LOL

[ontherise]

I'm a Poland springs feller myself.


Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United

[Gill-T]

23 hours ago, AnglingAddict said:

Time to start dumping a bag of fertilizer every trip into Lake O.....obviously I'm joking...but there is data I have seen which shows markedly declining levels of phosphates in the lake as well as other nutrients. 

 

I will pledge to eat more Mighty Taco to help things downstream.  

 

 

[HB2]

Chick  Fillet  soon!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

 

Read many years ago shortly after the Zebra invasion  that Ohio was considering dumping raw sewage into lake erie  for the bottom of the food chain to eat. Was probably knee jerk and don;t think anything came of it. 

[Gill-T]

Raw sewage does dump into the lake......everytime antiquated storm sewers overflow.  Ohio is trying to limit phosphorus levels further with legislation passed in 2015.  They had green water coming ashore on Erie with boil-water restrictions recently.  Phosphorus levels have been stable in Lake Ontario since early 90's.  Problem is exotics.  You can have all the phosphorus you want but if the water gets filtered it won't grow baitfish. 

[LongLine]

Reportedly, fishing's pretty good on the North shore & look at all the issues they've had with overflows in the last 3-4 yrs...Toronto, etc.  If memory serves me right...the biggest trawl of alewives came off the North shore...something like 40,000 in one netting.   In fact about 4-5 years ago there was a major dairy farm spill up on the east end of the lake...something like 40-50-60 tons of cow crap in a holding pond let loose into a trib.

 

hmmmm.....

 

Tom B.

(LongLine)

[rolmops]

1 hour ago, Gill-T said:

 

I will pledge to eat more Mighty Taco to help things downstream.  

 

 

Now that will create serious air pollution and you might be responsible for increased global warming

[Xxx]

2 hours ago, LongLine said:

Reportedly, fishing's pretty good on the North shore & look at all the issues they've had with overflows in the last 3-4 yrs...Toronto, etc.  If memory serves me right...the biggest trawl of alewives came off the North shore...something like 40,000 in one netting.   In fact about 4-5 years ago there was a major dairy farm spill up on the east end of the lake...something like 40-50-60 tons of cow crap in a holding pond let loose into a trib.

 

hmmmm.....

 

Tom B.

(LongLine)

The trib was the Black River and it F'ed up everything for years, it's just starting to get back to the way it was. That spill killed so many fish that the fish com. were running around in boats scooping up dead fish. Matter of fact you couldn't catch a red eye, that's sad. We were just getting the eyes back in the river.

[justtracytrolling]

I sure hope we never see another spill of that magnitude again. The spill was estimated at 1 fourth of that from the Exxon Valdez! My family has a place in the Adirondacks about 10 miles or so from Marks dairy that lost the 3 million gallons of liquid manure. The ammonia depleted oxygen levels and literally killed every single fish. Before August 10 2005 the section upstream from lowville was a fantastic float trip in a canoe. The owner of a local restaurant, memories, right on the river just a mile from the spill tells stories of cleaning up dead fish from the banks for quite some time. I gave up on it after the spill and started camping along other Adirondack waters. Last time I fished it was 2011 and there was still seemingly no walleye or pike, and any fish was noteworthy. I have to get back and float it again though I know it still hasn't recovered completely. The DEC said the mature pike were 20 years old! I sure miss it and the Adirondacks! Hard to make time for it now though!

Justin Okrepki
NYSDEC licensed guide #7324
http://www.otiscolakeguideservice.com/
(607)-349-1750

[TileMan Dan]

You are from New Jersey, some of us up here like our drinking water clean!

I like clean drinking water also. My post was geared towards why huys say fishing was better years ago


Sent from my iPhone using Lake Ontario United

[Xxx]

11 hours ago, justtracytrolling said:

I sure hope we never see another spill of that magnitude again. The spill was estimated at 1 fourth of that from the Exxon Valdez! My family has a place in the Adirondacks about 10 miles or so from Marks dairy that lost the 3 million gallons of liquid manure. The ammonia depleted oxygen levels and literally killed every single fish. Before August 10 2005 the section upstream from lowville was a fantastic float trip in a canoe. The owner of a local restaurant, memories, right on the river just a mile from the spill tells stories of cleaning up dead fish from the banks for quite some time. I gave up on it after the spill and started camping along other Adirondack waters. Last time I fished it was 2011 and there was still seemingly no walleye or pike, and any fish was noteworthy. I have to get back and float it again though I know it still hasn't recovered completely. The DEC said the mature pike were 20 years old! I sure miss it and the Adirondacks! Hard to make time for it now though!

Justin Okrepki
NYSDEC licensed guide #7324
http://www.otiscolakeguideservice.com/
(607)-349-1750
 

Justin is spot on with this, before the spill everytime I got a chance to fish above the dam in Dexter, up to the riffles in Brownville I did, it was the best spot I ever fished!! There was this one place I knew that was home to a mighty pike, this guy lived right outside of a beaver dam, and was the most intelligent fish I ever fished for. This fish has tore me off, broke poles buy swimming so fast towards the boat you had no time to get the tip over the bow or stern, and of course swimming into the beaver dam and wrapping your line around branches that you have to cut the line or he tore himself off. Also if you knew what you were doing you could get a limit of eyes everytime up that River. After the spill that big pike no longer taunts me, the eyes are coming back but very slow, every once in a while you'll catch a 18" eye, and the smallies  are well, small smallies, the Black River Bay, has never and will never be the same as I knew it when that area is what got me hooked on the walleye fever I still have today. It's a crying shame this happened as it could have been avoided. Litterly it's called Shyt Happens. 

[scobar]

that happened very quickly with really no way to stop it, maybe we learned something or not. Reason for the NOT is Asian carp on on the doorstep  

[LongLine]

Pap - I agree: a large concentration of ammonia is very bad for aquatic life.  But I think the question is about the phosphors/ates.   There certainly has to be a balance there.  I'm sure we don't want a glacial lake as nothing will live in that.   It may be interesting to research the Lake Guardian's water chemical research with the best fishing areas.  (Someone told me that Erie has dead spots, yet  many guys brag about the Walleye fishing there.)  Will the fishing even be better in the Black River a few years after it's been "cleaned out?"  I don't know but I certainly hope so.

 

Tom B.

(LongLine)

[jimski2]

The clear water is attributed to the mussels in the lake consuming the photo plankton. The results are the zoo plankton are not there to feed the forage fish and fry of all the fish. Last summer my treble hooks were full of mussels from the bottom in seventy five feet of water. These extreme abundance of mussels is changing the fish production capability of our lakes. I can see my minnows on the bottom in fifty five feet of water while I am fishing for perch. But some of the perch has engorged with mussels they have fed on. Adding more fertilizer is not the answer.

[MikeyP]

On 1/18/2017 at 8:08 PM, rolmops said:

Now that will create serious air pollution and you might be responsible for increased global warming

You still spewing "false news". LMAO!