We will be challenged to keep trolling

[Gill-T]

An expensive sport will invariably become out of reach in cost for the average working man in the near future IMO. 
 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cnbc.com/amp/2021/11/22/gm-takes-a-stake-in-electric-boating-start-up-pure-watercraft.html

 

https://www.purewatercraft.com/?utm_source=Google&utm_medium=CPC_Link&utm_campaign=Outboard&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI49b8_qG29AIVjf6zCh24KAinEAEYASAAEgIxXPD_BwE

Edited November 26, 2021 by Gill-T

[sszoldra]

I'm not so sure of that. The 50hp is 16K, which is pretty competitive 

[Gill-T]

Ya, but I am picturing everything. Batteries are over 100 lbs each. To do it right you are probably looking at two batteries which takes you to $25,000 and over 200 bs of battery weight. You will need a charging system as you won’t be pulling 100 lb batteries out to charge up after each trip. I keep my boat on a trailer in a marina. How am I going to charge my batteries?  Buy a house with a barn?  How much will that cost?  Living in the country would be ideal but my commute times and costs will go up. When you start to think about logistics, it becomes overwhelming. 

[nysrx01]

If gas keeps going up this will be cheaper in the long run. LOL. Plus no maintenance. 
the only issue I see is how any hours  it may or may not  last. 

[rolmops]

Gill, when the electric boats become more popular, you will see plenty of charging stations in the marinas.

Granted, that fossil fueled engine will be grand fathered in for many years ,we will also see the electric outboard take over. The change over from 2 stroke to 4 stroke was amazingly fast, mostly because of the convenience of never having to worry about mixing gas. I think that the convenience of never having to winterize, will make electric outboards wildly popular and once the battery technology matures we will never look back.

By the way. It is very easy to strap a generator on the back of your pick up and charge your boat batteries while you are cleaning up at the end of the day.

Edited November 26, 2021 by rolmops

[HB2]

How is all the gas a boat that is capable to safely  fish/navigate the great lakes going to translate into electric?  My 45# trolling motor drains a good size battery at full in about 2 hrs max .

  

Look at all the cars on the road rush hour and multiply that across the country . 

We already have rolling blackouts in some parts of the country at peak times . 

What happens when America ( if its still called that by then ) gets home at 430 and we all plug our cars in ? 

 

All sounds good on paper . But I'm sure it will all be good . 

 

[GAMBLER]

2 hours ago, HB2 said:

How is all the gas a boat that is capable to safely  fish/navigate the great lakes going to translate into electric?  My 45# trolling motor drains a good size battery at full in about 2 hrs max .

  

Look at all the cars on the road rush hour and multiply that across the country . 

We already have rolling blackouts in some parts of the country at peak times . 

What happens when America ( if its still called that by then ) gets home at 430 and we all plug our cars in ? 

 

All sounds good on paper . But I'm sure it will all be good . 

 

Too many people have no clue how bad the electrical grid is.  We get paid thousands of dollars at work to load shed during peak times in the summer and winter so NYC doesn't have rolling blackouts.  How bad is it going to be when every household has 2 cars plugged in tax it even further?

[finsntins]

11 hours ago, HB2 said:

How is all the gas a boat that is capable to safely  fish/navigate the great lakes going to translate into electric?  My 45# trolling motor drains a good size battery at full in about 2 hrs max .

  

Look at all the cars on the road rush hour and multiply that across the country . 

We already have rolling blackouts in some parts of the country at peak times . 

What happens when America ( if its still called that by then ) gets home at 430 and we all plug our cars in ? 

 

All sounds good on paper . But I'm sure it will all be good . 

 

in the liberal mind,all it has to do is sound good on paper,who cares what the actual reality is.

[chinook35]

I get that we need to reduce our carbon footprint. My concern is the way our government is going about it. Great that we are being mandated to go electric on everything. Where does the electricity come from. Fossil fueled power plants. Great idea to buy a generator to charge your batteries. What does the generator use for fuel. Gas/ diesel.   solar and wind power are making great inroads , but at what cost ? Each wind turbine requires approximately 800 gallons of lubricant, oil. Solar panels are springing up all over NY state. Still have no idea of the cost of maintenance on these panels and no one seems to talk about it   Nuclear is out of the question. We have seen the price of an accident and it’s way too high. We have defeated the off shore wind farms on Lake O , so far   But I’m afraid we are going to lose the battle and the war. 

