Trolling from a Kayak - w/NO down riggers

[haitb]

Ok I have a few questions!! Sport fishing is seem to become my main interest lately. I have recently bought a new kayak and are focusing on trout fishing in the adirondacks this may. I know that this is a LO site but I think that from what I have seen, you guys are the ones to learn from!!

OK so here goes! I have a kayak, with a fish finder (cuda 242 portable), and 2 scotty rod holders, and a tackle box full of lures! I just bought, what feels like the entire line, several Rapalas ranges from #5-#9 in mainly trout colors, i.e. brook, brown , and rainbow. I am alos interested in trolling spoons and flies but do not know how to really rig each of these setups. Can anyone break these options down for me? Can I troll flies with flashers w/out down riggers? I know I need to have slow speeds.. Now I am looking for #test, and a good way to catch a few browns and lakers in the adirondack small lakes. How would you try this?

I know that every place is different but thought that you guys might be able to help. Thanks in advance!! I have been reading a lot of pmjasper's questions about his trip in may to sodus bay. I am new to trout fishing!!! I have learned quickly that a trout fisherman is much more educated than the typical basser!

[pmjasper]

Funny you mentioned my name as I used to do quite a lot of kayak fishing a few years back. In fact, I even used to troll wire off of my kayak for lakers. As far as lures go, there are two type of trout fishing that I did from kayaks....fishing for large, open water species and fishing for smaller stocked fish in small lakes and ponds. For larger species I like trolling Storm Baby Thundersticks and Deep Baby Thundersticks. Depending on the water depth you can also troll weighted spoons but floating diving lures are much easier from a kayak. Now if I was fishing smaller lakes and ponds where the fish average a few pounds, with an occasional lunker, I would troll smaller spoons such as an Acme Fiord spoon or Kastmaster as well as Cotton Cordell's Wee Shads, Rapala floating minnows and husky jerks along with Small rebel minnows. These smaller baits seem to match what the trout prefer in the smaller ponds and lakes. I like 4 to 6 lb test clear mono when trolling or casting in the smaller lakes and ponds and move up to 8 or 10 for larger areas or larger fish. Check out www.kayakfishingstuff.com. It has a lot of good information regarding kayak fishing and guys that are very willing to help. Good luck and be safe.

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[Big Dave]

I would have to put one on each foot. How ever I like to row and have a 14' row boat that I troll with sometimes. What I use is lures like the wallydiver or deep shad rap. Cast them out to each side leave the bail open and row some and click the bail over. That gets them back aways and start crusing around. Get some nice browns that way. The trouble is going slow enough. Watch the rod tips and you can see the lure action. You can tell if you pick up weeds or if a fish hits

[Dance the Tides]

I fish from kayaks often. Here is a trick that I learned that fills the bill for a couple of functions. I use a retractable dog leash attached to a cleat. Get the 25 foot version made of plastic. The leash has a clip on the end that you can attach a sash weight or mini downrigger ball. If the leash holds a 100 lb dog, it will handle the weight. They serve two functions, one as an anchor and one as a poor man's downrigger. I put a blacks release above the clip to clip in a rubber band. That way I can run a spoon of the ball and a flat line too if I am so inclined. This is great for fishing 10-15 feet down(spring and fall salmon and laker depth on Lake George, Schroon , Tupper etc) The leash will not lift the weight, but will retrieve the slack as you lift the weight. I use mostly Mooselook Wobblers on the down line and trolling streamer on top. They have the advantage of fewer hook points to get caught up in your gear. Of course I have three rod holders on my yaks. The streamers and Mooselooks run great at comfortable paddle speed.

If you get the all plastic leashes, they don't corrode, even in the salt. In the anchor mode, they have held in a 5 knot current on the Cape.

Enjoy!

Paul

PS Trolling streamers don't need flashers, they catch fish all alone. Fish307.com is the place to find these flies and lures.

[haitb]

Hey guys, thanks for the tips! I am planning a trip to the lake placid area in may and would really love to catch a brown or laker as I have never caught either.

I just bought the new yak, and I think I have outfitted it quite well. I bought 2 scotty rod holders and a 3lb anchor. As well and a Fish finder, cart, lifevest, spray skirt, paddle, ect... and plenty more tackle to try and take a stab at this. I have been looking into "dive reels" as my anchor line reel, but now with Dance the Tides's idea, I may buy one or two extras to create the down rigger options. If I were to run this option of a down rigger, what sized weights would you use?

I am not fimilar with DR's but, I beleive that the concept is just a large weight dropped to a pre-determined depth(altered with observations on the fish finder) and then a lineclip fixed to the weight with my line with just a spoon or other lure pinched in the clip. Is this right? I am not understanding the rubberband part?

The yak is deffinately not staying a lite weight setup!! It seems like the way to go would be to buy one more rod holder this way I can run 1 to each side and one center top water?

Dance the Tides - You have run flies without flashers before? I was think about taking large size spoons and removing the hooks and creating a mini dodger/flasher effect with a fly 12-18 inches behind. Any thoughts? I am thinking resistance of these 8"-11" flashers on my light weight setups!! I beleive that I am going to run 8-10lb mono. Any objections??

