Hey all you motor heads!!!

[Xxx]

Hey all you motor heads!!!

2 years ago I bought a old boat for the out drive, come to find out that the motor was rebuilt, never saw water, meaning it was never used on a lake. The guy I bought the boat from was the grandfather of the owner. His grandson works for a company that builds test hulls for the drag boats. The boat I bought was a BAHA with what I assumed was a 350cid, I even posted it for sale, I was offered $400.00 in a pm. Needless to say that never happened. In a hurry to get my boat up and running I really didn't pay much attention to it. Yesterday for some reason I was looking at the valve covers they were factory mercruiser black but they looked like no other cover I've seen before, there was a plate that ran from one end to the other and a rectangular box in the middle and that had like steel wool in it. So it appeared like there was some sort of oil deflector. I have this motor on a stand so I rolled it out so I could see better. I then took notice it had a duel point distributor in it made in Germany and teamed up with a Bosh distributor, 2 condensers on the coil and of course the distributor. Moving along its a factory equipment four barrel intake with a inch spacer plate sits a 650cfm Holley carb. Now this is unusual, the carb has an electric choke but Is a double feed double pump, with a mechanical secondary's!! Then I look on the front of the heads and the heads had 2 humps with a like wide I after the 2 humps, so that means I think they are fuelly heads. Now this gets even better I find the block ID#'s 3970010. I go on to GM block ID#'s and it says 68-71  302/350 horse. Now it's a GM so we know the GM 302 was put in early vetts, camaro's and a few Yanko nova's. I checked the stroke and by cylinder probe it measures 3" so that's the proof, everthing is strait up but the Bosh coil and distributor. GM rated the 302 at under 300hp for insurance purposes. But a 7000rpm it pushed 350hp and the 350hp is what GM posted on their motors. NOW my question is did BAHA ever put one of these motors in their boats. This boat in its time was the cream of the crop, thru hull exhaust all Crome pipes. What's your take on this beast. Oh the lifters were solid also!! I might have a gold mine on my hands to the right person, on the other hand I have a bunch of good stuff, that gear heads would love to have. I bet if the guy reads this that offered me $400.00, would at least offered me $550.00 at the time I probably would have let it go!!!

[lakebound88]

Worth more than that if it's newly rebuilt...

Making your stories, Reel Stories, since 2011!!

[lakebound88]

That carb alone is 450 minimum

Making your stories, Reel Stories, since 2011!!

[Xxx]

Thanks for the interest!!  I saw some of these motors go for $10.000 not even running. This is a cherry engine. I'm not putting the cart before the horse.  Stuff like this doesn't happen to me. now I'm going to look at BAHA site to see if this motor was even a option. But if it was a special order would that be known.

[L&M]

If I had to guess it's an engine an individual put together to put in it. Bring some pictures to the

ELOSTA show with you tomorrow, I'd like to see it. 

[devoknevo]

I don't mean to burst your bubble Pap, but that's a common 350 block made from 69-79. They put them in everything from trucks to vette's. that carb may be worth $100 used.

[L&M]

As Devo said above with that casting number it is most likely a 350 block. The only way to tell for sure what it started out as, is by the stamped numbers on the machined boss on the block, just ahead of the #2 cylnd.. Heads might very well be 202's tho by what you say the markings are.

 

3970010....302.....69....4...Z-28 Camaro
3970010....327.....69....2...Trucks and industrial
3970010....350...69-80...2 or 4

[lost a lure]

I know it's cherry, but is it rare?

[skipper19]

Pap, you sure it has a 3 inch stroke? The block hasn't been decked, over 30 thousands, not a high compression dome piston, it could be 302, if it was apart and you could tell. Crank has a casting number if I am correct it has a letter designation on it maybe a DZ?
350 has a 3.48 stroke, but those other factors are an influence on an external measure of stroke. Maybe it came in the needle nose cigarette style speedster that Baja made? It's very rare engine but no way to tell externally for certain by measure. Hope it is the unicorn for ya!

cent frum my notso smartphone

[Albemarle16]

This engine was only produced for the 67, 68 and 69 Camaro.

 

The 69 302 had 4 bolt mains all other were 2 bolt main engines.

 

The engine block is most likely a 327.....that what was produced in 1969

[Albemarle16]

I estimate the value around $1000

 

If this was all original with Cross Ram Manifold / Dual Carbs......then you really have something of great value

[Xxx]

But I checked the stroke and its 3 inches not 3 1/2 or 3.48 I have a tool with a little light/camera the Pistons appear 1/2 domed with 2 relief cuts in them, not little 1/2 cuts like in flat tops the heads are only milled on one end for accessories. The way it's set up only the port side has the holes. I will have to check into this more, later on, I've got 5" of snow to deal with and the motor is in my father in laws garage on a stand. I was wiring up a pulling tractor he had built, I sent him for terminals for battery ends, that's when I decided to poke around this motor. I have to check oil and fill up with gas as I have to leave at 6:am tomorrow to get to the show. One thing a little unnerving is the block castings#'s according to GM they had lots of these numbers, according to GM this block was used as a 350 4 bolt main used in big irrigation pumps out west and in trucks with a turbo 400 tranny or used in cars with a 4speed tranny. I guess I just have to pull it apart. I'm still stumped by the bosh duel point dist. The blue colored bosh coil, I see a lot on small engine tractor pullers that have to use points distributors and oe points. 