[rolmops]

2 hours ago, chinook35 said:

I get that we need to reduce our carbon footprint. My concern is the way our government is going about it. Great that we are being mandated to go electric on everything. Where does the electricity come from. Fossil fueled power plants. Great idea to buy a generator to charge your batteries. What does the generator use for fuel. Gas/ diesel.   solar and wind power are making great inroads , but at what cost ? Each wind turbine requires approximately 800 gallons of lubricant, oil. Solar panels are springing up all over NY state. Still have no idea of the cost of maintenance on these panels and no one seems to talk about it   Nuclear is out of the question. We have seen the price of an accident and it’s way too high. We have defeated the off shore wind farms on Lake O , so far   But I’m afraid we are going to lose the battle and the war. 

Big changes are about to happen in energy production. There are the truck sized nuclear fission reactors being developed in Britain as we speak. These will help decentralize electricity production. More interesting is the beginning of construction of nuclear fusion power plants. Future prediction has it that within 10 years these fusion plants will start producing nuclear energy without the radio active by products that are so frightful. Just like fossil fuel was the energy miracle of 140 years ago, fusion energy will be the next great step forward.

For now we are experiencing the often painful change of one energy source to another less harmful form of energy production.

Windmills and solar panels do less damage  to the environment than fossil fuels, but they really are only a bridge helping us go to the next stage of energy production.

It would not amaze me at all to see vehicles with small fusion power plants traveling our roads and lakes.

Edited November 27, 2021 by rolmops

[GAMBLER]

If you look into how horrible the process is for the environment for making and disposing of solar panels, wind mills and Lithium, the carbon footprint is not much different from fossil fuels.  Its another portion of Green energy that is not talked.  They want you to buy into green energy so don't tell you that negative aspects about it.  

[rolmops]

16 hours ago, GAMBLER said:

If you look into how horrible the process is for the environment for making and disposing of solar panels, wind mills and Lithium, the carbon footprint is not much different from fossil fuels.  Its another portion of Green energy that is not talked.  They want you to buy into green energy so don't tell you that negative aspects about it.  

For now, the alternatives are all limping along. But to imply that wind and solar are just as damaging as fossil fuels is not right. Do not ignore the mountain tops that are blown off in the Appalachians to get to coal veins.How about the rampant black lung disease that comes with mining? How about the water wells in Pennsylvania that were poisoned because of fracking? Or now in Alberta,Canada where the forests are ripped off the surface in 40 mile long stretches to get to the tar sands for oil (the dirtiest oil you fill find on the planet) That oil is the reason for the Key Stone pipe line which transports it to refineries in the southern USA where it is processed and exported to third countries. Or how about the nr.5 pipeline that goes under the straights of Mackinac in Lake Superior? It was build in 1953 with a life expectancy of fifty years but still transports oil today.  If/when that one springs a big leak you no longer need to worry about getting your boat ready for spring. (so far it has had over thirty minor leaks)

Finding the right alternatives is hard but we simply have to bite the bullet or very soon, we will be just another extinct species.

Do not ignore the simple fact that the fossil fuel industry is spending huge amounts of money vilifying any and all alternatives that endanger their profit margins, just like the tobacco industry, the asbestos and the lead industry before them.

Edited November 28, 2021 by rolmops

[dry net]

If you believe that "someone" isn't making huge profits from tax payer dollars on green energy your not looking hard enough. Take away the free money and the do gooders go away.

 

 

[rolmops]

27 minutes ago, dry net said:

If you believe that "someone" isn't making huge profits from tax payer dollars on green energy your not looking hard enough. Take away the free money and the do gooders go away.

 

 

I do not doubt that statement, this is a capitalist country after all. Although I do believe believe that green energy is being developed by investment capital with the intent to make a profit and do good at the same time. But I do compare it to the annual 20 billion US dollars that goes to the mostly highly profitable fossil fuel industry. This is not counting the corn/gas/alcohol farm subsidies.

How much corn alcohol do you think will be produced without subsidies? And how much cheaper do you think that food will be if all that corn currently being turned into gasohol will be used to feed live stock and people?

Edited November 28, 2021 by rolmops

[spoonfed-1]

18 hours ago, GAMBLER said:

If you look into how horrible the process is for the environment for making and disposing of solar panels, wind mills and Lithium, the carbon footprint is not much different from fossil fuels.  Its another portion of Green energy that is not talked.  They want you to buy into green energy so don't tell you that negative aspects about it.  

 Both environmental damages to the world as well as economical damages to our country are the dirty little secrets that the people who are pushing the "green new deal" and their media don't seem to want to talk about. As demand for the minerals required to process these electric vehicles rises so does the environmental damage. Many of these mines are located in China as well as other countries where environmental standards are nonexistent. While I'm all for green energy we are not ready as far as technology goes and without the cooperation from the worlds biggest polluters, the measures we are being forced to take will have very little impact in the overall environmental picture.