God I can't weight for this trip!!!!

Dance the Tides - Where abouts you from? I grew up not far from cobleskill area!

Sorry guys if this seems elementary to you! I have been trying to read as much as I can on the topic of trolling but the lingo has been killing me on these forums. And all the people at bass pro here in baltimore, just look at me weird when I ask them if they have dodgers/Flashers or Trolls. They just tell me that I "need to go north to find that stuff."

Thanks again for the tips! will be open to more comments if ya wanna leave 'em!

Brian

[pmjasper]

I used to fish dodgers and flies off of the kayak on wire line. I used Jensen 8" dodgers with no problems, however, I did find it much easier to use two combos on either side of the kayak to balance out the resistence from the wire line and weight, not the dodger. Sep's fishing tackle makes mini dodgers and other ultralite trolling gear that would work well in your situation.

As far as downriggers and weights, I did not feel comfortable in deploying larger weights from the kayak. It is a balancing game and it only takes one lean this way or that way to end up in the drink. Not too much of a problem in the summer but could be deadly in early spring with cold water temps. Up here in NJ we have a one or two people die each year falling into fridged waters and succumbing to hyopthermia. Balance out your kayak on either side and you should be fine.

In addition, I found it easier to control wire line outfits than downriggers, as if the depth increased I simply let out more line. If the depth decreased, it was easy to reel up some wire and still make a paddle stroke. No having to adjust the downrigger weight and the line out from the rod and reel. If you so choose, some companies make small portable downriggers that will readily attach to rod holder mounts. A 3 to 4 lb ball is all that should be needed from a kayak. Unless fishing deep open water, I preferred to use deep diving plugs, spoons or the wire line gear.

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[Dance the Tides]

haitb,

1 The downrigger should be no more that 5 lb. or it will tend to pull. It may pull anyway.

2. Trolling streamers are very effective without flashers. I am not talking about the Flies like Attomik, G fly, Howie, etc. These are traditional trolling streamers tied on single or tandem hooks. They are deadly when fished right and they were developed for Landlocked Salmon in New England and the Adirondacks. http://www.fish307.com/index.asp?PageAc ... ategory=87

They work best when there is a "streamer chop", or when pumped by the rod or the paddle hand. Just hold the line in one hand or clip it to the paddle.

3 If you want to use a flasher, consider a Lake Clear Wobbler. They are smallish and tear drop shaped. They are especially deadly with a crawler 12 inches back. They are very effective for rainbows and brookies.

4. The rubber band release works by half hitching a rubber band around a line or multiple twists, then clip the loop or loops into a blacks release. or even an alligator clip.

This can be a lot of stuff for a kayak, so KISS when possible(as in Keep It Simple Stup###). I suggest that you browse around on some of the tackle sites or the one I listed above.

Paul

[BlueDaksi]

I fish from kayaks often. Here is a trick that I learned that fills the bill for a couple of functions. I use a retractable dog leash attached to a cleat. Get the 25 foot version made of plastic. The leash has a clip on the end that you can attach a sash weight or mini downrigger ball. If the leash holds a 100 lb dog, it will handle the weight. They serve two functions, one as an anchor and one as a poor man's downrigger. I put a blacks release above the clip to clip in a rubber band. That way I can run a spoon of the ball and a flat line too if I am so inclined. This is great for fishing 10-15 feet down(spring and fall salmon and laker depth on Lake George, Schroon , Tupper etc) The leash will not lift the weight, but will retrieve the slack as you lift the weight. I use mostly Mooselook Wobblers on the down line and trolling streamer on top. They have the advantage of fewer hook points to get caught up in your gear. Of course I have three rod holders on my yaks. The streamers and Mooselooks run great at comfortable paddle speed.

If you get the all plastic leashes, they don't corrode, even in the salt. In the anchor mode, they have held in a 5 knot current on the Cape.

Enjoy!

Paul

PS Trolling streamers don't need flashers, they catch fish all alone. Fish307.com is the place to find these flies and lures.

I know that this post is old, but I was doing a search and had a couple of comments. First, I thought that I was unique in using a retractable dog leash for an anchor line on my kayak and I had never thought about using it as a downrigger. Thanks for the awesome tip about how to troll for lakers in a kayak! I'll definitely give it a try this spring.

[perch predator]

On cayuga in the late winter, early spring guys have great luck trolling streamers on fly rods. They use a fast sinking fly line, and white and grey streamers. They catch browns and LL's by staying between shore and the sailboat boueys. They take a couple of strokes, glide, then rock a couple of times for a jigging action. This same pattern has to work on spring browns on lake O

[GAMBLER]

Try a copper rig off the back of the kayak. You can get one that is marked every 50' from Atommik and will not need downriggers. Do some searching on this site about copper rigs to learn more.

[Angler Innovations Inc]

You may want to check out my site. My LongLiner was designed to fish trophy trout with a small lure and fly with conventional gear at depth without a downrigger. We now use it for salmon fishing. It might be a solution for you.

Rip some lips!

Steve

http://www.anglerinnovations.com