If you wanted catch small (12 inch) salmon in Sept how would you do it?

[schreckstoff]

Let’s hypothetically say you were trying to catch shaker kings in Lake Ontario in September, where would you troll? What depth or temperature? Offshore or nearshore? West, east? What baits would you use?

 

By shaker, I mean the 6” - 12” fish that were either stocked or came out of the streams this spring.  I realize no one targets them,  but has anyone witnessed a pattern where they frequently run into these sized King’s in fall?

 

Thanks in advance for any ideas,

bw

[Capt Vince Pierleoni]

Most do everything in their power to avoid these precious fish--especially after the deep stocking cuts. Sometimes its location but other times they can be avoided with presentation changes. When present they are extremely aggressive, because as you know all too well--its survival of the fittest and Winter is coming. What most of us would call "Shakers" would actually be 1.5 yr olds by fall, and anywhere from 16--22" in length. What you are describing is actually THIS past Springs plants or fingerling hatch. They can be large enough to eat alewives by late Summer but will often suck down the invasive fleas.

Edited August 15, 2019 by Capt Vince Pierleoni

[schreckstoff]

Ah, ok wrong use of shaker. We are wondering where, if ever, folksget those smaller ones? Do those have a name? 

 

We are reviewing habitat and methods other people use to catch that size in the fall. In the pacific they  mostly mega trawls that Can sweep surface down to 60’ with one trawl.

[Gill-T]

If you want to avoid other species as "bycatch", I would suggest December offshore in the top 40'.  The second place would be July off the drop on the Niagara bar with nets set at the thermocline.  The third would be near the elbow in the fence on the canadian line offshore.  This third location would work in September with nets set at the thermocline.  If you want numbers, at night year 1 salmon will line up nose to tail at 50' off the Niagara Bar.  Weird phenomenon with the 50' depth but it may represent the depth they sleep and are neutrally buoyant in their inactivity.  The Huron tagging study by Bergstedt also spoke about kings sleeping at 50'.   

Edited August 15, 2019 by Gill-T

[Capt Vince Pierleoni]

I will agree with Gill T, the top 50 is where those tiny ones are you are interested in. He and I were together in January and found skippers up there. It was our belief the larger alewives went deep already- taking most of the larger Salmon with them. We did not sacrifice any of them in the name of science but the bait that was up in the 41 degree water looked to be yoy alewife or emerald shiners. The fleas are very important to the age fish you are talking about.


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[garrymny]

I'm still trying to figure out if you are targeting them, or avoiding them. ???

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[Lucky13]

Considering the size and type of boat Shrekstoff employs, I would guess he is targeting them for more of his probing investigations into the complexities of the LO Salmonid and Bait continuum!!!

 

Take me out fishing and set the goal as a box full of adult kings.  You are sure to get nothing bigger than shakers, and probably lose half the tackle in the process! 

[schreckstoff]

Sorry, there were some details missing from my previous question.

 

Lake Ontario scientists are discussing ways we might index juvenile (age0) salmon.  This is all just in the discussion phase.  We have some field obervations but few of the historic surveys sample in ways we would expect to catch them.  We're reading literature from the west coast surveys and Lake Michigan.  We realize anglers try NOT to catch them, but we figured someone might have some opinions or ideas where they commonly encounter these small kings (12 inches or so) in late August, September, November. We are wondering what depths and what lake regions you have observed these small Kings.

 

Feel free to PM me if you don't feel like posting.  Thanks to Capt V, GillT for some great ideas. 

Thanks in advance,

bw

[whaler1]

based on the profile pic the shakers could be doomed!

[bandrus1]

Why not tag some pen raised fish and track them