 

Edited November 28, 2021 by spoonfed-1

[rolmops]

Spoonfed,

Pollution and climate change hits us all. liberal, democrat, republican and conservative alike. going forward is a lot more effective working together to face a shared danger instead of fighting each other because of politically blown up ,but usually small differences. Believe me ,you in Springfield Mass or I in Rochester,NY will both get shafted equally hard if we do not work together. There is a saying in the  IDF where I served. It goes like this: If you fight divided you hang alone ,but if you fight together you win the war.

[spoonfed-1]

7 minutes ago, rolmops said:

Spoonfed,

Pollution and climate change hits us all. liberal, democrat, republican and conservative alike. going forward is a lot more effective working together to face a shared danger instead of fighting each other because of politically blown up ,but usually small differences. Believe me ,you in Springfield Mass or I in Rochester,NY will both get shafted equally hard if we do not work together. There is a saying in the  IDF where I served. It goes like this: If you fight divided you hang alone ,but if you fight together you win the war.

I stated my opinion based on reality and fact. Don't know (or care) why you want to make it political.

Edited November 28, 2021 by spoonfed-1

[dry net]

30 minutes ago, rolmops said:

I do not doubt that statement, this is a capitalist country after all. Although I do believe believe that green energy is being developed by investment capital with the intent to make a profit and do good at the same time. But I do compare it to the annual 20 billion US dollars that goes to the mostly highly profitable fossil fuel industry. This is not counting the corn/gas/alcohol farm subsidies.

How much corn alcohol do you think will be produced without subsidies? And how much cheaper do you think that food will be if all that corn currently being turned into gasohol will be used to feed live stock and people?

Enron

[rolmops]

1 minute ago, dry net said:

Enron

Enron Is the prime example of thievery and robbing of mostly Californian customers and employees. They used any excuse to rip us all off.

But they were a middleman not a producer of either green or fossil energy

[rolmops]

10 minutes ago, spoonfed-1 said:

I stated my opinion based on reality and fact. Don't know or care why you have to make it political.

Sorry, I tried to make sure that the problem is non political.

[MCF]

Automakers want to move to full electric by 2030 or 2035, that is going from around 2% of all sales to 100%.   I read the articles about taking an electric car across country now and the related issues.  There were electric cars produced 100 years ago, before the internal combustion engine took the market.

 

In my mind and being a car nut, the new F150 Lightning electric appears on the streets in 2022.  An electric model of the most popular vehicle sales wise year end and year out.   That to me has the potential of being a game changer.   When the auto was first invented, there were a lot of companies trying for that market.   There are more than a handful now trying to grasp the electric market.  We will see how things unfold because the issue still is the batteries how much range, how to dispose etc.   Read also the news clippings about containing a car fire in an electric car-thousands of gallons of water.

 

We are headed in an electric direction, I just don't see clarity on the pathway yet.        

[fcboats]

The key point that has already been stated is that the electrical infrastructure is insufficient to support this.  There are always threats of brownouts in the summer when AC units overpower the grid.  We all know what the additional load from a home charger will impose on the system.

 

Second question is what additional tax will be imposed not only to support this overhaul, but also will be transferred from the taxes imposed on gasoline for road maintenance?  And that will be placed on every citizen, whether they like it or not.

 

[rolmops]

If there is anything at all ,that I believe in . It is the creativeness of bureaucracy to invent new taxes to hit Jo Shmo just so it hurts a little but without killing the goose that lays the golden eggs.

On the other hand, think about all the gasoline tax that you will not have to pay anymore.

[rolmops]

40 minutes ago, MCF said:

Automakers want to move to full electric by 2030 or 2035, that is going from around 2% of all sales to 100%.   I read the articles about taking an electric car across country now and the related issues.  There were electric cars produced 100 years ago, before the internal combustion engine took the market.

 

In my mind and being a car nut, the new F150 Lightning electric appears on the streets in 2022.  An electric model of the most popular vehicle sales wise year end and year out.   That to me has the potential of being a game changer.   When the auto was first invented, there were a lot of companies trying for that market.   There are more than a handful now trying to grasp the electric market.  We will see how things unfold because the issue still is the batteries how much range, how to dispose etc.   Read also the news clippings about containing a car fire in an electric car-thousands of gallons of water.

 

We are headed in an electric direction, I just don't see clarity on the pathway yet.        

I ordered a Cybertruck, but given the waiting time, I will probably switch to an F150 lightning. What worries me is the limited towing distance that I may have to deal with.

[dry net]

1 hour ago, rolmops said:

If there is anything at all ,that I believe in . It is the creativeness of bureaucracy to invent new taxes to hit Jo Shmo just so it hurts a little but without killing the goose that lays the golden eggs.

On the other hand, think about all the gasoline tax that you will not have to pay anymore.

Over the road taxes will never go away, they will just come up with another name for it.