[skipper19]

Don't take it all apart Pap! Just the pan. Find casting numbers. The 302 has a specific number on the crank. The 350 block is used on many CID engines. The 302 is essentially a destroked 327...same 350 block. The crank will have the absolute info embossed. As I mentioned before the DZ designated identity, but it might be a specific casting code number. Ignition parts can be interchangeable and it's matter of choice to aftermarket a dual point setup in many forms. Bosch or Mallory, etc. I have Mallory YL dual point on most of my hot rods. The double pump holley electric choke is not specifically part of that engine or era. It is low torque, high rpm, not generally a great marine combo. Definitely find the crank casting# and put it on here. If it was in a Z28 it might have the DZ in the block code I think?

cent frum my notso smartphone

[Xxx]

Thank you guys for all the info and stuff. Skipper I will spin the motor over and pull the pan, oh another interesting point of this motor is the dipstick is below the header like manifolds on this engine. My Sea Ray has a little indent in the exhauste manifold where the stick is above the manifold? I pulled it out and it not cut off the line and the checkered part are on the stick. One thing for sure its a early style motor. I've been around the dirt track racing scene since I was a kid. My uncle and cousins have taken the 320 modified and the 358 modified track championships, at Mokatech speed way which is closed for years now. Joe my cousin won the 358 mod. Class at 5 mile point raceway, I don't know for sure at Big Diamond speed way, so this is pretty cool find!!

[skipper19]

Thank you guys for all the info and stuff. Skipper I will spin the motor over and pull the pan, oh another interesting point of this motor is the dipstick is below the header like manifolds on this engine. My Sea Ray has a little indent in the exhauste manifold where the stick is above the manifold? I pulled it out and it not cut off the line and the checkered part are on the stick. One thing for sure its a early style motor. I've been around the dirt track racing scene since I was a kid. My uncle and cousins have taken the 320 modified and the 358 modified track championships, at Mokatech speed way which is closed for years now. Joe my cousin won the 358 mod. Class at 5 mile point raceway, I don't know for sure at Big Diamond speed way, so this is pretty cool find!!

I hope you have the real thing Pap! Trouble is you could have a cloned 302 which could have been the result of marriage of 283 and 327. The 283 crank would be the source of the lower CID. BUT, the 283 crank is not the same material as the real thing.

cent frum my notso smartphone

[Xxx]

Yea I'm thinking along the same line, especially when Lauri said about the 327, I kinda forgot about the 4"bore of the 327, my best buddy in high school has a SS Camaro with a 327 in it I had a Pontiac Firebird 69 had a 400 ram air, but the poncho motor floated valves at 4500rpm so I put solids and the push rod support in and I ripped the lifter gallery right out, they had the lifter gallery like webbed to the block, where Chevy had them made fast to the block. So I pulled the 400 out and we slid a 383 stroker in!! That bad boy turned heads, I was the closest person to kick my brothers ass, he had a 66 chevelle 396 built by Burns and Yost, balanced and blueprinted. I can't honestly say he turned that big block 8 grand, but I still have all his trophies from Maple Grove drag Strip. Great talking to you all about this!! Pap

[skipper19]

When I was 16 years old, I was at the end of the muscle car Era and fit right into the the 20 something year olds getting rid of their gas guzzling fast cars and getting family man grocery getters. I also had a plethora of those cars at my fingertips due to my dad's IH dealership. A lot of those guys were trading for the new Scout models that transition from street burners to the sporty 4×4 that had family capacity and some appeal of ruggedness.
So first I had a 69 Plymouth Roadrunner in 1972, 440 magnum 4 speed, Vitamin C and black. Paid 1600.00 for it. For me it was bad news, and scary fast. Too loud, and rough riding. Lots of noise tickets and improper start (tire slipping on letting out the competition clutch) tickets No good for city work, great for girls, until the ride started. Then they wanted out mostly!
Sold it 1600 dollars....today would have been 20 times that. Kid I sold it to burned the hood from carb backfire due to the huge overlap of the race cam. Then cracked it up on a barrier later.
1600 and added a few hundred more and fell into a 70 Chevelle SS convertible with 396 4 speed. All stock white and black stripes. Muncie shifter was trouble. Locked all the time in 2nd gear. Had to carry crow bar for it and get filthy.
Decided I liked the new Scout 2 and it had its own source of get up and go with the big 345 V8. Ordered a new one when I was a senior in high school. Came decked out with everything and a 4 speed. Posi on both ends and had fun with 4x4 clubs in college. Decided to make it my new hot rod. International yeah right?...well it came out pretty good after a few teardowns. We went to sand drags, hill climbs, and ice races, mud drags.. had a blast! The 345 was a real sleeper. With the same firing order as a Chevy V8..18436572.. it sounded like a big block. Lots of second looks by tech inspectors at the races with a few test runs. Swore I was running experimental class in a modified class. Funny to see the odd looks as they saw the old truck engine in there. International valve covers still on it instead of the imagined chevy. The list of mods wasn't very long on parts, but the heads were worked over extensive by Dons porting service in Albany. That engine really came to life and still runs today. The body of the old 74 Scout is very rough, but I still have it and all the body parts ready for my time and ambition to come together and get it out again.
Wish I had all the cars from back in that Era of the mid sixties to early 70's! Last fast car I really liked was a new 1979 Z28. Last year of the 350 lm1 and a close ratio 4 speed. The car was pretty quick even though it was low compression and hampered by smog junk. Fun to drive with the right tires on it. I ran Good Year Eagles on it and it was like it was on rails. Ah, but remenisc thoughts for now, hot rods traded places with large diesels and 18 tires now. However, there still remains 3 project vehicles in the garage. One is a Ford 1 ton 4x4 waiting for its 351 to come out and grow into a 408 windsor.
Another is a 1968 Buick Riviera GS. Needs a little elbow grease, and the 430 rebuilt. That will be a nice ride!
And of course the old Scout! My first brand new vehicle owned! I'm still a motor head for the old stuff. The new stuff just amazes me with output, but that's about it. I'm not much of a computer nerd for tweaking power curve programs...give me wrenches and busted knuckles!

cent frum my notso smartphone